Lew and others nailed it: If you want to sail, _buy_ a boat. If you want
a vocation building something, _build_ a boat.

Hang out with boat people, hit all the harbors within an hour's drive.
Deals on "TLC boats" start at less than $500 for 25' glass (running
motor is extra), useable sail gear, no obnoxious smells etc below. Take
somebody who works on boats to evaluate stuff. Bare bones, figure to
spend another $2-300 to keep the CG and your SO happy. Think marine flea
market next spring for the missing details. Forget woodies (eg folk
boats) until you know a more about the "self vs. boat vs. time vs.
family" thing.

Sail tape can make most sails work for quite a while. You can scull or
row a boat that size, so maybe skip the motor depending on your
requirements and _immediate_ plans. If you gotta have power, a 2hp
outboard with long shaft should do it. Trailer boats come _slightly_
higher with trailers. Fix the trailer first. A TLC boat will give you
plenty of boat building experience with a real chance you'll actually
get to go boating.

Plan the family thing so they all love it. Play dirty - let your SO pick
the color you paint the boat, and use any similar sleazy tactics you can
think of. Don't go out with family on less than a perfect day: go short
and go quiet and come back a little early. Skip the "authentic" stuff,
and just make sure the coleman cooler has ice for lunch and snacks, and
that you get back without scaring anybody. Freshen up your skills - take
a free CG Auxilliary sailing course, and hitch a ride on some beer can
races. If you can arrange it, keep the boat in the water during the
season. Innumerable embarrassments occur at launching ramps that take
years to live down. If you're on a mooring and the harbor provides taxi
service, use it. Less chance to screw up. First impression count. Take
no chances, stack the deck, make sure they have fun.

Then trade up next year when you know what matters to you. g

Rufus

Woo-hoo, the advice just keeps getting better.

Sneakier, but better

Brian W

On Mon, 29 Dec 2003 00:24:47 GMT, Rufus
wrote:

Lew and others nailed it: If you want to sail, _buy_ a boat. If you want
a vocation building something, _build_ a boat.

Hang out with boat people, hit all the harbors within an hour's drive.
Deals on "TLC boats" start at less than $500 for 25' glass (running
motor is extra), useable sail gear, no obnoxious smells etc below. Take
somebody who works on boats to evaluate stuff. Bare bones, figure to
spend another $2-300 to keep the CG and your SO happy. Think marine flea
market next spring for the missing details. Forget woodies (eg folk
boats) until you know a more about the "self vs. boat vs. time vs.
family" thing.

Sail tape can make most sails work for quite a while. You can scull or
row a boat that size, so maybe skip the motor depending on your
requirements and _immediate_ plans. If you gotta have power, a 2hp
outboard with long shaft should do it. Trailer boats come _slightly_
higher with trailers. Fix the trailer first. A TLC boat will give you
plenty of boat building experience with a real chance you'll actually
get to go boating.

Plan the family thing so they all love it. Play dirty - let your SO pick
the color you paint the boat, and use any similar sleazy tactics you can
think of. Don't go out with family on less than a perfect day: go short
and go quiet and come back a little early. Skip the "authentic" stuff,
and just make sure the coleman cooler has ice for lunch and snacks, and
that you get back without scaring anybody. Freshen up your skills - take
a free CG Auxilliary sailing course, and hitch a ride on some beer can
races. If you can arrange it, keep the boat in the water during the
season. Innumerable embarrassments occur at launching ramps that take
years to live down. If you're on a mooring and the harbor provides taxi
service, use it. Less chance to screw up. First impression count. Take
no chances, stack the deck, make sure they have fun.

Then trade up next year when you know what matters to you. g

Rufus

"Jim B." ) writes:
... I just don't think I will find an abandoned broken boat laying
around on the beach BUT...I'll keep my eyes peeled, stranger things have
happened.

maybe after a storm?

William R Watt: .... Also, looks like
you sell boat designs according to your website.

nope. for what its worth everything on my website is absolutley free.

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Deals on "TLC boats" start at less than $500 for 25' glass (running

.. If you gotta have power, a 2hp
outboard with long shaft should do it.

if a person is going to put a 2 hp outboard on a 25 ft fibreglass boat I'd
also suggest a good anchor with a long rope and chain. in any kind of
wind, waves, current, or some combination, the motor won't do much. better
to throw out the anchor and wait. I had a 3 hp outboard on a 21 ft
mahogony strip sailboat (very light boat for its size) and it wasn't worth
spit unless the wind and water were quiet. a paddle won't do much. maybe a
pair of oars. a small motor is okay when you run out of wind but not if
you're trying to motor into or out of a dock or mooring in other
conditions. I used to sail in and out among the moored boats in all
conditions except no wind. Only used the motor when the wind died. ehen
the motor is used the centreboard has to be halfway down, if there is a
centreboard, for directional stability.

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Yup, that's the call.

