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Which feathering prop?
I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to
find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
In npj0f.64$784.63@lakeread08 "Glenn Ashmore" writes:
I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? Any reason Autoprop is not on your list? Price? I had a two bladed Gori, and think this is perhaps the best two bladed folding prop. But when I wanted to change to a three bladed feathering prop, I ended up with j-prop: http://www.bomon.com/jprop/. I have been very happy with the performance and here in Europe it is much cheaper than the competition. There is one question you should pay attention to: If your gearbox has not about the same reduction ratio of revs on both the forward and backwards gear, then you better to get an feathering prop that can be adjusted to different angle of attack of the blades on forward and reverse. I know J-prop does not have this, but only a few have. It is possible maxprop has. - Lauri Tarkkonen -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
Luke!
"Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message news:npj0f.64$784.63@lakeread08... I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
On Mon, 3 Oct 2005 19:46:37 -0400, "Glenn Ashmore"
wrote: I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? I am thinking that you are up to making a plaster or wood blade pattern and hub pattern, and having them cast at a bronze foundry and contracting a local machine shop to mill the slots and blade roots and pivot pins. Polish it yourself, even? Brian Whatcott Altus OK |
Which feathering prop?
"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote in message
... There is one question you should pay attention to: If your gearbox has not about the same reduction ratio of revs on both the forward and backwards gear, then you better to get an feathering prop that can be adjusted to different angle of attack of the blades on forward and reverse. I know J-prop does not have this, but only a few have. It is possible maxprop has. - Lauri Tarkkonen Max Prop has independent pitches forward and reverse - or, at least, my manual sez mine does... L8R Skip, totally sore from moving house -- Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig http://tinyurl.com/384p2 The vessel as Tehamana, as we bought her "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain In npj0f.64$784.63@lakeread08 "Glenn Ashmore" writes: I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? Any reason Autoprop is not on your list? Price? I had a two bladed Gori, and think this is perhaps the best two bladed folding prop. But when I wanted to change to a three bladed feathering prop, I ended up with j-prop: http://www.bomon.com/jprop/. I have been very happy with the performance and here in Europe it is much cheaper than the competition. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net) wrote in
message ... Max Prop has independent pitches forward and reverse - or, at least, my manual sez mine does... L8R Skip, totally sore from moving house New kind of physical therapy huh? ;-) Where are you and Lydia going to camp until the Pig can fly? -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
"Brian Whatcott" wrote in message
... I am thinking that you are up to making a plaster or wood blade pattern and hub pattern, and having them cast at a bronze foundry and contracting a local machine shop to mill the slots and blade roots and pivot pins. Polish it yourself, even? Brian Whatcott Altus OK No thank you. I saw a TV show once with Paul Luke giving a tour of making one of his props. An amazing amount of work goes into those things. The tooling to cut the gears would cost more than a prop. They are beautifully machined and built like a tank but they are essentially hand made one offs. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote in message ... Any reason Autoprop is not on your list? Price? I had a two bladed Gori, and think this is perhaps the best two bladed folding prop. But when I wanted to change to a three bladed feathering prop, I ended up with j-prop: http://www.bomon.com/jprop/. I have been very happy with the performance and here in Europe it is much cheaper than the competition. There is one question you should pay attention to: If your gearbox has not about the same reduction ratio of revs on both the forward and backwards gear, then you better to get an feathering prop that can be adjusted to different angle of attack of the blades on forward and reverse. I know J-prop does not have this, but only a few have. It is possible maxprop has. AutoProp is a neat idea but I eliminated it for a couple of reasons. First it is not truly feathering. The blades hang loose when idle and produce some drag which can make them rotate. The other is that it relies on 3 races of exposed ball bearings that I am afraid can get caked up with barnacle cement and other trash. I had not thought of the J-prop but I will look at them. The 3 bladed Gori and MaxProp are near the top of my list. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
