I just bought a new boat (to me) and have some head questions.

First some info:

Boat - Hunter 34, 1983

Head - Jabsco manual head

Now my problems and questions:

1. My toilet is filling up with water after it is pumped dry. I am
assuming this is fresh water (lake inlet) but am not usre

2. My holding tank seems to be filling up a lot faster than it should.
I have about a 20 gallon holding tank and it is full after a day sail
with light use. Keep in mind this includes a week's worth of sitting
without use.

3. I'm not familar with one part of the unit...Right next to the head
there is a manual pump. A hose comes in through a thru-hull and does a
loop that wraps back through the pump and to the holding tank. Is this
to pump out of the tank to the lake or the opposite?

Any help would be appreciated.

Your first mistake was buying a Hunter. sorry.
G
wrote in message
oups.com...
I just bought a new boat (to me) and have some head questions.

First some info:

Boat - Hunter 34, 1983

Head - Jabsco manual head

Now my problems and questions:

1. My toilet is filling up with water after it is pumped dry. I am
assuming this is fresh water (lake inlet) but am not usre

2. My holding tank seems to be filling up a lot faster than it should.
I have about a 20 gallon holding tank and it is full after a day sail
with light use. Keep in mind this includes a week's worth of sitting
without use.

3. I'm not familar with one part of the unit...Right next to the head
there is a manual pump. A hose comes in through a thru-hull and does a
loop that wraps back through the pump and to the holding tank. Is this
to pump out of the tank to the lake or the opposite?

Any help would be appreciated.

That's not a very nice answer. It's still a sailboat.

If working properly, the manual pump will pump whatever is in the bowl out,
and can also pump seawater into the bowl if desired. My experience is w/ a
newer Jabsco, but should be the same.

Sounds like your pump needs a rebuild kit, also a vented loop in the hose
between the top of the pump and the top of the bowl. I think the lake is
slowly filling your tank all the time.

"G&G" wrote in message
. ..
Your first mistake was buying a Hunter. sorry.
G
wrote in message
oups.com...
I just bought a new boat (to me) and have some head questions.

First some info:

Boat - Hunter 34, 1983

Head - Jabsco manual head

Now my problems and questions:

1. My toilet is filling up with water after it is pumped dry. I am
assuming this is fresh water (lake inlet) but am not usre

2. My holding tank seems to be filling up a lot faster than it should.
I have about a 20 gallon holding tank and it is full after a day sail
with light use. Keep in mind this includes a week's worth of sitting
without use.

3. I'm not familar with one part of the unit...Right next to the head
there is a manual pump. A hose comes in through a thru-hull and does a
loop that wraps back through the pump and to the holding tank. Is this
to pump out of the tank to the lake or the opposite?

Any help would be appreciated.

Sounds like your pump needs a rebuild kit, also a vented loop in the hose
between the top of the pump and the top of the bowl. I think the lake is
slowly filling your tank all the time.

I agree with your diagnosis, but only part of your recommended
cure....neither rebuilding nor replacing the joker valve can solve every
problem...in fact, actually doesn't solve 99.999% of problems.

Rebuilding the toilet (replacing all the rubber parts in the pump) will
not prevent water from flooding the bowl via an open through-hull if the
pump in left in the "wet" mode. In the absense of a vented loop, a
failed wet/dry valve (VERY common in Jabsco toilets unfortunately) could
allow water to flood the bowl even if the lever is in the dry mode...but
rebuilding the toilet won't cure that because the necessary replacement
part isn't in the rebuild kit. So as long the toilet is bringing in
flush water and pushing bowl contents out, rebuilding ANY toilet
(rebuilding a Jabsco for any reason is just throwing good money after
bad) would be a waste of time, energy and money.
--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://www.seaworthy.com/store/custo...0&cat=6&page=1
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304

I figured the rubber valve at top of the pump could leak and bypass water.
And you are certainly right about the possibility of the lever being left in
the wet position. My old boat csme with no vented loop, and if someone was
careless, the water would nearly fill the bowl.

