Background: Mike McPherson posted a message on this forum titled "Rob
Dubin - watch for this scammer". I asked Mr. McPherson for more info
because I had never seen anybody actually attack a person in the Subject
line. After a couple of relatively vague answers, Mr. McPherson finally
provided the facts as he knows them. I personally know Rob Dubin and have
cruised with him throughout the Eastern Caribbean and the story that Mr.
McPherson provided did not ring true. As Ventana does not currently have
internet access, I sent Rob an email via hf radio with the messages posted
by Mr. McPherson on this newsgroup and by Mr. Nikacha on the SailNet board.
Rob responded and asked me to post his reply which I do so he

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To Mike McPherson et al. From Rob Dubin, s/v Ventana

I was recently made aware of some of the things being said about my wife and
me on this chat group and while I do not have internet access at the moment
I would like to respond as best I can via email. Specifically to Mike
McPherson's claim to have worked on my boat in Maeva Beach and to have
provided parts to me etc. Either someone impersonated me or Mr. McPherson is
out to trash someone he has never met. In either case he owes me a public
apology.

To be perfectly clear about this. I had no problem with my alternator in
April of last year. No one was ever on my boat to work on my alternator.
The entire story about someone bringing us parts etc, is totally and
completely false. None of what Mr. McPherson described EVER HAPPENED. This
is not a case of 2 sides to the same story. Mr. McPherson's story is 100%
fabricated. To my knowledge I have never met Mr. McPherson. I do not know
a boat named Boatsqueak nor do I ever recall hearing that name on any of the
radio nets. (I was a volunteer net controller on several radio nets both
last year and this year).

As an SSCA commodore I go out of my way to "leave a clean wake." In part
this means never leaving bad feelings behind you with the local population
and I defy Mr. McPherson to find ANY examples otherwise. I also attempt to
give back to the cruising community by writing articles for the SSCA
bulletin. There is no pay for writing for the SSCA bulletin. At my own
expense and with a considerable investment in my time I maintain a website
chock full of information to help those dreaming of cruising or those in the
process of outfitting a boat. (www.ventanasvoyage.com) Anyone who has ever
posted a query or comment to my website has received a personal reply.

While my business arrangement with Island Packet is really no one else's
business I will respond to Mr. Nikacha for the simple reason that those who
have taken my outfitting advice deserve to not be mislead by his statements.
Yes we received a discount from Island Packet and nearly 60 other
manufacturers whose products appeared in the video we made about outfitting
a cruising boat. Long after our boat and film were underway we were
approached by Practical Sailor who wanted to joint venture with us to market
the video. We told the manufacturers the video would get promotion from PS.
When Practical Sailor later realized the nature of our tradeouts they felt
their integrity had been compromised and they insisted we send out letters
to 60 manufacturers clearly stating PS was not involved. We sent the letter
they requested. We then proceeded with our video and 59 of the original 60
manufacturers chose to participate in the video.

We did not tell the manufacturers we would put them in video if they gave us
a discount. We told them quite specifically that we had selected their
product to be on our boat regardless of whether they gave us a discount or
not. We simply told them we would promote them well and it would be worth a
discount to be promoted in the video. Now after 8 years of cruising we are
still pleased with our Island Packet and how we outfitted it. Our
recommendations have sold a bunch of boats and lots of other products and I
consider this a win- win- win situation. The manufacturers have done well,
I have done well and those who followed our outfitting suggestions have
bought quality products that hopefully will help them enjoy their own boats.

I look forward to an explanation from Mr. McPherson and I will be happy to
respond to any questions regarding the above statements.

Rob Dubin
s/v Ventana


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So there you have it Messrs. McPherson and Nikacha...if you would like to
reply, I will be glad to act as relay to Ventana.

Regards-
Charlie

Charlie J wrote:
... I had never seen anybody actually attack a person
in the Subject line ...

Really? How long have you been reading Usenet? Unfortunately this sort of
thing is rather common (in both senses).