In E3m0f.78$784.41@lakeread08 "Glenn Ashmore" writes:
"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote in message ... Any reason Autoprop is not on your list? Price? I had a two bladed Gori, and think this is perhaps the best two bladed folding prop. But when I wanted to change to a three bladed feathering prop, I ended up with j-prop: http://www.bomon.com/jprop/. I have been very happy with the performance and here in Europe it is much cheaper than the competition. There is one question you should pay attention to: If your gearbox has not about the same reduction ratio of revs on both the forward and backwards gear, then you better to get an feathering prop that can be adjusted to different angle of attack of the blades on forward and reverse. I know J-prop does not have this, but only a few have. It is possible maxprop has. AutoProp is a neat idea but I eliminated it for a couple of reasons. First it is not truly feathering. The blades hang loose when idle and produce some drag which can make them rotate. The other is that it relies on 3 races of exposed ball bearings that I am afraid can get caked up with barnacle cement and other trash. If your propeller axis is not perfectly horizontal the three bladed feathering propeller will vause some drag. I have not heard about the problem of Autoprop would rotate, but if you put your gear on, I am sure it will not. I have been asking people who have Autoprops, when I have seen them working on their boats, but even if there have been some barnacles on the prop, nobody admitted that it has affected the rotation of the blades. Of course most people I have met are in the Baltic, where the barnacle problem is not that big. I had not thought of the J-prop but I will look at them. The 3 bladed Gori and MaxProp are near the top of my list. If you have to fix the angle of the blades differently for forward and reverse then MaxProp is yours, if it can be symmetric J-prop comes much cheaper (at least here in Finland). If you choose a Gori, you should check the vedge that locks the propeller in the axis. Earlier they were made of brass, and I know a couple of cases, my own boat included where the vedge has been split into two and the propeller has fallen off. (They could not find it in the mud of the harbour bottom. :-)). Use steel. - Lauri Tarkkonen -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
On Mon, 3 Oct 2005 22:48:15 -0400,
Glenn Ashmore wrote: "Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote in message ... Any reason Autoprop is not on your list? Price? I had a two bladed Gori, and think this is perhaps the best two bladed folding prop. But when I wanted to change to a three bladed feathering prop, I ended up with j-prop: http://www.bomon.com/jprop/. I have been very happy with the performance and here in Europe it is much cheaper than the competition. There is one question you should pay attention to: If your gearbox has not about the same reduction ratio of revs on both the forward and backwards gear, then you better to get an feathering prop that can be adjusted to different angle of attack of the blades on forward and reverse. I know J-prop does not have this, but only a few have. It is possible maxprop has. AutoProp is a neat idea but I eliminated it for a couple of reasons. First it is not truly feathering. The blades hang loose when idle and produce some drag which can make them rotate. The other is that it relies on 3 races of exposed ball bearings that I am afraid can get caked up with barnacle cement and other trash. I had not thought of the J-prop but I will look at them. The 3 bladed Gori and MaxProp are near the top of my list. Please keep us posted on what you decide on, and why, and maybe how well it works? I for one am interested. We will need a new prop for Windwalker in a year or so, our current fixed blade has slight "pinking" on the leading edges, no major worry, but owrth replacing before we cast off. A feathering prop is a maybe, depending on cost, and benefit. -- Jim Richardson http://www.eskimo.com/~warlock Unix has security which has been tested by conniving, unscrupulous college students over generations. |
Which feathering prop?
I have used both the MaxProp and the Autostream. Each has its pros and cons:
Maxprop: Pros- proven and reliable Cons- see Autostream pros Autostream: Pros- Stainless construction which is generally more corrosion resistant than MaxProp's bronze. It has independent pitch settings for forward and reverse which will compensate for a transmission with a different gear ratio in forward vs reverse Cons- This is a big one. The blades have less surface area than the MaxProp and therefore have to be set with more pitch to compensate. This causes cavitation when powering into a headwind. Overall I would go with the 3 bladed MaxProp. You can get the VP version for a few hunderd $ more which lets you reset the pitch without dissasembling, ie a diver can do it in the water. It will usually take at least one try and error before you get the pitch right. MaxProp's recommendations don't always work. David |
Which feathering prop?
