Scotty crapped:

As for slips vs. moorings, slips can be a lot safer

TOTAL BULL ****!




No, Scotty Potty. It's not bull**** and once again you show how little
you know. A lot of sailors like Scotty walk around repeating
generalities they've heard without any practical knowledge at all.
Folks like Scotty, Martin and Doug are perfect examples of this
problem.
So here's why slips CAN BE SAFER than moorings.

1) Some moorings in high current zones take a lot of abuse and simply
take to much pounding to be of value against a well protected marina
with slips.

2) High traffic, high volume mooring fields see plenty of collisions
due to operator error and boats breaking free and playing pinball with
others.

3) If a protected marina (such as ours) never experiences weather that
can damage it, the boats are better off than those exposed on
moorings. Last years storms were a perfect example as ALL of the boats
damaged were from moorings.

4) Boats in slips will see more regular maintenance due to the
accessibility. Gear is kept cleaner. Safer boat.

5) In 25 knots winds a mooring field can be a handful and transferring
to a dinghy or launch difficult and dangerous. Older folks will be at
risk along with children. Our protected slips see about half that much
wind on most days, so it's far easier and safer.

6) Slips are usually protected by one or more breakwaters, leaving the
boats calm and not straining most of the time. Moored boats see far
more wave action and lines, standing rigging and steering systems take
a pounding.

7) You can ALWAYS get to your boat even in the worst weather when you
have well designed and located slips like ours.

8) ALL lightening strikes in our area (and there are plenty) are on
the boats that are moored.

So there you have it. This does not apply to all areas. There are
plenty of spots where slips are downright risky and a mooring is a lot
smarter, but on City Island, Port Washington and other popular
sailboat spots, slips are like gold. I won't even get into how much
more use we get out of the boat because of a slip, or how much better
it is when Thomas' grandparents come along. And if Suzanne and I want
privacy the club maintains moorings as well, which can be used by
members. The best of both worlds.
One by one, when they could afford it, my friends have moved to slips
and the mooring damage cycle has ended.


RB
35s5
NY

I rest my case.



"Capt. **** Head" wrote


slips are downright risky and a mooring is a lot
smarter

On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 14:45:49 -0000, "Capt. Rob"
wrote:

So here's why slips CAN BE SAFER than moorings.

1) Some moorings in high current zones take a lot of abuse and simply
take to much pounding to be of value against a well protected marina
with slips.

2) High traffic, high volume mooring fields see plenty of collisions
due to operator error and boats breaking free and playing pinball with
others.

3) If a protected marina (such as ours) never experiences weather that
can damage it, the boats are better off than those exposed on
moorings. Last years storms were a perfect example as ALL of the boats
damaged were from moorings.

4) Boats in slips will see more regular maintenance due to the
accessibility. Gear is kept cleaner. Safer boat.

5) In 25 knots winds a mooring field can be a handful and transferring
to a dinghy or launch difficult and dangerous. Older folks will be at
risk along with children. Our protected slips see about half that much
wind on most days, so it's far easier and safer.

6) Slips are usually protected by one or more breakwaters, leaving the
boats calm and not straining most of the time. Moored boats see far
more wave action and lines, standing rigging and steering systems take
a pounding.

7) You can ALWAYS get to your boat even in the worst weather when you
have well designed and located slips like ours.

8) ALL lightening strikes in our area (and there are plenty) are on
the boats that are moored.

So there you have it. This does not apply to all areas. There are
plenty of spots where slips are downright risky and a mooring is a lot
smarter, but on City Island, Port Washington and other popular
sailboat spots, slips are like gold. I won't even get into how much
more use we get out of the boat because of a slip, or how much better
it is when Thomas' grandparents come along. And if Suzanne and I want
privacy the club maintains moorings as well, which can be used by
members. The best of both worlds.
One by one, when they could afford it, my friends have moved to slips
and the mooring damage cycle has ended.

This is cogent statement laying out considerations of
mooring/anchoring versus slipping.
Is there a website where this type of good info is found, perhaps
pointing out mooring and slip conditions in different ports?
I'm thinking Captain Neal possibly could add this to his website,
maybe in a new "Tie-Ups" section. It would be quite helpful to
sailing novices like me.

--Vic

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 10:20:05 -0500, Vic Smith
said:

It would be quite helpful to
sailing novices like me.

Those of us who have owned boats for 30-40 years recognize that anything
you
hear from BS should be taken cum granulo salis.


Do you mean cum grano salis?

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

There is certainly no doubt that there are advantages to keeping a
boat in a slip. I've been willing to pay the premium for the
convenience, even though we're gone more than half of the summer. You
can always say that *some* slips are more protected, and *some*
moorings are less protected. But one must be careful of generalities.

