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Hull Flexing
Yes, thanks. In article , The_navigator© wrote: Well? Cheers MC The_navigator© wrote: But the boat is not solid steel is it? Cheers MC Peter Wiley wrote: Actually quite a few sailboats *are* much more rigid than you seem to know. You're taking your experience on plastic boats and assuming it is generally applicable. The flex in a steel or ferrocement hull is certainly there (everything flexes to some degree), but it's a fraction of what is common in lightweight toy racing boats which are built to minimal standards of seaworthiness and do, indeed, flex. In fact, the toy boats often break when coming off a fairly moderate wave, as recent Sydney-Hobart races have shown so well. The remark about water being much less compressible than the boat is pure & utter bull****. Even frozen water is a lot more compressible than steel. Also has lower shear strength, tensile strength etc. As to measurement of a boat to 0.005", I can easily believe that this is possible. It's not even all that difficult. Whether there's any point and whether the measurement is repeatable are different issues. Peter Wiley In article , The_navigator© wrote: That boats are built differently has nothing to do with it. Sail boats are not rigid nor even near it. To be as rigid as you suggest would probably mean they would not float. If you had ever been in a real boat beating to windward your would know they are *not* rigid. Put your hand on the forstay and look at it unloading when she buries her bow and look at it going tight on the crest (that's revealed by the luff bending). It's loading up/unloading because the boat is flexing. If you ever get the chance (assuming that any boat owner could put up with your big mouth and BS) have a good hard look at the hull of a boat pounding hard to windward and look and feel hull panels flexing. The boat needs has to flex to reduce impact loadings because water is much less compressable than the boat. Once again you reveal your lack of experience with big boats by suggesting otherwise. This typifies your inability to grasp even simple ideas. As for measurent of a boat to 5 thou, look at the coefficent of expansion of say GRP or even Al (which expands muchg less) and then tell me how much a boat moves during a typical day/night temperature cycle. Now you want to tell me it's easy to measure a 5 thou deflection over a 40' boat? Even if the boat builder had access to interferometric equipment (which I'm sure they did not use -as there would be no point in such an accurate measurement) it would still be hard. If you think it's so easy how come you need a 'crew'. Lets face it this is yet more Doug Kig (I'm a ****ing hero) BS. Have'nt you ever wonder why you don't make more money -after all, you are such an expert... My point is that Ella is not a large racing boat and yet still has more than 1 ton rig tension. Cheers MC DSK wrote: The navigator© wrote: I'd say It's BS because boats are simply not that rigid Oh yeah, and all boats are built to the same structural standard, aren't they. and it's hard to measure to an accuracy of 4 thou on big objects. Now that is total BS. It costs, but if you're willing to pay, I'll bring a crew and and gear, and show you how to measure movement in any axis on objects of any size & orientation down to 5 ten thousands +/- 1 It's part of what I do for a living, thanks very much. The NIST has occasionally asked me for advice on this type of thing. .... Even Ella has a backstay tension of 2,500 lbs when beating. Gee, and there's no difference between "2500#" and 15,000# is there? Why do I bother answering your posts? DSK |
Hull Flexing
Just what I remebered. It could be something to do with an interaction
with the oxide layer couldn't it? Cheers MC Capetanios Oz wrote: On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 13:48:50 +1300, The_navigator© wrote: I thought 552 was recommended for Al. Cheers MC Looked it up, Can't see any specific reference to ally http://www.sikaindustry.com/tds-ipd-sf552-us.pdf and 292 looks pretty much the same http://www.sikaindustry.com/tds-ipd-SF292-oem-us.pdf Oz1...of the 3 twins. I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you. |
Hull Flexing
Peter Wiley wrote: snip Be nice to see a light schooner on the Derwent. Be nice to see one full stop. I think I'll bring Flying Tadpole II home from Pt Augusta, where she's not getting used, clean her up and see if I can flog her off. ALl my sailing gets done now in Lady Kate, and I'd love to see some youthful 40 y.o. campaign Flying Tadpole II again and set the picnic race scene quivering in horror once more. It's a whole new generation. Even the skiffie skippers I once knew have grown huge rumguts and inhabitat ancient trailer sailers now... -- Flying Tadpole ------------------------- Learn what lies below the waves of cyberspace! http://www.internetopera.netfirms.com |