I installed an AutoStream 3-blade in the spring of 2000 and have
nothing except good things to say about it. Adjustable pitch fwd & rev without disassembly in the water, can be greased and zinc changed in the water, all stainless construction so there is no dissimiliar metal issue between the prop and the shaft. Can be directly painted with copper anti-foul paint since it is stainless without electrolysis issues. Great performance in fwd and rev. I never observed any cavitation due to smaller blade size. I have never had any other feathering prop so I can't compare. It was about $1000 less expensive than the MaxProp in 2000. The only con I see is the $40 price on the unique zinc. I am going to mold my own. But perhaps the other prop manufacturers hose you on their zinc also. Rich "Glenn Ashmore" wrote: I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? |
Which feathering prop?
Yep, an alternative. A FIXED blade prop called a "Campbell Sailer" (yes,
spelled with an "e" not an "o".) The Sailer is a funny looking thing, with long narrow blades but a thick leading edge. FAR less drag than a conventional prop, and at least on my Westsail 32 better performance under power as well. They're made in Canada, about 1/4-1/3 the cost of variable pitch props, and far simpler, of course. I wouldn't trade mine for two of the others. (Well, actually I can't trade it: sold the boat a year ago, in favor of a Victory Tug. Still sail the dink, though....) Cheers, Dick Behan "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message news:npj0f.64$784.63@lakeread08... I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
Glen .....
I have a MaxProp and haave mostlly good thing to say about it, with the exception that if you dont full idle down between forward and reverse, the casting will deform a bit and the blades can get a bit 'sloppy'. The 'regular' Max-Props are nice as you can change the ptich when the boat is still in the water. For those of you with props in 'apertures' ...... When sizing any feathering prop dont just take the manufacturers dimensions and think everything will be all-right with the installation. I strongly suggest that you take the dimensions and make a 'pattern' or mock-up put it on the prop shaft ..... and then fully swing the rudder back and forth to determine the intereference when the rudder is 'hard over". In article npj0f.64$784.63@lakeread08, Glenn Ashmore wrote: I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? |
Which feathering prop?
We like our Max Prop and the ability to change pitch. We liked our Martek
folder on our last boat but this boat is much heavier and the Martek Folder on the new boat was replaced with the Max Prop. Gotta tell you something. B "Rich Hampel" wrote in message ... Glen ..... I have a MaxProp and haave mostlly good thing to say about it, with the exception that if you dont full idle down between forward and reverse, the casting will deform a bit and the blades can get a bit 'sloppy'. The 'regular' Max-Props are nice as you can change the ptich when the boat is still in the water. For those of you with props in 'apertures' ...... When sizing any feathering prop dont just take the manufacturers dimensions and think everything will be all-right with the installation. I strongly suggest that you take the dimensions and make a 'pattern' or mock-up put it on the prop shaft ..... and then fully swing the rudder back and forth to determine the intereference when the rudder is 'hard over". In article npj0f.64$784.63@lakeread08, Glenn Ashmore wrote: I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? |
Which feathering prop?
Glenn Ashmore wrote:
I had not thought of the J-prop but I will look at them. The 3 bladed Gori and MaxProp are near the top of my list. Glenn, I looked into all of the above, plus J Prop and the Kiwi plastic ones. I ended up with a _used_ 17" Autostream bought from a private seller in Oz, but was leaning to the Kiwi prop for weight (catamaran) and cost reasons previously. Kiwi: - cheaper than the rest - corresponded with one early adopter who had only good words to say - blades maybe a bit more vulnerable if you hit debris, but maybe this saves a shaft or coupling? - chunky hub Maxprop - good track record - expensive for the VP version Autostream - continuous improvement from their earliest models - Duplex s.s. construction with low corrosion - simple and very nice engineering. I like this - seals are simple O-rings at blade hubs with delrin bushings - independent reverse/fwd. pitch, easily adjustable with a wrench and allen key underwater - I don't think their blade area is anything different from Maxprop J-Prop - asked for price from Quebec distributor (out of sight) so didn't think about it further All Feathering props: - must exchange blades to change pitch; usually time limit on this - can't change pitch if boat more loaded/fouled bottom - lower efficicency in head seas/wind - best choice for racing oriented boats but not cruising boats IMO Autoprop - bloody costly and fairly heavy Varifold - no opinion Evan Gatehouse |
Which feathering prop?
