On 30 Aug 2003 21:18:17 -0500, noah wrote:

When I first found rec.boats, I was thrilled (it doesn't take much
anymore) at the idea of "fellow boaters" to talk with.

Soon after, after wading through the political and personal bashing, I
mentioned this in the group, and was told (about 3:1), to "get used to
it". I have.

I have researched the rec.boats Charter and,basically, the founders
never anticipated that the group would be used for anything *but*
boating posts, therefore did not include any language concerning OT
posts. C'est dommage.

Noah, I'm sure you know my feelings on this matter from reading my (probably
too-long) about the "political" threads. Someone recently asked, "Aren't there
groups chartered for discussing politics?" and the answer came back, "Sure--but
when you go into a politics discussion group, they know when you're blowing
smoke out your ass." Or words to that effect.

I thought that was a very perceptive observation--and an accurate one. I've
seen many, many posts here--from both extremes of the political spectrum--that
display a truly appalling level of ignorance. I'm not going to throw stones on
someone because they hold opinions based on faulty data or fallacious
reasoning--but these discussions invariable descend into namecalling and
ill-will.

Rec.boats is an unmoderated newsgroup, but those who seem driven to start and
continue these acrimonious threads ought to keep in mind that in so doing, they
create a certain kind of atmosphere--a "vibe"--in the newsgroup that can be very
off putting. In the several years that I've been participating to one extent or
another, I've had the experience of having to rework a favorable impression of
someone because of some statement that was mean spirited, hateful or ignorant.
Those kinds of statements seem to appear *only* in the context of these
political discussions.

Believe it or not, there are good, honorable, intelligent and well informed
people on both sides of the political spectrum. Unfortunately, you wouldn't
know that from most of the "political" argument here (I write "political" that
way because these discussions have long since ceased to be about politics).

Absent a moderator, the only way this situation is going to change is by
implementing the solution of a separate rec.boats.lounge newsgroup where
anything goes; the common denominator would be that the combatants...er,
participants would own, like to own, or know someone who owns or would like to
own a boat.

Agreeing to "OT" designations typically doesn't work, because 1) some
newsreaders strip out the "OT"; and 2) Some people will feel as though they'll
lose their audience if they have to designate their posts that way.

If there was enough of a consensus about this kind of solution, then it would be
a matter of getting everyone to suggest (gently) that flagrantly non-boating
articles belong in the companion newsgroup.

I'll help in this effort whatever way I can.

Joe Parsons

I admit to joining the OT posts now and then. It's like a "free
brunch". How can you resist? ) Sometimes, they are interesting.

As regular posters to this group, would you support an amendment to
the FAQ requiring that the letters "OT" precede any off-topic post?
This would not limit any discussion, but would enable the boating
purists to filter the background noise. The political warriors would
remain free to eviscerate each other.

As it stands, some do, some don't, "OT". Some posters have left the
group, or have become "lurkers", because they are annoyed and
frustrated with the OT postings. Perhaps a compromise is appropriate?

I can appreciate the idea that rec.boats is like "the bar at the yacht
club". I can also understand the plight of the weekend boater who
comes here looking for boating info, and finds reps and dems ripping
each others viscerals out. Viscerals are good, especially with garlic
and wine sauce, but this isn't a cooking newsgroup.

Is it worth the minimal effort to try to resolve these differences? I
think so, but then again, I married my ex-wife. My judgement is
suspect.

I would appreciate the comments of the entire group on this issue.

Regards,
noah