Hull Flexing
In article , Flying Tadpole
wrote: Peter Wiley wrote: snip Be nice to see a light schooner on the Derwent. Be nice to see one full stop. I think I'll bring Flying Tadpole II home from Pt Augusta, where she's not getting used, clean her up and see if I can flog her off. ALl my sailing gets done now in Lady Kate, and I'd love to see some youthful 40 y.o. campaign Flying Tadpole II again and set the picnic race scene quivering in horror once more. It's a whole new generation. Even the skiffie skippers I once knew have grown huge rumguts and inhabitat ancient trailer sailers now... Ah well, you get that with age & lack of maintenance. I've been shovelling sand & gravel for my slab base - get fit campaign after 8 weeks doing nothing except work/eat/sleep/eat/eat/work etc during which time I put on 2 kg. I'm getting hassled about putting my daysailer in the water, just been pricing a new 2-3HP o/board for it. The Honda 4 stroke is only (IIRC) 13kg so it might get the nod. I'll happily leave my boat on the foreshore but leaving the motor as well is pushing my luck, even if I can see it from my window. |
Hull Flexing
Peter Wiley wrote: Ah well, you get that with age & lack of maintenance. I've been shovelling sand & gravel for my slab base - get fit campaign after 8 weeks doing nothing except work/eat/sleep/eat/eat/work etc during which time I put on 2 kg. I'm getting hassled about putting my daysailer in the water, just been pricing a new 2-3HP o/board for it. The Honda 4 stroke is only (IIRC) 13kg so it might get the nod. I'll happily leave my boat on the foreshore but leaving the motor as well is pushing my luck, even if I can see it from my window. Pair of cheapie wheels, a wooden strongback, a step and a couple of occy straps and trundle the motor hom. You could put the wheels on the boat too... -- Flying Tadpole ------------------------- Learn what lies below the waves of cyberspace! http://www.internetopera.netfirms.com |
Hull Flexing
Hey Peter! Welcome back! My penguin still has not arrived by UPS...did =
you pack enough ice and fish with it? --=20 katysails s/v Chanteuse Kirie Elite 32 http://katysails.tripod.com "Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein |
Hull Flexing
Peter Wiley wrote:
... I don't have any problems with people owning lightweight plastic boats - they do go fast and point high, plus you get lots of exercise changing headsails with each 5 knot wind change. Just that nobody should think they're good for much else. Agreed, but with reservations. You mention a friend who just bought a ferrocement cruiser on the cheap, what would you think if instead, he'd bought a newer former racing of the same capacity, for half the price he paid for the FC job? DOn't know about over there, but in the US there is no market at all for retired racers and they are going begging. Some are cheesy junk, true, but some have great potential as cruisers IMHO. It just requires some knowledge & judgement to pick among them, as with anything else (cars, women, power tools, etc etc). Fresh Breezes- Doug King |
Hull Flexing
The navigator© wrote:
Bwhhahahahahhahaa. What an intelligent reply. No wonder it's one of your favorites, did you teach it to Boobsprit? But you don't know anything as you've not posted a single fact. Actually, I've posted lots of facts. Not even heresay really. I say again, all 40' racing boats deflect more than 5 thou with a 10,000 kg backstay tension. And I say again, all boats are built the same, aren't they? .....I just said you were BSing as usual -and you still are. So now you know about yacht structural design? I know what I've read, and what I've seen. Did you do a course in Naval Architecture in your imagination too? No, did you? DSK |
Hull Flexing... dammit Tadpole!
I just ruined a keyboard
Flying Tadpole wrote: You mean, you want a heroic ode, based on the poor elephant seal, cumbersome and easily attacked by vicious sealers on land, speedy and graceful on/in the water, but nevertheless doomed by its liberal outlook and engineering limitations? |
Hull Flexing
"More than" is not a single number dummy. I though you said you'd studied?
Cheers MC DSK wrote: Not even heresay really. I say again, all 40' racing boats deflect more than 5 thou with a 10,000 kg backstay tension. And I say again, all boats are built the same, aren't they? |
Hull Flexing
No, I did a real one.
