I recently bought a Tartan 30, and I'm very happy with it. The noisy
mast however is driving me crazy. All the halyards run outside the
mast, and I can bungee them silent, but the masthead lights and
antenna are wired inside the mast and clang continiously.
Is there a standard fix for this? I am considering covering the
wires with foam pipe insulation and cable ties. Anyone out there have
any experience, suggestions or comments? Will I be trading thuds for
clangs?

Jayhearts

A couple of choices neither of which is easy and start by pull the mast
and removing the wire.

#1: Get some PVC conduit and assemble it alongside the mast with
junction boxes at the height of the spreader and steaming lights and on
up to the masthead. Roll the mast front side down and slip the conduit
inside the mast. Drill a hole along side the conduit and slip a wire
hook through to hold the conduit while you drill and pop rivit the
conduit in place then seal the first hole with a pop rivit.

#2: If you don't want to go to all that trouble, bundle the wires with
three heavy duty plastic wire ties every 3 or 4 feet with the tie ends
sticking out 120 degrees from each other. Leave the ends long and pull
the wire back through. The wire ties will hold the wires off the sides
of the mast.

jayhearts wrote:
I recently bought a Tartan 30, and I'm very happy with it. The noisy
mast however is driving me crazy. All the halyards run outside the
mast, and I can bungee them silent, but the masthead lights and
antenna are wired inside the mast and clang continiously.
Is there a standard fix for this? I am considering covering the
wires with foam pipe insulation and cable ties. Anyone out there have
any experience, suggestions or comments? Will I be trading thuds for
clangs?

Jayhearts


--
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com
Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com

My wiring is run through 1 1/8" ID foam pipe insulation that you can find
at any Home Depot. Works quite well.

-- Geoff

(jayhearts) wrote in
om:

I recently bought a Tartan 30, and I'm very happy with it. The noisy
mast however is driving me crazy. All the halyards run outside the
mast, and I can bungee them silent, but the masthead lights and
antenna are wired inside the mast and clang continiously.
Is there a standard fix for this? I am considering covering the
wires with foam pipe insulation and cable ties. Anyone out there have
any experience, suggestions or comments? Will I be trading thuds for
clangs?

Jayhearts

If you add foam insulation, you will be adding weight to the wire bundle
which in your case, is unsupported except where the individual wires exit
the mast. The weight and constant motion will eventually cause the wire
stands to fatigue and break.

I like Glenns second recommentition but while you have the wire bundle out
of the mast. I recommend including an 1/8 synthetic cord, half hitched every
couple fee, down to at least the spreader wire exit. Followed by the long
stiff tie wraps.

Also, when you pull the wires out of the mast, pull in a line that will be
use to pull the wire bundle back into the mast. Leave that line in it's
exact orientation with the internal halyards, to make sure that you don't
end up with a halyard crossing over your wires. This could cause some damage
to the wire due to chaff or strain.

Another possible solution to the original problem would be pour-in-place
foam. Use those weather seal spray cans. and squirt it inside through any of
the existing holes. Use enough to fill the mast section in that area. After
the foam expands, Pull on you halyard (with a winch, if necassary) to free
them from the foam. That should leave a passage for them to run in the
future. This method wouldn't require removal of the mast, just a trip up in
a bos'ns chair.


--
My opinion and experience. FWIW

Steve
s/v Good Intentions

"Steve" wrote in
:

If you add foam insulation, you will be adding weight to the wire
bundle which in your case, is unsupported except where the individual
wires exit the mast. The weight and constant motion will eventually
cause the wire stands to fatigue and break.

Well, 5 years and 20,000 miles later this has yet to occur. I just had the
whole wire bundle out and saw no signs of what you're describing.

-- Geoff

jayhearts wrote:

I recently bought a Tartan 30, and I'm very happy with it. The noisy
mast however is driving me crazy. All the halyards run outside the
mast, and I can bungee them silent, but the masthead lights and
antenna are wired inside the mast and clang continiously.
Is there a standard fix for this? I am considering covering the
wires with foam pipe insulation and cable ties. Anyone out there have
any experience, suggestions or comments? Will I be trading thuds for
clangs?

Jayhearts

Glenn Ashmore wrote:
A couple of choices neither of which is easy and start by pull the
mast and removing the wire.

#1: Get some PVC conduit and assemble it alongside the mast with
junction boxes at the height of the spreader and steaming lights and
on up to the masthead. Roll the mast front side down and slip the
conduit inside the mast. Drill a hole along side the conduit and slip
a wire hook through to hold the conduit while you drill and pop rivit
the conduit in place then seal the first hole with a pop rivit.

#2: If you don't want to go to all that trouble, bundle the wires with
three heavy duty plastic wire ties every 3 or 4 feet with the tie ends
sticking out 120 degrees from each other. Leave the ends long and
pull the wire back through. The wire ties will hold the wires off the
sides of the mast.

#3) foam pipe insulation. I simply taped it closed as I pushed it up the
wires -- they didn't have to come out. (I DID have to clear some old
birds' nests before that worked, though). For the section above the
spreaders, take the head off and push down the wires. The weight is
negligible, perhaps half a pound in our case.

#1 has been called best by some experts, if you have a heavy boat and
already heavy mast and can drill the holes AND have the patience
necessary to support it. If the PVC bangs around, you get some real
noise. [That's the first time I heard of a junction box at the
spreaders: good idea, but that'll take some careful measurement.]

#2 is lightest, but if you have to replace one wire, you have to pull
everything out. Feeding to the spreaders & top of course requires two
pulling lines carefully coordinated

BTW, I stopped bungying (sp?) my halyards a couple of years ago: Got
three of the Shaeffer (I think) shroud cleats. Big eye for the shackle,
halyard gets tensioned and cleated off just behind. (We have wire/rope
halyards, so can't take them to the toe rail, my first choice.)