"Peggie Hall" wrote in message
. net...
Sounds like your pump needs a rebuild kit, also a vented loop in the hose
between the top of the pump and the top of the bowl. I think the lake is
slowly filling your tank all the time.

I agree with your diagnosis, but only part of your recommended
cure....neither rebuilding nor replacing the joker valve can solve every
problem...in fact, actually doesn't solve 99.999% of problems.

Rebuilding the toilet (replacing all the rubber parts in the pump) will
not prevent water from flooding the bowl via an open through-hull if the
pump in left in the "wet" mode. In the absense of a vented loop, a failed
wet/dry valve (VERY common in Jabsco toilets unfortunately) could allow
water to flood the bowl even if the lever is in the dry mode...but
rebuilding the toilet won't cure that because the necessary replacement
part isn't in the rebuild kit. So as long the toilet is bringing in flush
water and pushing bowl contents out, rebuilding ANY toilet (rebuilding a
Jabsco for any reason is just throwing good money after bad) would be a
waste of time, energy and money.
--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://www.seaworthy.com/store/custo...0&cat=6&page=1
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304

Garland Gray II wrote:

I figured the rubber valve at top of the pump could leak and bypass water.
And you are certainly right about the possibility of the lever being left in
the wet position. My old boat csme with no vented loop, and if someone was
careless, the water would nearly fill the bowl.

So it's safe to assume that you DID install a vented loop? Which, btw,
should NOT be installed in the intake line between the thru-hull and the
pump..it has to go between the pump and the bowl...to replace the short
piece of hose the mfr uses to connect 'em. There are
exceptions...electric macerating toilets--in which case it's necessary
to add an electric solenoid valve--and some very high end manual toilets
that have dual pumps and don't have that short piece of hose.
--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://www.seaworthy.com/store/custo...0&cat=6&page=1
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304

wrote:
I just bought a new boat (to me) and have some head questions.

First some info:

Boat - Hunter 34, 1983

Head - Jabsco manual head

Now my problems and questions:

1. My toilet is filling up with water after it is pumped dry. I am
assuming this is fresh water (lake inlet) but am not usre

2. My holding tank seems to be filling up a lot faster than it should.
I have about a 20 gallon holding tank and it is full after a day sail
with light use. Keep in mind this includes a week's worth of sitting
without use.

3. I'm not familar with one part of the unit...Right next to the head
there is a manual pump. A hose comes in through a thru-hull and does a
loop that wraps back through the pump and to the holding tank. Is this
to pump out of the tank to the lake or the opposite?

Any help would be appreciated.

It sounds like you are syphoning or the joker has crap in it (no pun
intended). Check and make sure all the loops have anti syphon vents
that are not clogged.

In the meantime close all the head through hulls after each use or you
could sink the boat. If the toilet still fill its coming from the
holding tank.

wrote:

I just bought a new boat (to me) and have some head questions.

Hoooboy...
Head - Jabsco manual head

Now my problems and questions:

1. My toilet is filling up with water after it is pumped dry.

Most likely that's because the toilet is below the waterline, there is
no vented loop in the head intake, and you're leaving the pump in the
"wet" mode. See (download and print) the installation instructions and
operation manual for your toilet he
http://www.jabsco.com/prodInfo/overv...10-0000_ds.pdf


2. My holding tank seems to be filling up a lot faster than it should.
I have about a 20 gallon holding tank and it is full after a day sail
with light use. Keep in mind this includes a week's worth of sitting
without use.

Always flushing only in the "wet" mode and leaving the head intake
seacock open will do that.

3. I'm not familar with one part of the unit...Right next to the head
there is a manual pump. A hose comes in through a thru-hull and does a
loop that wraps back through the pump and to the holding tank. Is this
to pump out of the tank to the lake or the opposite?

I'm not sure from your description of it. Can you email me a photo or a
sketch of the installation? peg(dot)hall(at)sbcglobal(dot)net.

Any help would be appreciated.

Start by reading what passes for a manual at the link I gave you. I'll
be glad to answer any more questions after you've read it (and I'm 99%
sure your first will be "what's a vented loop?")

--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://www.seaworthy.com/store/custo...0&cat=6&page=1
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304

Peggie Hall wrote:

wrote:

I just bought a new boat (to me) and have some head questions.


