On 13-Oct-2005, "KMAN" wrote:

It's about learning - you seem to think
people can only learn with professional instruction.

Please quote a single message from me where I have said anything
of the sort.

I can't
imagine how boring and even frightening life must be if there is nothing you
think possible without an "expert" to guide you.

Nothing boring or frightening about my life. I don't need an expert for
everything, but know the value of an expert when I need it. I know when
it's a waste of time to reinvent the wheel. I have never learned anything
in a vacuum and am honest enough to admit it. I learn from others - just
as you do but can't seem to admit.

All I have
said is that it is entirely possible to learn to kayak well and safely
without a professional instructor. Do you disagree?

Possible - yes. It is entirely possible to learn the same from a non-
professional instructor. I have never said otherwise. I have said that
is is unlikely that someone can learn without _any_ instruction in a
reasonable period of time. Most will never learn kayaking - especially
whitewater - to a reasonable skill level without any instruction.

If you refuse to answer yet again, I think it would be fair to assume that
you don't have the evidence.

Again - please post a quote from me where I have made any such claim that you
ask me to prove. You are asking me to prove your statements, not mine.

You are the one that is making the claims that aren't supportable. You
insist on relying on anecdote without specifying the source. You make
blowhard claims about beating the experts without training.

Mike