In my experience, most marinas are well protected, but not all. For
example, in Vineyard Haven I just spent some time on a mooring behind
the breakwater feeling quite secure. In fact, I've sat out several
gales and near miss hurricanes in that spot. The nearby marinas,
however, are not protected and generally are emptied (to unprotected
moorings!) when a Nor'easter blows up.

While some mooring fields feel like bumper ball, most have generous
spacing and frankly, I've seen (and perhaps caused) more damage from
sloppy boat handling in marinas than in mooring fields. My boat only
has a few dings, but all have been caused in a marina.

Curiously, although it would seem that getting on and off is riskier
on a mooring than on a dock, I, and my family members, have had a
number of minor injuries on docks, but none from dinghy or launch
incidents. I don't count my hurt pride from flipping the dinghy once
in Northeast Harbor!

As for being "always able to get to your boat in the worst weather,"
every time I've been in a marina for a hurricane, its been closed -
they don't want the liability of idiots walking the docks in 100 mph
winds! In fact, there are many marinas that require you to remove the
boat during major storms, presumably putting it on a mooring!



* Capt. Rob wrote, On 7/17/2007 10:45 AM:
Scotty crapped:

As for slips vs. moorings, slips can be a lot safer

TOTAL BULL ****!




No, Scotty Potty. It's not bull**** and once again you show how little
you know. A lot of sailors like Scotty walk around repeating
generalities they've heard without any practical knowledge at all.
Folks like Scotty, Martin and Doug are perfect examples of this
problem.
So here's why slips CAN BE SAFER than moorings.

1) Some moorings in high current zones take a lot of abuse and simply
take to much pounding to be of value against a well protected marina
with slips.

2) High traffic, high volume mooring fields see plenty of collisions
due to operator error and boats breaking free and playing pinball with
others.

3) If a protected marina (such as ours) never experiences weather that
can damage it, the boats are better off than those exposed on
moorings. Last years storms were a perfect example as ALL of the boats
damaged were from moorings.

4) Boats in slips will see more regular maintenance due to the
accessibility. Gear is kept cleaner. Safer boat.

5) In 25 knots winds a mooring field can be a handful and transferring
to a dinghy or launch difficult and dangerous. Older folks will be at
risk along with children. Our protected slips see about half that much
wind on most days, so it's far easier and safer.

6) Slips are usually protected by one or more breakwaters, leaving the
boats calm and not straining most of the time. Moored boats see far
more wave action and lines, standing rigging and steering systems take
a pounding.

7) You can ALWAYS get to your boat even in the worst weather when you
have well designed and located slips like ours.

8) ALL lightening strikes in our area (and there are plenty) are on
the boats that are moored.

So there you have it. This does not apply to all areas. There are
plenty of spots where slips are downright risky and a mooring is a lot
smarter, but on City Island, Port Washington and other popular
sailboat spots, slips are like gold. I won't even get into how much
more use we get out of the boat because of a slip, or how much better
it is when Thomas' grandparents come along. And if Suzanne and I want
privacy the club maintains moorings as well, which can be used by
members. The best of both worlds.
One by one, when they could afford it, my friends have moved to slips
and the mooring damage cycle has ended.


RB
35s5
NY

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 12:12:31 -0400, Jeff wrote:


As for being "always able to get to your boat in the worst weather,"
every time I've been in a marina for a hurricane, its been closed -
they don't want the liability of idiots walking the docks in 100 mph
winds!

Preperation should have already been done by the time the winds get
that high.

In fact, there are many marinas that require you to remove the
boat during major storms, presumably putting it on a mooring!


Because, unfortunately, many owners just pull out their insurance
policy to make sure they are covered, then let it go. Instead of
properly preparing for the anticipated tide lift and winds.

The marina owners are worried about the damage that will be done to
their docks, electrical and water distribution systems, and other
fixed facilities when your improperly prepared boat runs amok.

And although many marinas have that policy, it is largely ignored in
my area, particularly by the remote owners.

Frank











* Capt. Rob wrote, On 7/17/2007 10:45 AM:
Scotty crapped:

As for slips vs. moorings, slips can be a lot safer

TOTAL BULL ****!




No, Scotty Potty. It's not bull**** and once again you show how little
you know. A lot of sailors like Scotty walk around repeating
generalities they've heard without any practical knowledge at all.
Folks like Scotty, Martin and Doug are perfect examples of this
problem.
So here's why slips CAN BE SAFER than moorings.