Hoooboy...

Head - Jabsco manual head

Now my problems and questions:

1. My toilet is filling up with water after it is pumped dry.


Most likely that's because the toilet is below the waterline, there is
no vented loop in the head intake, and you're leaving the pump in the
"wet" mode. See (download and print) the installation instructions and
operation manual for your toilet he
http://www.jabsco.com/prodInfo/overv...10-0000_ds.pdf


2. My holding tank seems to be filling up a lot faster than it should.
I have about a 20 gallon holding tank and it is full after a day sail
with light use. Keep in mind this includes a week's worth of sitting
without use.


Always flushing only in the "wet" mode and leaving the head intake
seacock open will do that.

3. I'm not familar with one part of the unit...Right next to the head
there is a manual pump. A hose comes in through a thru-hull and does a
loop that wraps back through the pump and to the holding tank. Is this
to pump out of the tank to the lake or the opposite?


I'm not sure from your description of it. Can you email me a photo or a
sketch of the installation? peg(dot)hall(at)sbcglobal(dot)net.

Any help would be appreciated.


Start by reading what passes for a manual at the link I gave you. I'll
be glad to answer any more questions after you've read it (and I'm 99%
sure your first will be "what's a vented loop?")


A vented loop can be made from half of a 2 part "P" trap intended
for use under your kitchen sink. The proper style has a drain plug
on it's normal bottom.

The plug may be fitted with a shraeder valve, like on your bicycle
inner tube or car wheel if you care to roll your own. The shraeder
valve must be adjusted for a very low pressure seal by adjusting it
with a shraeder valve tool. You should be able to blow through it,
but not suck.

The vented loop is created by mounting the trap upside down on the
top of two vertical pipes connected to the remainder of the piping
in use. If vibration tolerant couplings are used, rigid pipe may
couple to other piping, or semi flexible plastic pipe. I would use
an MJ, or mechanical joint Have used several with excellent results.
The MJ was invented for the Diefenbunker, nuclear defence against
toilets backing up with over pressure shock waves. The p trap should
be situated at a point that does not usually go below the waterline,
but that is negotiable. It's function is to allow low atmospheric
pressure inside the piping to "suck in" air, thus defeating any
syphon effect which would otherwise occur.

Proper anti syphon loops are available in cast platinum at marine
stores. Lesser metals like bronze are almost as expensive.

You should be able to see if the head is pumping water into it's
self when you pump the pump. If it is, flip the little lever switch
you will find if you look, and pumping again, observe the head is
pumped dry and your tank will not fill so quickly. This limits
slopping contents when at sea. I not, you will need to replace, or
possibly only clean the duck billed, or joker valve. Buy one, since
you will need a spare, then disassemble the pump to replace it. If
the old one is torn or warped you will need to replace it, if not,
you may be able to clean it. It would probably tear the day after
you return the un needed spare, or be just wrong enough that it
won't work if you need it. This should illustrate why it is called
a joker valve. The joke would be on you.

Three lobed valves mimic heart valves, but without ligaments, are
not as reliable as possible.

Crap overboard when you can. A flexible snow slider carpet may be of
assistance keeping topsides clear for neccessary bodily functions.
It can be towed by floating line to rinse, and seized up using the
commissionaire knot, a crochet, over the bulwark to be used.

That funny, unused alladin clip on the backstay is to permit a good
rig to suspend the stern ladder horizontally for use as a sea head
frame with backrest "sissy bars" support and dinghy dock towing
harness. The horse shoe MOB float makes a good seat cushion. With a
proper umbrella, a shower curtain, the times, a good cigar, LED
headlight and an ipod, how could life be better than with an
autopilot and self tacking jib?

Clinging desperate and naked to it, you are legal to do that for
which fishes and birds need no license.

A proper harness developed from this arrangement might enable a sea
bath under way, even body surfing. Rinse with a fresh water
washcloth to avoid salt water boils. Wash clothing during rainy
periods. There is never enough toilet paper at sea, Billy.

Terry K

Thanks !

