Crap'n Neal® wrote:
Those who can 'afford' an inboard engine are plagued
with diesel oil smell no matter what.

Wrong, as usual.

If the fuel system has no leaks (and why should it have any, other than
stupidity and/or incompetence) then where is the diesel smell going to
come from?

Your statement just shows that you don't know much, and don't have any
friends who know better.

DSK

Hello Capt. Neal,

It is in a sail boat but like most sail boats it's size there are auxiliary
engines. But I will try a motor boat forum to get a few more opinions.
Thanks for the idea!

In the past with my old, small sailboat I would pick up my mooring under
sail at times. Why bother to start the engine when you do not need to and I
did enjoy the challenge. Now I keep my new to me boat at my dock and I have
found it very hard to dock under sail. Maybe you can give me a few
pointers? I will say I love the handling under power with the wide spaced
twin engines. Kind of makes me feel like I am cheating.

Mark


"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...
I have to wonder what this discussion has to do with sailing.

May I suggest taking it to a motor boat forum.

Thank you for your consideration of those of us who
wish to discuss sailing here on this sailing forum..

Capt. Neal


"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
plugster wrote:
The diesel fuel tank on my boat is in the center of my boat just
forward of
the mast and the engines are in the back so the fuel lines pass
through the
cabin. There are no fuel leaks, the lines are made from a gray rubber
and
smell strongly of the diesel fuel. The boat is 6 years old.

I'd bet the fuel lines are not an ABS-ABYC approved type for fuel.
Proper fuel line is expensive, but it lasts considerably more than 6
years.

... The runs are
about 45 feet and they do a fair amount of twists and turns. I am
thinking
about replacing them with soft metal tubing, maybe copper (Home Depot
water
tubing) or 3003-0 aluminum (aircraft grade fuel line).

Don't use aluminum on a boat. It corrodes far too quickly and is more
difficult to make up joints. Ask me how I know!

Refrigeration grade copper tubing (type L or M IIRC but check the specs)
is acceptable as fuel line... but it's difficult to install properly.
Unless you can rip out all obstacles, you have to snake it into place
and then mount it properly (it will work harden with vibration, and then
leak no matter what) and make up the terminal connections. This takes a
lot of time and careful work.


...Of course I will
leave a short flexible part near the engine for vibration.

You might as well go with the more expensive fuel hose for the whole
run. I'd recommend that, and I just did a somewhat shorter simpler job
on our trawler this past spring. Of course I work with tubing (HP air &
hydraulics, among other things) almost daily so the joint connections
were not a problem.

It'll cost more in dollars for material but take far less time & trouble
to install, and will be far less likely to leak due to bad joining.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Crap'n Neal® wrote:
I guarantee it is impossible to change fuel filters and
clean fuel separators without spilling at least a few
drops.

What, you never heard of "cleaning up"?

http://community.webshots.com/photo/...42006181AIYIHF

If you have a proper installation, it will be easily possible to
minimize & contain any spilled fuel.


... Also, all diesel tanks must have a vent and there
is a smell emanating from the vent

which is outside the boat.

... not to mention very
small leaks on the plumbing going to and from the injectors.

It is fully possible to have a system that does not leak. In some cases
where the injector system has a linkage that slightly weeps a bit of
fuel, it is also fully possible to clean it up regularly.



Diesel fuel is dirty and smelly and boats that contain
diesel engines smell like diesel and that's a fact.

Ours doesn't. None of our friends boats do either. So it is not a fact.

The *only* reason for a boat to smell like diesel is sloppiness.... a
sloppy installation that leaks, or or sloppy maintenance, or lack of
cleanliness.

Your expertise includes all three.

DSK

Why is that Dave? Motorboats have masts too.

CN


"Dave" wrote in message ...
On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 18:25:38 -0500, Capt. Neal® said:

My mistake, since it's a sailboat I guess you sorta squeak in
under the umbrella.

The "just forward of the mast" in the original post might have been a clue.

I don't see any drips, runs or errors but that white peg board???

Ugly! What's with that?

CN


"DSK" wrote in message . ..
Crap'n Neal® wrote:
I guarantee it is impossible to change fuel filters and
clean fuel separators without spilling at least a few
drops.

What, you never heard of "cleaning up"?

http://community.webshots.com/photo/...42006181AIYIHF

If you have a proper installation, it will be easily possible to
minimize & contain any spilled fuel.


... Also, all diesel tanks must have a vent and there
is a smell emanating from the vent

which is outside the boat.

... not to mention very
small leaks on the plumbing going to and from the injectors.

It is fully possible to have a system that does not leak. In some cases
where the injector system has a linkage that slightly weeps a bit of
fuel, it is also fully possible to clean it up regularly.



Diesel fuel is dirty and smelly and boats that contain
diesel engines smell like diesel and that's a fact.

Ours doesn't. None of our friends boats do either. So it is not a fact.

The *only* reason for a boat to smell like diesel is sloppiness.... a
sloppy installation that leaks, or or sloppy maintenance, or lack of
cleanliness.

Your expertise includes all three.

DSK

On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 16:08:08 -0500, Capt. Neal®
wrote this crap:

Those who can 'afford' an inboard engine are plagued
with diesel oil smell no matter what. (Unless they use
gasoline).


Bull****. My boat doesn't smell. Most boats don't.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

How could anyone like you with nostrils burned
out by the white powder smell anything anyway?

CN

"Horvath" wrote in message ...
On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 16:08:08 -0500, Capt. Neal®
wrote this crap:

Those who can 'afford' an inboard engine are plagued
with diesel oil smell no matter what. (Unless they use
gasoline).