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

If you don't want or can't pull the wires. Run a snake through than pull a
messenger with foam blocks tied every few feet for the length of the spar.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 09 Oct 2003 00:22:24 GMT,
WestlakeY wrote:
If you don't want or can't pull the wires. Run a snake through than
pull a messenger with foam blocks tied every few feet for the length
of the spar.


The foam blocks work ok, but the *next* guy who wants to run new or
another wire there, has to deal with old, decaying urethane foam bits.
It's a real pain. I used the zip tie method recently, it has it's own
problems, but it doesn't rattle a bit. the pvc conduit is the best way,
as well as the most work. You can also run it up outside the mast if you
are careful wrt routing, but some folks don't care for the cosmetic
issues, and you still have to figure out how to keep the cable(s) snug
to the mast.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQE/iOh4d90bcYOAWPYRAil+AKDrzDd1Duyw4PuypMQoGxQ13AmZDg Cg1dMg
WFXNPATeVYpahHwrL3ZjE8c=
=PIi1
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

--
Jim Richardson http://www.eskimo.com/~warlock
I have plenty of talent and vision. I just don't give a
damn.

I like Glenn's PVC pipe, but how about smearing it heavily with a
loaded epoxy as you push it in? You don't need a lot of bonding.
(I've never tried this one.)

Rather than use pop rivets to attach PVC pipe, I like using black tie
wraps. You can run them in and out of a pair of 1/4" holes. A shaped
piece of steel will help convince them to bend around the pipe and out
the other hole. Pop rivets are harder and I'm afraid of the wire
chafing on the rivet.

I've also used u shaped bolts dragged into place with a line through
the holes, with help from a fishtape. This is easiest if you cut one
of the legs much longer than the other and pull it through first. Once
you have it in place, cut off the long leg. Use acorn nuts. This is
more satisfactory than either pop rivets or tie wraps on larger boats
where you may have a number of wires.

Even easier the first time is to use the tie wraps through two 1/4"
holes directly on the wires -- installing a pipe is a better long term
solution, though.

If you use foam or blocks, you want to make sure that they drain --
the last thing you want is a mast full of water trapped above the
spreaders.

Jim Woodward
www.mvFintry.com


Jim Richardson wrote in message ...
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 09 Oct 2003 00:22:24 GMT,
WestlakeY wrote:
If you don't want or can't pull the wires. Run a snake through than
pull a messenger with foam blocks tied every few feet for the length
of the spar.


The foam blocks work ok, but the *next* guy who wants to run new or
another wire there, has to deal with old, decaying urethane foam bits.
It's a real pain. I used the zip tie method recently, it has it's own
problems, but it doesn't rattle a bit. the pvc conduit is the best way,
as well as the most work. You can also run it up outside the mast if you
are careful wrt routing, but some folks don't care for the cosmetic
issues, and you still have to figure out how to keep the cable(s) snug
to the mast.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQE/iOh4d90bcYOAWPYRAil+AKDrzDd1Duyw4PuypMQoGxQ13AmZDg Cg1dMg
WFXNPATeVYpahHwrL3ZjE8c=
=PIi1
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

I did see a rather slick way of adding a conduit. The PVC was made up
with openings as needed and set in line with the mast on sawhorses. A
line was reeved through the mast and both ends tied to a big wad of
cloth. The wad would just fit inside the mast with some effort.

The conduit was rotated face up and a generous bead of construction
adheasive was applied over the whole length. The conduit was then
slipped into the mast and once properly located was rotated so that the
adheasive faced the inside mast surface. With the conduit held in place
with C-clamps at the ends the wad of cloth was then pulled back and
forth through the mast to make sure the conduit made good contact.

I don't know how well it held up but it was a slick idea.

Jim Woodward wrote:
I like Glenn's PVC pipe, but how about smearing it heavily with a
loaded epoxy as you push it in? You don't need a lot of bonding.
(I've never tried this one.)

Rather than use pop rivets to attach PVC pipe, I like using black tie
wraps. You can run them in and out of a pair of 1/4" holes. A shaped
piece of steel will help convince them to bend around the pipe and out
the other hole. Pop rivets are harder and I'm afraid of the wire
chafing on the rivet.

I've also used u shaped bolts dragged into place with a line through
the holes, with help from a fishtape. This is easiest if you cut one
of the legs much longer than the other and pull it through first. Once
you have it in place, cut off the long leg. Use acorn nuts. This is
more satisfactory than either pop rivets or tie wraps on larger boats
where you may have a number of wires.

Even easier the first time is to use the tie wraps through two 1/4"
holes directly on the wires -- installing a pipe is a better long term
solution, though.

If you use foam or blocks, you want to make sure that they drain --
the last thing you want is a mast full of water trapped above the
spreaders.

Jim Woodward
www.mvFintry.com


Jim Richardson wrote in message ...

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 09 Oct 2003 00:22:24 GMT,
WestlakeY wrote:

If you don't want or can't pull the wires. Run a snake through than
pull a messenger with foam blocks tied every few feet for the length
of the spar.


The foam blocks work ok, but the *next* guy who wants to run new or
another wire there, has to deal with old, decaying urethane foam bits.
It's a real pain. I used the zip tie method recently, it has it's own
problems, but it doesn't rattle a bit. the pvc conduit is the best way,
as well as the most work. You can also run it up outside the mast if you
are careful wrt routing, but some folks don't care for the cosmetic
issues, and you still have to figure out how to keep the cable(s) snug
to the mast.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQE/iOh4d90bcYOAWPYRAil+AKDrzDd1Duyw4PuypMQoGxQ13AmZDg Cg1dMg
WFXNPATeVYpahHwrL3ZjE8c=
=PIi1
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

--
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com
Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com