--
Good luck and good sailing.
s/v Kerry Deare of Barnegat
http://kerrydeare.tripod.com

Oh well that must be it. Rob Dubin knows nothing at all about any of this.
Rob - If you really want to sort this out you could (a) send me back the
parts you walked off with or (b) send me the money you owe. But then again,
this is a total fabrication isn't it. I am a liar, Mr. Nikatcha is a liar,
Practical Sailor are a bunch of liars as are Island Packet. Funny how the
only thing you own up to is the part which can be independently verified.
No Rob and Charlie, the guys driving the taxis and other locals being
mistreated by Dubin are not going to write into this forum and probably
wouldn't know the name of the person who conned them even if they could.
The only thing that can be independently verified Dubin now confesses to and
I think that in and of itself is more than sufficient to indicate the man's
lack of integrity.. If he worked for the NY times (or any other reputable
media group) he would have been thrown out and become the laughing stock of
the industry. Let's take a look a Dubin's side of this verifiable portion
of his story.

I have now gotten a copy of Dubin's lame video thanks to a reader of this
group. In the video Dubin promotes specific products as if he has personal
knowledge of them and their performance. The idea presented in that these
have been carefully selected by Dubin based on his years of cruising
experience and represent only the best. Nowhere is there a mention of
donations in exchange for promotional consideration. Such a statement would
be considered a basic minimum by any reputable producer in any media.
Additionally, it is very likely that the way this video is presented, and
the lack of such a statement is a violation of law. It is intentionally a
VERY misleading video and that immoral at best and almost certainly illegal
when taken to this degree.

According to Dubin "Long after our boat and film were underway we were
approached by Practical Sailor who wanted to joint venture with us to market
the video".

Problem #1 - Right Rob. How would they have even known about it? PS is not
in this kind of business.
Problem #2 - Dubin uses the Practical Sailor name to solicit more donations
from the manufacturers for his personal use. Hello! Does anyone but myself,
Mr. Nikatcha and Practical Sailor see a conflict of interest here?
Problem #3 - PS suddenly feels their "integrity had been compromised" by
their association with you? Why would this possibly be? Hadn't they come
to you? Hadn't you told them exactly what you were doing?
Problem #4 - "59 of the original 60 manufacturers chose to participate in
the video". How many of these companies had already shipped you their
products? By your own admission you already had the boat and were making
the video. Obviously you have received donations well before the
manufacturers were given the opportunity to back out.

Perhaps best of all is list of the many ways in which Dubin "gives back to
the cruising community".
1. He writes articles for the SSCA without pay. Of course you do. How else
are you going to be in a position to exchange positive comments in these
articles for discounts or free equipment from the manufacturers. This sure
helps out us cruisers - thanks a lot for all that effort.
2. At "considerable investment in my time I maintain a website chock full
of information to help those dreaming of cruising or those in the process of
outfitting a boat." I ask you all, is this one arrogant *&#$%#$* or what.
Worst of all, I think the guy is actually serious.

Last but not least, I think it might be worth contacting the SSCA to see how
they feel about their "Commodore"s using the SSCA name and position as a
sort of defacto endorsement of the promotion of particular manufacturers in
exchage for free equipment. Practical Sailor got ****ed for a reason. Nuff
said. And Rob - as for my $$$. Forget it. Finding out just what a serious
slim bag you are with all this video stuff was work 10x that amount.

Mike



"Charlie J" wrote in message
...
Background: Mike McPherson posted a message on this forum titled "Rob
Dubin - watch for this scammer". I asked Mr. McPherson for more info
because I had never seen anybody actually attack a person in the Subject
line. After a couple of relatively vague answers, Mr. McPherson finally
provided the facts as he knows them. I personally know Rob Dubin and have
cruised with him throughout the Eastern Caribbean and the story that Mr.
McPherson provided did not ring true. As Ventana does not currently have
internet access, I sent Rob an email via hf radio with the messages posted
by Mr. McPherson on this newsgroup and by Mr. Nikacha on the SailNet
board.
Rob responded and asked me to post his reply which I do so he

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To Mike McPherson et al. From Rob Dubin, s/v Ventana

I was recently made aware of some of the things being said about my wife
and
me on this chat group and while I do not have internet access at the
moment
I would like to respond as best I can via email. Specifically to Mike
McPherson's claim to have worked on my boat in Maeva Beach and to have
provided parts to me etc. Either someone impersonated me or Mr. McPherson
is
out to trash someone he has never met. In either case he owes me a public
apology.