Bull****. My boat doesn't smell. Most boats don't.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

You are probably right. . .

CN

"Dave" wrote in message ...
On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 18:36:25 -0500, Capt. Neal® said:

Why is that Dave? Motorboats have masts too.

Well, one alternative might have been to ask, before making an ass of
yourself by assuming that someone in a sailing group marking the position of
his fuel tank with reference to the mast must have a power boat.

I was told by my surveyor to use type A-1 hose for fuel lines. it's
supposed to 'melt' (or something like that) and seal itself in a fire
, thus preventing fuel from feeding the fire.


--
Scott Vernon
Plowville Pa _/)__/)_/)_


"plugster" wrote in message
ink.net...
Thanks for the information. I will check to see if the original
hose was
rated for diesel fuel.

Do you have a good source for diesel rated hose? West Marine has
USCG and
NMMA approved hose but I would like to make sure there is no smell
at all.
Maybe I should go with the refrigeration grade copper. I think that
I can
make the run with one piece per side but it will be very difficult.
The
current hose is very well mounted and I think I can use the same
system
again.

I have never been on a boat that did not smell of Diesel that was so
equipped. I think I have a chance with metal lines.

Thanks
Mark

"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
plugster wrote:
The diesel fuel tank on my boat is in the center of my boat just
forward
of
the mast and the engines are in the back so the fuel lines pass
through
the
cabin. There are no fuel leaks, the lines are made from a gray
rubber
and
smell strongly of the diesel fuel. The boat is 6 years old.

I'd bet the fuel lines are not an ABS-ABYC approved type for fuel.
Proper fuel line is expensive, but it lasts considerably more than
6
years.

... The runs are
about 45 feet and they do a fair amount of twists and turns. I
am
thinking
about replacing them with soft metal tubing, maybe copper (Home
Depot
water
tubing) or 3003-0 aluminum (aircraft grade fuel line).

Don't use aluminum on a boat. It corrodes far too quickly and is
more
difficult to make up joints. Ask me how I know!

Refrigeration grade copper tubing (type L or M IIRC but check the
specs)
is acceptable as fuel line... but it's difficult to install
properly.
Unless you can rip out all obstacles, you have to snake it into
place
and then mount it properly (it will work harden with vibration,
and then
leak no matter what) and make up the terminal connections. This
takes a
lot of time and careful work.


...Of course I will
leave a short flexible part near the engine for vibration.

You might as well go with the more expensive fuel hose for the
whole
run. I'd recommend that, and I just did a somewhat shorter simpler
job
on our trawler this past spring. Of course I work with tubing (HP
air &
hydraulics, among other things) almost daily so the joint
connections
were not a problem.

It'll cost more in dollars for material but take far less time &
trouble
to install, and will be far less likely to leak due to bad
joining.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

I've installed many a fuel line on boilers with soft copper tubing (#1 & #2
fuel). There are also *fused* valves available (fire-o-matic) that will shut
off fuel supply in an intense heat situation. I'll defer to Doug's expertise
in this situation though.
To the OP, if you're going with metal tubing, I'd recommend a flared
connection, or at least stay away from compression (nut and ferrule) types,
which tend to leak with vibration.
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
I was told by my surveyor to use type A-1 hose for fuel lines. it's
supposed to 'melt' (or something like that) and seal itself in a fire
, thus preventing fuel from feeding the fire.


--
Scott Vernon
Plowville Pa _/)__/)_/)_


"plugster" wrote in message
ink.net...
Thanks for the information. I will check to see if the original
hose was
rated for diesel fuel.

Do you have a good source for diesel rated hose? West Marine has
USCG and
NMMA approved hose but I would like to make sure there is no smell
at all.
Maybe I should go with the refrigeration grade copper. I think that
I can
make the run with one piece per side but it will be very difficult.
The
current hose is very well mounted and I think I can use the same
system
again.

I have never been on a boat that did not smell of Diesel that was so
equipped. I think I have a chance with metal lines.

Thanks
Mark

"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
plugster wrote:
The diesel fuel tank on my boat is in the center of my boat just
forward
of
the mast and the engines are in the back so the fuel lines pass
through
the
cabin. There are no fuel leaks, the lines are made from a gray
rubber
and
smell strongly of the diesel fuel. The boat is 6 years old.

I'd bet the fuel lines are not an ABS-ABYC approved type for fuel.
Proper fuel line is expensive, but it lasts considerably more than
6
years.

... The runs are
about 45 feet and they do a fair amount of twists and turns. I
am
thinking
about replacing them with soft metal tubing, maybe copper (Home
Depot
water
tubing) or 3003-0 aluminum (aircraft grade fuel line).

Don't use aluminum on a boat. It corrodes far too quickly and is
more
difficult to make up joints. Ask me how I know!

Refrigeration grade copper tubing (type L or M IIRC but check the
specs)
is acceptable as fuel line... but it's difficult to install
properly.
Unless you can rip out all obstacles, you have to snake it into
place
and then mount it properly (it will work harden with vibration,
and then
leak no matter what) and make up the terminal connections. This
takes a
lot of time and careful work.


...Of course I will
leave a short flexible part near the engine for vibration.

You might as well go with the more expensive fuel hose for the
whole
run. I'd recommend that, and I just did a somewhat shorter simpler
job
on our trawler this past spring. Of course I work with tubing (HP
air &
hydraulics, among other things) almost daily so the joint
connections
were not a problem.

It'll cost more in dollars for material but take far less time &
trouble
to install, and will be far less likely to leak due to bad
joining.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King