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Tinkerntom
 
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No Spam wrote:
Thanks all for your posts. I'm doing some reading now and will be

sure to
post when I have started building - something. I am finding it hard

to
decide against the beauty of the One Ocean boat but the pure utility

of a
folder has a very strong pull. What a great problem to have - many

wonderful
designs to choose from!

Ken

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

John Fereira wrote:
Following up to both posts.

"Tinkerntom" wrote in

news:1110685668.227862.222450
@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:


No Spam wrote:
Big snip---

Hey Tom, have you seen the Yost boats in person? I found his

web
site
very intriguing. I have been wanting to do a stitch and glue

from
One
Ocean but have not started yet and the idea of a boat that I

could
easily take on a family vacation has me thinking about trying

that
one
first. I just would like to have an opinion from someone that

has
eyeballed or better yet paddled one of these boats. If I

remember
correctly you have a folding boat from one of the

manufacturers
right?

Someone local built one (I think it was the Sea Rover) and I even

got
the
chance to paddle it a bit (while he paddled my cedar strip Outer

Island). I
liked how it paddled but he wasn't quite finished with it. He

hadn't
built
the wood floor yet so the hull flexed much more than it should

have.
As a
result, the hull would flex when making a tight low brace or bow

rudder turn
and make the boat spin on a dime. However, when trying to roll

it,
the boat
would flex when I hip-snapped the middle of the boat would lift.

I
had to
really slow down the roll or perform a layback, and without the

wood
floor
it was a bit uncomfortable laying back against the cockpit

combing.
It also
had a couple of leaks that the builder hadn't fixed yet so it got

real
slugish after a few deep edged turns.


I do not plan on rolling my Super, though some double mens team

have
demonstrated rollong the newer Greenland II. They had to really

work
hard to get it to go over, and with the spray skirts kept most of

the
water out. Then what we do is have a bilge pump (Manual and

Electric)
to pump out the water that may get in. This is good also if you

have a
slow leak. Yost boast are much smaller volume I believe, and

tighter
combing, so I don't think he worries so much about bilge water.

Ralph Diaz, admits that he is terrible at rolling, having never had

to
learn until recently. Then he used a hard shell, and still does not
expect to roll SOF. The northern native cultures obyiously have
learned, and taught the Euro hard shell crowd the "eskimoe roll",

but
in RL, rolling is a survival technique since most of them do not

know
how to swim from what I have read, and wet exits are not an

alternative
in the extremely cold Arctic water. They design their boats to stay
upright, and not as roll toys! Though they excel in boat handling

and
this includes 30 some different types of rolls.

The flex is something that bagboaters learn to expect, and actually
desire as it gives you a better feel for the water. In heavy seas,

the
boat does not fight the water so much as a hard shell, and

especially
under these conditions, can out perform hard shell. I have read
accounts of a mix of boats paddling together, and when the seas get
higher, the bagboat will pull away from the hard shells to the

surprise
of the hard shell crowd, and the delight of the bagboater!



Do you find that it is capable of taking the abuse of hitting

bottom
now and again? Do you use float bags or a sea sock?

I would probably go with float bags although finding some that

would
fit
such a low volume boat (or a sea sock for that matter) might be

difficult.
They could probably be made though.


I have probably 10 different flotation bags, plus all gear is in

sealed
dry bags, and all are strapped in for load stability; flotation at

the
top of the load. Most don't use sea socks, since if you get water

in
sock, you have to get out of it to dump, unless you pump. They also
restrict movement within cockpit.


Ken

I'm in favor of that darkside metamorphosis, Yost being a

neighbor
of mine here in Denver, and him making some dandy boats.

Though
I
don't know whether riverman is inclined to the hobby

craftsmen
aspect of building your own, besides having the time between

now
and
going to, is it HK. TnT


I have corresponded with him, about getting together, but have

yet
to
do so. He is real approachable and glad to talk boats.

I also corresponded wth Tom a bit and he assured me that the

problems
I had
with the boat I paddled were due to the construction, not the

design.
I may
have to build one to find out how it's *supposed* to paddle.



Most of the Bagboaters put sacrificial strips on the hull along

the
longerons to take the abuse. I recently found some special PVC

tape
that I am going to try using. It comes with some very sticky

waterproof
adhesive, is UV resistant, and is solid 10 mil thick. Most

packing
tape
is 1 or 2 mil, so gives you an idea, and there is not cloth

backing
like duct tape.

You got a source for that tape? If I build one I might want to

use
some as
well.


The tape is pipe wrapping tape, and should be available from

plumbing
supply. It is used for wraping underground pipes. I found mine on

Ebay,
at Toolprice.com.

Some of the guys have used the duct tape which is good
for about a season, and then you replace it.

Most of the newer boats use a Hypalon hull which is probably

tougher,
but is also a little more involved to work on. Most of the guys

seem to
be really happy with it, and say it should last 30-40 years.

I've seen a few original Folbots that were 30 years old.

Some of the newer Folbots, are comparable to Hard shell, and

the
Feathercraft I've heard, actually will out perform some of the

high
end
sea kayaks.

I paddled a Feathercraft Khastlano about 5 years ago and liked it

quite a
bit though I don't know about it out performing a hardshell.

Some
claim
that the flex in the hull makes it more seaworthy in rough seas

than
a
hardshell. The Khastlano is also something like $4,000.


There is a Yahoo group for Bagboaters where they talk about all

this
stuff. They tend to be orientated to trying all kinds of

modifications
since the platform is very flexible and frindly to us Tinkers!

TnT

Ralph Diaz frequently posts to the Paddlewise mailing list as

well as

another Ralph from somewhere in Europe that promotes the Pouch

Boats.

R. Diaz is not as active posting as he use to be, but there are

lots of
his articles available on line, and in bookstores. His material is
considered the Reference for bagboaters. TnT


One thing that appeals to me about Yost Boats, is the cost; time and
money! He claims that once set up, he builds one in less than 2 weeks.
That compared to building anything else is amazing. The cost is also
kept under $400 US.

The SOF is typically made for your specific biometrics, in the
tradition of the native Arctic Americans. I don't know that the first
one you would want to vary to much from standard design, but for the
cost, you could build a number of boats, till you get it right. Then
you would literally wear it, with out a lot of cockpit padding, and it
would become an extension of your self, and your design requirements.

I know, I have feasted my eyes on his website, for many hours, and just
the idea of building a SOF, gets under skin so to speak. TnT