To be perfectly clear about this. I had no problem with my alternator in
April of last year. No one was ever on my boat to work on my alternator.
The entire story about someone bringing us parts etc, is totally and
completely false. None of what Mr. McPherson described EVER HAPPENED.
This
is not a case of 2 sides to the same story. Mr. McPherson's story is 100%
fabricated. To my knowledge I have never met Mr. McPherson. I do not
know
a boat named Boatsqueak nor do I ever recall hearing that name on any of
the
radio nets. (I was a volunteer net controller on several radio nets both
last year and this year).

As an SSCA commodore I go out of my way to "leave a clean wake." In part
this means never leaving bad feelings behind you with the local population
and I defy Mr. McPherson to find ANY examples otherwise. I also attempt
to
give back to the cruising community by writing articles for the SSCA
bulletin. There is no pay for writing for the SSCA bulletin. At my own
expense and with a considerable investment in my time I maintain a website
chock full of information to help those dreaming of cruising or those in
the
process of outfitting a boat. (www.ventanasvoyage.com) Anyone who has
ever
posted a query or comment to my website has received a personal reply.

While my business arrangement with Island Packet is really no one else's
business I will respond to Mr. Nikacha for the simple reason that those
who
have taken my outfitting advice deserve to not be mislead by his
statements.
Yes we received a discount from Island Packet and nearly 60 other
manufacturers whose products appeared in the video we made about
outfitting
a cruising boat. Long after our boat and film were underway we were
approached by Practical Sailor who wanted to joint venture with us to
market
the video. We told the manufacturers the video would get promotion from
PS.
When Practical Sailor later realized the nature of our tradeouts they felt
their integrity had been compromised and they insisted we send out letters
to 60 manufacturers clearly stating PS was not involved. We sent the
letter
they requested. We then proceeded with our video and 59 of the original
60
manufacturers chose to participate in the video.

We did not tell the manufacturers we would put them in video if they gave
us
a discount. We told them quite specifically that we had selected their
product to be on our boat regardless of whether they gave us a discount or
not. We simply told them we would promote them well and it would be worth
a
discount to be promoted in the video. Now after 8 years of cruising we
are
still pleased with our Island Packet and how we outfitted it. Our
recommendations have sold a bunch of boats and lots of other products and
I
consider this a win- win- win situation. The manufacturers have done
well,
I have done well and those who followed our outfitting suggestions have
bought quality products that hopefully will help them enjoy their own
boats.

I look forward to an explanation from Mr. McPherson and I will be happy to
respond to any questions regarding the above statements.

Rob Dubin
s/v Ventana


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-------
So there you have it Messrs. McPherson and Nikacha...if you would like to
reply, I will be glad to act as relay to Ventana.

Regards-
Charlie

I have watched the comments on Rob Dubin and would like to weigh in with
what I do know. First off, I should say that I have personal knowledge of
Mr. Dubin's video adventures as I was employed by one of the companies
featured in his video at the time he solicited equipment. I also, have
encountered s/v Boatsqueak in my voyages. While I do not know the latter
personally, I can assure you that he does exist and is (or at least was)
actively cruising with his wife.

Sadly, it is not all that uncommon for various marine writers to contact
manufacturers directly and ask for discounts on equipment. I don't think
this fact alone should surprise anyone. Generally, these are simply
requests made on a personal level and no reciprocation is offered, at least
not blatently. In my company, in such cases, the head of marketing may or
may not give a discount with the decision being made on how well he liked
the person making the request.

I think it fair to say that Mr. Dubin's request went well beyond anything
either customary or appropriate. To the best of my knowledge, our first
communication with Mr. Dubin regarding his video was by way of a letter he
sent. I do not have a copy of that letter but remember that it definately
emphasized the significant participation of Practical Sailor. What was
really over the top was that he came straight out and said that the bigger
the discount given, the longer and more favorable the air time our product
would receive on the video. The letter made cliched references to things
like "only the best manufacturers are being offered the opportunity to
participate". The letter got passed around a little as no one could quite
believe the chutzpa and then went into the trash.