Cheers MC DSK wrote: Did you do a course in Naval Architecture in your imagination too? No, did you? |
Hull Flexing
The navigator© wrote: No, I did a real one. Is that where they taught you that 2500 = 15,000? Or is that where you learned that all boats have equal structural rigidity? Did you ever look up the difference between ring frames & monocoque construction? DSK |
Hull Flexing
DSK wrote: The navigator© wrote: No, I did a real one. Is that where they taught you that 2500 = 15,000? If you are asking, I'd say 15,0002500. But then I know how small 5 thou is. Or is that where you learned that all boats have equal structural rigidity? I never said that. I placed a _lower limit_ on likely deflection. You do understand that engineering concept don't you? Did you ever look up the difference between ring frames & monocoque construction? Actually it was discussed at some length. Pure monocoques are unsuitable for large boats where point loads become too large. At that point webbing or similar must be used to spread the point load. It's kind of amusing that yuou have to try to put words into my mouth to try to recover from your BS. Cheers MC DSK |
Hull Flexing
Did you ever look up the difference between ring
frames & monocoque construction? The navigator© wrote: Actually it was discussed at some length. Where? By whom? It's kind of amusing that yuou have to try to put words into my mouth to try to recover from your BS. Try that shoe on the other foot, you've got it on backwards. I don't need to do anything other than quote your words directly, they are amusing enough. DSK |
Hull Flexing
"Capt. Mooron" wrote: Now what pray tell has changed about my recent posts? Have I not always sought to be equally obnoxious to all of you? Have I not tried to make certain each of you is given their due attention? Well, I have been feeling a little bit neglected lately... ;-) Or is it that you can dish it out but you can't take it? CM What did you have in mind? lol LP |
Hull Flexing
Please go away or take it to private e-mail.
We don't want your pathetic gushing here. S.Simon "Lady Pilot" wrote in message news:X%gtb.25$po2.24@okepread02... "Capt. Mooron" wrote: Now what pray tell has changed about my recent posts? Have I not always sought to be equally obnoxious to all of you? Have I not tried to make certain each of you is given their due attention? Well, I have been feeling a little bit neglected lately... ;-) Or is it that you can dish it out but you can't take it? CM What did you have in mind? lol LP |
Hull Flexing
"Simple Simon" wrote: Please go away or take it to private e-mail. We don't want your pathetic gushing here. Sure you do, but only if it was directed to you... Now quit your whining or I'll have to take the burdizzo clamps after you. LP :-) LP |
Hull Flexing
"Lady Pilot" wrote in message | What did you have in mind? lol .... a Muskox hide... deliriously soft and comfortable... the sensation that can only be appreciated on actual contact. It envelopes you in warmth, luxury and delicious sensuality. An ice bucket stuffed with champagne and the primal fervor evoked from a crackling fire... hypnotic and evoking. An ice age cold that encompasses the wilderness, staved by the penetrating warmth of a gentle caress. Wicked nothings whispered against the wind's howling screams of protest beyond the log cabin door. Sensations, Seductions and Sweet excess! To be nowhere and everywhere..... See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more at one! CM |
Hull Flexing
"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ... "Lady Pilot" wrote in message | What did you have in mind? lol ... a Muskox hide... deliriously soft and comfortable... the sensation that can only be appreciated on actual contact. It envelopes you in warmth, luxury and delicious sensuality. An ice bucket stuffed with champagne and the primal fervor evoked from a crackling fire... hypnotic and evoking. An ice age cold that encompasses the wilderness, staved by the penetrating warmth of a gentle caress. Wicked nothings whispered against the wind's howling screams of protest beyond the log cabin door. Sensations, Seductions and Sweet excess! To be nowhere and everywhere..... Oh my, I think I'm in love! See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more at one! Yes, and I have recharged my batteries as well... Sometimes I feel like I'm trying to steer the ship with the anchor set. LP |
Hull Flexing
See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once =
more at one! You're really bizarre, ya know.... --=20 katysails s/v Chanteuse Kirie Elite 32 http://katysails.tripod.com "Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein |
Hull Flexing
What's a burdizzo clamp?
"Lady Pilot" wrote in message news:Ruhtb.21$MV5.19@okepread05... Now quit your whining or I'll have to take the burdizzo clamps after you. |
Hull Flexing
Sickening, just plain sickening . . .
"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ... ... a Muskox hide... deliriously soft and comfortable... the sensation that can only be appreciated on actual contact. It envelopes you in warmth, luxury and delicious sensuality. An ice bucket stuffed with champagne and the primal fervor evoked from a crackling fire... hypnotic and evoking. An ice age cold that encompasses the wilderness, staved by the penetrating warmth of a gentle caress. Wicked nothings whispered against the wind's howling screams of protest beyond the log cabin door. Sensations, Seductions and Sweet excess! To be nowhere and everywhere..... See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more at one! CM |
Hull Flexing
Capt Mooron wrote:
See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more at one! "katysails" wrote:. You're really bizarre, ya know.... Sorry, Katy. That was from a private e-mail and you weren't supposed to get it,,, LP ( I got it) |
Hull Flexing
Have you ever heard of www.google.com ?