Take the CG sailing course, find out about life vests and anchors and
radios and man overboard and fog horns... all that good stuff. Get
enough good motor (one that costs enough to maybe run when you need it)
to get you back in. I've moved a Westsail32 with a 2-1/2hp outboard on
the side-tied dingy. Moved kinda slow, but it got there no problem.
Treat the boat and the water with a lot respect and take it slow and
responsibly. Take a low key buddy who sails regularly along the first
few times. Stuff like that.

But you don't need $20k into it to do it right.

Rufus


William R. Watt wrote:

Deals on "TLC boats" start at less than $500 for 25' glass (running


.. If you gotta have power, a 2hp
outboard with long shaft should do it.


if a person is going to put a 2 hp outboard on a 25 ft fibreglass boat I'd
also suggest a good anchor with a long rope and chain. in any kind of
wind, waves, current, or some combination, the motor won't do much. better
to throw out the anchor and wait. I had a 3 hp outboard on a 21 ft
mahogony strip sailboat (very light boat for its size) and it wasn't worth
spit unless the wind and water were quiet. a paddle won't do much. maybe a
pair of oars. a small motor is okay when you run out of wind but not if
you're trying to motor into or out of a dock or mooring in other
conditions. I used to sail in and out among the moored boats in all
conditions except no wind. Only used the motor when the wind died. ehen
the motor is used the centreboard has to be halfway down, if there is a
centreboard, for directional stability.

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
William R Watt National Capital FreeNet Ottawa's free community network
homepage: www.ncf.ca/~ag384/top.htm
warning: non-freenet email must have "notspam" in subject or it's returned

Jim,

I am also having a dilemma of similar substance and financial restraint. I
do believe it can be done though...with advice from people all over the
world (I am from Australia) and lots of questions to the right people in
chat rooms for boat building etc there are lots if you look.

I am an ex boat and aircraft builder, so am in the position of knowing what
I want and how to do it (not used ply before - which is what I will be
building my boat in) but have no money to buy the stuff DOH!.

I am now scouring the usual places where "stuff" can be found
cheap...building sites, second hand places etc.

I would suggest though, that you invest in decent quality plans with "how
to" stuff included with the plan package. These are generally written for
people with little or no skills in boat building (no offence :-) and are
very good for the first time builder.

Good luck with your search

Rod.

"Jim B." wrote in message
news:m8iGb.445165$Dw6.1352034@attbi_s02...
Ok. I live in a small coastal town in New England where the Dory was
invented (at least that is what I have read). Ever since we moved here, I
have wanted a boat. But we really can't afford one. It is very low on
the
financial needs list. But I have two kids (5 and 7 yr old) and I think it
would be great to have them grow up sailing with me and maybe even on
their
own. But enough with the hopes and dreams....

A little background on potentially pertinent skills...I did some sailing
as
a teen in a tiny sailboat called a Laser (??) and I loved it but only had
the chance a few times. My woodworking/building experiences consist of
shop
class in 8th grade and 3 years of drafting class in high school. These
days
I do not own any power saws. Once in a blue moon I might pick up my hand
saw and cut a 2x4 for some reason. As for other experiences, I majored in
and taught high school physics. Eventually, I found myself in a computer
tech job.

I have been trawling the internet for plans, advice, building materials
costs, building journals, etc. I actually started this little obsession 2
years ago but then it went away for a while. My wife is not sold in this
idea at all. Anyway, this is what information I've got so far:

-The boat has got to have an LOA of 17' or less. I want to build it in my
garage and keep it there for storage (haven't considered the length of a
trailer though). It is a two car garage and is 17'10" in length. One of
the doors is 5'10" in height, and 7'8" in width.
-I want the boat to hold two adults and 2 kids.
-I want a sailboat not a powerboat.
-I think I should build a small boat first.
-I also think it should be a plywood boat. I would prefer the first boat
use
less than 6 sheets of 8'x4' plywood. It looks like the initial big cost
will be in buying plywood sheets and around here that looks like $50 a
sheet
for marine ply. So if I could do this with 4 sheets to start the first
boat, then if my wife saw me build a cool boat with 4 sheets, then I
could
go bigger in the years to come. (At least it sounds like a good plan...)
-I realize the sail will also cost. So, adding oars to the first small
boat
might be the way to go and experimenting with plastic tarp material for
cheap.
-Plans I have considered for the first little boat:
*Some of stevenprojects.com plans
(http://www.stevproj.com/SailDingh.html) as well as the 11' skipjack
Stevenson published an a book in the 70's Sailboats You Can Build.
*Optimist Dinghy (http://www.optiworld.org/ioda-intro.html)
*Canoe (but I do not think I want to do this one since I couldn't
sail it) - http://www.bateau2.com/free/cheapcanoe.htm

-Plans I have considered for the bigger boat:
*Weekender http://www.stevproj.com/PocketYachts.html
*Bolger's Micro - This one seemed better then the Weekender
http://www.boatdesign.com/micro/
*Sztrandek (probably not a good one since the plans are free and
there will be no support)
http://www.zeglarstwo.3miasto.pl/sztraeng/sztrengl.html

Please comment and advise. I am looking for boat plan recommendations,
similar experiences, tips, tricks, help with making it cheap,

--Jim B.