1) Some moorings in high current zones take a lot of abuse and simply
take to much pounding to be of value against a well protected marina
with slips.

2) High traffic, high volume mooring fields see plenty of collisions
due to operator error and boats breaking free and playing pinball with
others.

3) If a protected marina (such as ours) never experiences weather that
can damage it, the boats are better off than those exposed on
moorings. Last years storms were a perfect example as ALL of the boats
damaged were from moorings.

4) Boats in slips will see more regular maintenance due to the
accessibility. Gear is kept cleaner. Safer boat.

5) In 25 knots winds a mooring field can be a handful and transferring
to a dinghy or launch difficult and dangerous. Older folks will be at
risk along with children. Our protected slips see about half that much
wind on most days, so it's far easier and safer.

6) Slips are usually protected by one or more breakwaters, leaving the
boats calm and not straining most of the time. Moored boats see far
more wave action and lines, standing rigging and steering systems take
a pounding.

7) You can ALWAYS get to your boat even in the worst weather when you
have well designed and located slips like ours.

8) ALL lightening strikes in our area (and there are plenty) are on
the boats that are moored.

So there you have it. This does not apply to all areas. There are
plenty of spots where slips are downright risky and a mooring is a lot
smarter, but on City Island, Port Washington and other popular
sailboat spots, slips are like gold. I won't even get into how much
more use we get out of the boat because of a slip, or how much better
it is when Thomas' grandparents come along. And if Suzanne and I want
privacy the club maintains moorings as well, which can be used by
members. The best of both worlds.
One by one, when they could afford it, my friends have moved to slips
and the mooring damage cycle has ended.


RB
35s5
NY

This is cogent statement laying out considerations of
mooring/anchoring versus slipping.




I don't think such a list exists. Area by area folks adapt to weather
and of course the costs. The main reason why people use moorings here
is to save money. A slip for a 30 foot sailboat is close to 5K at my
club and that's a lot for occasional sailors. A club like City Island
Yacht Club will run you half of that and self-serve moorings can be
under a grand. Low lifes like Scotty aren't going to be paying that
sort of change when they can't even afford a good boat to start with.
Of course, with a vessel like a 35s5 I'm not going to hang her off a
mooring. We even have a J29 and J27 in slips because the owners felt
it was worth it to the upkeep of the boat. We also cater to two
seperate charter companies and both left thier moorings for the
safer...and far more friendly slips.


RB
35s5
NY

BS should be taken cum granulo salis.




Oh my. Flubbed again!
FYI, Dave owns a very low end boat. In fact the company that built his
boat made some very good ones until his hit the market. Several major
US dealers would not carry the poor thing and that's a FACT. It's one
of those boats that looks as though someone pumped it full of
air...sort of like Dave himself!
If owned a CS 27 I'd keep it on a mooring too...the one furthest out
in fact!
How is it that a fellow like Dave owns a boat worth so little? I'm 44
and I own a 65K boat. When I'm as old as Dave IF I own something small
it will be a vessel with lines...such as a Alerion 28 for example.


RB
35s5
NY

As for being "always able to get to your boat in the worst weather,"
every time I've been in a marina for a hurricane, its been closed -
they don't want the liability of idiots walking the docks in 100 mph
winds! In fact, there are many marinas that require you to remove
the
boat during major storms, presumably putting it on a mooring!



Jeff, thanks for a measured and "none trolling" response to my troll.
I think your comment about injuries at the dock are true in part. We
just had a death at my club because a guy was messing around on his
boat and fell off. The feeling of security dockside can lead some
people to conduct themselves in an unsafe manner. I'd guess that
drinking is typical factor.
I have also seen boats in marinas catch those dings, but the serious
damage we handle in the shop comes more often from moored boats. Last
season I posted a couple of pics of damaged boats which has slammed
into the City Island bridge after a bad blow. 1 sank and the others
were seriously damaged. Nothing at our club was damaged, but I did run
out and TRIPLE up on my lines during that storm. I also helped others
do the same. Boats on moorings were sitting ducks and it seemed that
every boat that broke loose or dragged, struck two other boats. These
things can happen and we'd prefer to plan for the worst of course.


RB
35s5
NY

In fact, there are many marinas that require you to remove the
boat during major storms, presumably putting it on a mooring!



Some folks do haul their boats at my club when a big blow is coming,
though only one sailboat does it. The others are pricey little
powerboats and they often do it because they won't come down to check
lines.
Other places see different conditions that require specific action.
But my point was really that folks like Scotty potty, who are dumb and
quick to make general comments, and disputing that slips can be
safer....are..well, dumb!


RB
35s5
NY