That apparently wasn't the end of it though as, after a phone call or two
was placed by Dubin to our head of marketing, the decision was made to give
him the product at no charge. I was not in on the phone call(s) but was
later told that the product was being given not so much out of a desire to
be in the video as a fear of retribution from Practical Sailor and/or the
SSCA whose name was also bandied about.

A week or two after the product was sent, we received another letter from
Dubin saying something to the effect that there had been a misunderstanding
and that Practical Sailor actually had nothing to do with the project. A
phone call to Practical Sailor confirmed that they had received a request
from Dubin to distribute the video but had declined. They were outraged by
the use of their name and talking legal action. We never do hear from the
SSCA and figured it was best to simply let the thing die.

Dubin did produce a video of sorts but, to the best of my knowledge, was
never disrtibuted in numbers sufficient to effect sales either positively or
negatively. I think it is important for readers of this group to realized
that when a request for favor is made by someone closely associated with any
industry media (including the SSCA newsletter) manufacturers are put into a
very difficult position. I would guess that the participation of most of
the manufacturers was, as was ours, prompted not so much by a wish to be
part of the video as by a wish to not garner disfavor among the media.

While I would not use the same colorful termonology as Mike on Boatsqueak, I
have to agree with his position on Mr. Dubin's integrity. As a final note,
anyone out there who is associated with the SSCA might want to consider
affecting a policy to ensure that this kind of thing is not repeated in the
future.

Leo Delaney

Yes, usually two sides of a story always seems to meet in the middle.
Friend of mine that produces a marine product has similar stories. He
employs 3 or 4 people fulltime with benefits (costly in the USA) and
advertises on a relatively small scale to keep overheads down. Most of
their competitors are set up as tax writeoffs for larger companies
(often not even remotely nautical in theme) so these particular
competitors can definately pay out the necessary tens of thousands for
the inside or back covers when they advertise. Apparently his company
are continually solicited for freebies with promises of this or that
that rarely are followed through. This turns out to be disappointing
for the smaller businesses that would look at these situations as a
way of good advertising. They apparently now only donate or reduce
price if its an educational institution or for the lack of better
words, non-profit or environmental.
Gerald

"Leo Delaney" wrote in message .com...
I have watched the comments on Rob Dubin and would like to weigh in with
what I do know. First off, I should say that I have personal knowledge of
Mr. Dubin's video adventures as I was employed by one of the companies
featured in his video at the time he solicited equipment. I also, have
encountered s/v Boatsqueak in my voyages. While I do not know the latter
personally, I can assure you that he does exist and is (or at least was)
actively cruising with his wife.

Sadly, it is not all that uncommon for various marine writers to contact
manufacturers directly and ask for discounts on equipment. I don't think
this fact alone should surprise anyone. Generally, these are simply
requests made on a personal level and no reciprocation is offered, at least
not blatently. In my company, in such cases, the head of marketing may or
may not give a discount with the decision being made on how well he liked
the person making the request.

I think it fair to say that Mr. Dubin's request went well beyond anything
either customary or appropriate. To the best of my knowledge, our first
communication with Mr. Dubin regarding his video was by way of a letter he
sent. I do not have a copy of that letter but remember that it definately
emphasized the significant participation of Practical Sailor. What was
really over the top was that he came straight out and said that the bigger
the discount given, the longer and more favorable the air time our product
would receive on the video. The letter made cliched references to things
like "only the best manufacturers are being offered the opportunity to
participate". The letter got passed around a little as no one could quite
believe the chutzpa and then went into the trash.

That apparently wasn't the end of it though as, after a phone call or two
was placed by Dubin to our head of marketing, the decision was made to give
him the product at no charge. I was not in on the phone call(s) but was
later told that the product was being given not so much out of a desire to
be in the video as a fear of retribution from Practical Sailor and/or the
SSCA whose name was also bandied about.

A week or two after the product was sent, we received another letter from
Dubin saying something to the effect that there had been a misunderstanding
and that Practical Sailor actually had nothing to do with the project. A
phone call to Practical Sailor confirmed that they had received a request
from Dubin to distribute the video but had declined. They were outraged by
the use of their name and talking legal action. We never do hear from the
SSCA and figured it was best to simply let the thing die.