In Evan Gatehouse writes:
Glenn Ashmore wrote: I had not thought of the J-prop but I will look at them. The 3 bladed Gori and MaxProp are near the top of my list. Glenn, I looked into all of the above, plus J Prop and the Kiwi plastic ones. I ended up with a _used_ 17" Autostream bought from a private seller in Oz, but was leaning to the Kiwi prop for weight (catamaran) and cost reasons previously. Kiwi: - cheaper than the rest - corresponded with one early adopter who had only good words to say - blades maybe a bit more vulnerable if you hit debris, but maybe this saves a shaft or coupling? - chunky hub Maxprop - good track record - expensive for the VP version Autostream - continuous improvement from their earliest models - Duplex s.s. construction with low corrosion - simple and very nice engineering. I like this - seals are simple O-rings at blade hubs with delrin bushings - independent reverse/fwd. pitch, easily adjustable with a wrench and allen key underwater - I don't think their blade area is anything different from Maxprop J-Prop - asked for price from Quebec distributor (out of sight) so didn't think about it further So you did not really look at it. :-). All Feathering props: - must exchange blades to change pitch; usually time limit on this I do not get this. So far I can understand and have some experience you can change the pitch on most feathering props, and many of them allow it to be done without removing the propeller and even under the water and some allow you to have different pitch on reverse and forward. - can't change pitch if boat more loaded/fouled bottom Of course you have to dive under the boat to change the pitch. - lower efficicency in head seas/wind Lower compared to what? - best choice for racing oriented boats but not cruising boats IMO So what is the superior cruising propeller? Autoprop - bloody costly and fairly heavy Costly, will change the pitch automatically. Varifold - no opinion Evan Gatehouse - Lauri Tarkkonen |
Which feathering prop?
Hello Glen,
My suggestion is to look at the Flex-o-Fold prop. It is an interesting design with great customer suport from Chuck Angle who is the North American distributor located in Marblehead, MA. He should be at the Annapolis show. I had a Max Prop-2 blade and found that it's performance was ok in forward but woefully inadequate in reverse. I have a Paragon transmission (direct drive) that runs thru a Walters Vee drive. The reduction in forward is 2:1 (via the vee-drive) at the shaft, But in reverse the reduction is 4:1 (2:1 at the vee-drive plus 2:1 at the Paragon)! The two blade Max Prop, in reverse would turn at 500 rpm at 2000 engine rpm and 750 rpm at 3000 engine rpm. Backing down was a crap shoot. I replaced the two blade Max Prop with a three blade Flex-o-Fold two seasons ago and am amazed at the increased control in reverse-even with the idyosycracies of the Paragon/Vee drive reductions. An added advantage is that the prop is folding vs. feathering...I haven't snagged a lobster pot with the new prop. I've snagged numerous pot warps with the previous prop. By way of example, with a three bladeFlex-o-fold 17x16 I can stop the boat in 18 seconds from a speed of 5 knots with a reverse rpm of 2200-2500 and shaft rpm of ~ 600. Bringing the boat to a complete stop with the previous prop was a joke. Just my opinion "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message news:npj0f.64$784.63@lakeread08... I am headed for Annapolis Thursday at o'dark thirty. One priority is to find a 3 bladed feathering prop. The candidates a Martec Auto Stream , MaxProp, VariProp and Gori. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about any of them? Any others you would recommend I look at? -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com |
Which feathering prop?
Evan Gatehouse wrote:
All Feathering props: - must exchange blades to change pitch; usually time limit on this Oops - meant to say "FOLDING" not feathering props! Evan Gatehouse |
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