LP (doesn't have the time to explain) "Simple Simon" wrote: What's a burdizzo clamp? "Lady Pilot" wrote: Now quit your whining or I'll have to take the burdizzo clamps after you. |
Hull Flexing
I'm afraid they don't make 'em big enough for me . . .
"Lady Pilot" wrote in message news:LFhtb.3$n23.1@okepread02... Have you ever heard of www.google.com ? LP (doesn't have the time to explain) "Simple Simon" wrote: What's a burdizzo clamp? "Lady Pilot" wrote: Now quit your whining or I'll have to take the burdizzo clamps after you. |
Hull Flexing
Yes Kitty... but a good bizarre! A very, very, good Bizarre!
Intrigue & Intensity. Half Measures are for Half Men. CM "katysails" wrote in message ... See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more at one! You're really bizarre, ya know.... -- katysails s/v Chanteuse Kirie Elite 32 http://katysails.tripod.com "Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein |
Hull Flexing
"Simple Simon" wrote: I'm afraid they don't make 'em big enough for me . . . Why would you think your hull couldn't flex anymore? LP |
Hull Flexing
Come on now Neal... you wish you were this good! ;-)
CM "Simple Simon" wrote in message ... | Sickening, just plain sickening . . . | | | "Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ... | | ... a Muskox hide... deliriously soft and comfortable... the sensation that | can only be appreciated on actual contact. It envelopes you in warmth, | luxury and delicious sensuality. An ice bucket stuffed with champagne and | the primal fervor evoked from a crackling fire... hypnotic and evoking. An | ice age cold that encompasses the wilderness, staved by the penetrating | warmth of a gentle caress. Wicked nothings whispered against the wind's | howling screams of protest beyond the log cabin door. Sensations, Seductions | and Sweet excess! | | To be nowhere and everywhere..... | | See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more | at one! | | CM | | | | |
Hull Flexing
And only pathetic, sniveling men prostitute themselves with the kind of crap you wrote there. It's enough to make a buzzard puke. S.Simon "Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ... Yes Kitty... but a good bizarre! A very, very, good Bizarre! Intrigue & Intensity. Half Measures are for Half Men. CM "katysails" wrote in message ... See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more at one! You're really bizarre, ya know.... -- katysails s/v Chanteuse Kirie Elite 32 http://katysails.tripod.com "Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein |
Hull Flexing
I've a strong stomach but I'd certainly wretch
before writing something half that stupid. . . Even a desperate wench like LP can't help but see the kind of female desperation that you demonstrated. What a loser you turned out to be. Yes, sir. A disgrace to the name of sailor all the way. S.Simon "Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ... Come on now Neal... you wish you were this good! ;-) CM "Simple Simon" wrote in message ... | Sickening, just plain sickening . . . | | | "Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ... | | ... a Muskox hide... deliriously soft and comfortable... the sensation that | can only be appreciated on actual contact. It envelopes you in warmth, | luxury and delicious sensuality. An ice bucket stuffed with champagne and | the primal fervor evoked from a crackling fire... hypnotic and evoking. An | ice age cold that encompasses the wilderness, staved by the penetrating | warmth of a gentle caress. Wicked nothings whispered against the wind's | howling screams of protest beyond the log cabin door. Sensations, Seductions | and Sweet excess! | | To be nowhere and everywhere..... | | See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more | at one! | | CM | | | | |
Hull Flexing
"Simple Simon" wrote: I've a strong stomach but I'd certainly wretch before writing something half that stupid. . . Even a desperate wench like LP can't help but see the kind of female desperation that you demonstrated. What a loser you turned out to be. Yes, sir. A disgrace to the name of sailor all the way. S.Simon Excuse me, butthead... You don't even have a clue what's going on here...so why do you *pretend* ??? I know I hurt your feelings and you feel like you are rejected, but it's not my fault. LP (still trying to capture the elusive Capt. Mooron) |
Hull Flexing
"Simple Simon" wrote: And only pathetic, sniveling men prostitute themselves with the kind of crap you wrote there. You don't have a romantic bone in your body, do you, Neal? LP (be honest now, Neal) |
Hull Flexing
You sniveling frustrated little man!..... when will you ever learn to coax