"Terry Spragg" wrote in message
news
Peggie Hall wrote:

wrote:

I just bought a new boat (to me) and have some head questions.


Hoooboy...

Head - Jabsco manual head

Now my problems and questions:

1. My toilet is filling up with water after it is pumped dry.


Most likely that's because the toilet is below the waterline, there is no
vented loop in the head intake, and you're leaving the pump in the "wet"
mode. See (download and print) the installation instructions and
operation manual for your toilet he
http://www.jabsco.com/prodInfo/overv...10-0000_ds.pdf


2. My holding tank seems to be filling up a lot faster than it should.
I have about a 20 gallon holding tank and it is full after a day sail
with light use. Keep in mind this includes a week's worth of sitting
without use.


Always flushing only in the "wet" mode and leaving the head intake
seacock open will do that.

3. I'm not familar with one part of the unit...Right next to the head
there is a manual pump. A hose comes in through a thru-hull and does a
loop that wraps back through the pump and to the holding tank. Is this
to pump out of the tank to the lake or the opposite?


I'm not sure from your description of it. Can you email me a photo or a
sketch of the installation? peg(dot)hall(at)sbcglobal(dot)net.

Any help would be appreciated.


Start by reading what passes for a manual at the link I gave you. I'll be
glad to answer any more questions after you've read it (and I'm 99% sure
your first will be "what's a vented loop?")


A vented loop can be made from half of a 2 part "P" trap intended for use
under your kitchen sink. The proper style has a drain plug on it's normal
bottom.

The plug may be fitted with a shraeder valve, like on your bicycle inner
tube or car wheel if you care to roll your own. The shraeder valve must
be adjusted for a very low pressure seal by adjusting it with a shraeder
valve tool. You should be able to blow through it, but not suck.

The vented loop is created by mounting the trap upside down on the top of
two vertical pipes connected to the remainder of the piping in use. If
vibration tolerant couplings are used, rigid pipe may couple to other
piping, or semi flexible plastic pipe. I would use an MJ, or mechanical
joint Have used several with excellent results. The MJ was invented for
the Diefenbunker, nuclear defence against toilets backing up with over
pressure shock waves. The p trap should be situated at a point that does
not usually go below the waterline, but that is negotiable. It's function
is to allow low atmospheric pressure inside the piping to "suck in" air,
thus defeating any syphon effect which would otherwise occur.

Proper anti syphon loops are available in cast platinum at marine stores.
Lesser metals like bronze are almost as expensive.

You should be able to see if the head is pumping water into it's self when
you pump the pump. If it is, flip the little lever switch you will find
if you look, and pumping again, observe the head is pumped dry and your
tank will not fill so quickly. This limits slopping contents when at sea.
I not, you will need to replace, or possibly only clean the duck billed,
or joker valve. Buy one, since you will need a spare, then disassemble
the pump to replace it. If the old one is torn or warped you will need to
replace it, if not, you may be able to clean it. It would probably tear
the day after you return the un needed spare, or be just wrong enough that
it won't work if you need it. This should illustrate why it is called a
joker valve. The joke would be on you.

Three lobed valves mimic heart valves, but without ligaments, are not as
reliable as possible.

Crap overboard when you can. A flexible snow slider carpet may be of
assistance keeping topsides clear for neccessary bodily functions. It can
be towed by floating line to rinse, and seized up using the commissionaire
knot, a crochet, over the bulwark to be used.

That funny, unused alladin clip on the backstay is to permit a good rig to
suspend the stern ladder horizontally for use as a sea head frame with
backrest "sissy bars" support and dinghy dock towing harness. The horse
shoe MOB float makes a good seat cushion. With a proper umbrella, a shower
curtain, the times, a good cigar, LED headlight and an ipod, how could
life be better than with an autopilot and self tacking jib?

Clinging desperate and naked to it, you are legal to do that for which
fishes and birds need no license.

A proper harness developed from this arrangement might enable a sea bath
under way, even body surfing. Rinse with a fresh water washcloth to avoid
salt water boils. Wash clothing during rainy periods. There is never
enough toilet paper at sea, Billy.

Terry K