Dubin did produce a video of sorts but, to the best of my knowledge, was
never disrtibuted in numbers sufficient to effect sales either positively or
negatively. I think it is important for readers of this group to realized
that when a request for favor is made by someone closely associated with any
industry media (including the SSCA newsletter) manufacturers are put into a
very difficult position. I would guess that the participation of most of
the manufacturers was, as was ours, prompted not so much by a wish to be
part of the video as by a wish to not garner disfavor among the media.

While I would not use the same colorful termonology as Mike on Boatsqueak, I
have to agree with his position on Mr. Dubin's integrity. As a final note,
anyone out there who is associated with the SSCA might want to consider
affecting a policy to ensure that this kind of thing is not repeated in the
future.

Leo Delaney

I have watched the comments on Rob Dubin and . . . .

OK, "Leo" or whoever you are. Please stop spamming. Let it rest.

Subject: Yet another side of the Rob Dubin story
From:

OK, "Leo" or whoever you are. Please stop spamming. Let it rest.


Stroke alert!

Capt. Bill

Sorry, but this guy just sounds wrong.



To Mike McPherson et al. From Rob Dubin, s/v Ventana

I was recently made aware of some of the things being said about my wife
and
me on this chat group and while I do not have internet access at the
moment
I would like to respond as best I can via email. Specifically to Mike
McPherson's claim to have worked on my boat in Maeva Beach and to have
provided parts to me etc. Either someone impersonated me or Mr. McPherson
is
out to trash someone he has never met. In either case he owes me a public
apology.

To be perfectly clear about this. I had no problem with my alternator in
April of last year. No one was ever on my boat to work on my alternator.
The entire story about someone bringing us parts etc, is totally and
completely false. None of what Mr. McPherson described EVER HAPPENED.
This
is not a case of 2 sides to the same story. Mr. McPherson's story is 100%
fabricated. To my knowledge I have never met Mr. McPherson. I do not
know
a boat named Boatsqueak nor do I ever recall hearing that name on any of
the
radio nets. (I was a volunteer net controller on several radio nets both
last year and this year).

As an SSCA commodore I go out of my way to "leave a clean wake." In part
this means never leaving bad feelings behind you with the local population
and I defy Mr. McPherson to find ANY examples otherwise. I also attempt
to
give back to the cruising community by writing articles for the SSCA
bulletin. There is no pay for writing for the SSCA bulletin. At my own
expense and with a considerable investment in my time I maintain a website
chock full of information to help those dreaming of cruising or those in
the
process of outfitting a boat. (www.ventanasvoyage.com) Anyone who has
ever
posted a query or comment to my website has received a personal reply.

While my business arrangement with Island Packet is really no one else's
business I will respond to Mr. Nikacha for the simple reason that those
who
have taken my outfitting advice deserve to not be mislead by his
statements.
Yes we received a discount from Island Packet and nearly 60 other
manufacturers whose products appeared in the video we made about
outfitting
a cruising boat. Long after our boat and film were underway we were
approached by Practical Sailor who wanted to joint venture with us to
market
the video. We told the manufacturers the video would get promotion from
PS.
When Practical Sailor later realized the nature of our tradeouts they felt
their integrity had been compromised and they insisted we send out letters
to 60 manufacturers clearly stating PS was not involved. We sent the
letter
they requested. We then proceeded with our video and 59 of the original
60
manufacturers chose to participate in the video.

We did not tell the manufacturers we would put them in video if they gave
us
a discount. We told them quite specifically that we had selected their
product to be on our boat regardless of whether they gave us a discount or
not. We simply told them we would promote them well and it would be worth
a
discount to be promoted in the video. Now after 8 years of cruising we
are
still pleased with our Island Packet and how we outfitted it. Our
recommendations have sold a bunch of boats and lots of other products and
I
consider this a win- win- win situation. The manufacturers have done
well,
I have done well and those who followed our outfitting suggestions have
bought quality products that hopefully will help them enjoy their own
boats.

I look forward to an explanation from Mr. McPherson and I will be happy to
respond to any questions regarding the above statements.

Rob Dubin
s/v Ventana


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-------
So there you have it Messrs. McPherson and Nikacha...if you would like to
reply, I will be glad to act as relay to Ventana.

Regards-
Charlie