your environment to suit your interests instead of having your environment coax you into a state of submission. I am what I present myself to be....... can you say the same? Honesty in action... why can't you see the truth in that? CM "Simple Simon" wrote in message ... | | And only pathetic, sniveling men prostitute themselves | with the kind of crap you wrote there. | | It's enough to make a buzzard puke. | | S.Simon | | "Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ... | Yes Kitty... but a good bizarre! A very, very, good Bizarre! | | Intrigue & Intensity. Half Measures are for Half Men. | | CM | | "katysails" wrote in message | ... | See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more | at one! | | You're really bizarre, ya know.... | | -- | katysails | s/v Chanteuse | Kirie Elite 32 | http://katysails.tripod.com | | "Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax | and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein | | | | |
Hull Flexing
See what happens when the sea mends me in her icy grip..... I am once more at one! At one what? Why settle for one anyway? -- Flying Tadpole ------------------------- Learn what lies below the waves of cyberspace! http://www.internetopera.netfirms.com |
Hull Flexing
Intrigue & Intensity
That's what you call it, eh? (somwhat glad he confines himself to the = icy North...) --=20 katysails s/v Chanteuse Kirie Elite 32 http://katysails.tripod.com "Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein |
Hull Flexing
I'm a very romantic person but I keep it in private
where it belongs. Public displays of romance are sinful, shallow, scurrilous, stupid and tawdry. Grown people should know better. You and Mooron are both pathetic examples of unprincipled people. S.Simon "Lady Pilot" wrote in message news:H6itb.10$n23.9@okepread02... "Simple Simon" wrote: And only pathetic, sniveling men prostitute themselves with the kind of crap you wrote there. You don't have a romantic bone in your body, do you, Neal? LP (be honest now, Neal) |
Hull Flexing
It's very easy to see what's going on - two people
making asses out of themselves in public. A couple of exhibitionists who are so insecure in their personal lives that they cannot distinguish between reality and fantasy. Like I said - just plain pathetic. Losers on display . . . S.Simon "Lady Pilot" wrote in message news:K5itb.9$n23.2@okepread02... "Simple Simon" wrote: I've a strong stomach but I'd certainly wretch before writing something half that stupid. . . Even a desperate wench like LP can't help but see the kind of female desperation that you demonstrated. What a loser you turned out to be. Yes, sir. A disgrace to the name of sailor all the way. S.Simon Excuse me, butthead... You don't even have a clue what's going on here...so why do you *pretend* ??? I know I hurt your feelings and you feel like you are rejected, but it's not my fault. LP (still trying to capture the elusive Capt. Mooron) |
Hull Flexing
For once I must agree with you. Nothing worse than watching two queers
sucking face, or anything else. -- Oz1...twin of the 3 twins "Simple Simon" wrote in message ... I'm a very romantic person but I keep it in private where it belongs. Public displays of romance are sinful, shallow, scurrilous, stupid and tawdry. Grown people should know better. You and Mooron are both pathetic examples of unprincipled people. S.Simon "Lady Pilot" wrote in message news:H6itb.10$n23.9@okepread02... "Simple Simon" wrote: And only pathetic, sniveling men prostitute themselves with the kind of crap you wrote there. You don't have a romantic bone in your body, do you, Neal? LP (be honest now, Neal) |
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Absolutely right with respect to queers sucking face in
public. But, what's good for the goose is good for the gander. Queers could not holler discrimination if straights would cease and desist with the public displays of affection. It's not that the faggots are doing anything wrong. It's the straights who have been setting the bad example. Until straights realize this and stop with the unnecessary and tawdry displays why should the gayboys be restricted? S.Simon "Capetanios Oz Twin" wrote in message . .. For once I must agree with you. Nothing worse than watching two queers sucking face, or anything else. -- Oz1...twin of the 3 twins "Simple Simon" wrote in message ... I'm a very romantic person but I keep it in private where it belongs. Public displays of romance are sinful, shallow, scurrilous, stupid and tawdry. Grown people should know better. You and Mooron are both pathetic examples of unprincipled people. S.Simon "Lady Pilot" wrote in message news:H6itb.10$n23.9@okepread02... "Simple Simon" wrote: And only pathetic, sniveling men prostitute themselves with the kind of crap you wrote there. You don't have a romantic bone in your body, do you, Neal? LP (be honest now, Neal) |
Hull Flexing
you have a 2 or 4 battery vibrator?
"Lady Pilot" wrote ... Yes, and I have recharged my batteries as well... |
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