"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
"Capt. JG" wrote:

"Keith Hughes" wrote in message
.. .

Capt. JG wrote:
"Two meter troll" wrote in message
ups.com...

On Mar 16, 10:48 am, "Capt. JG" wrote:

"Two meter troll" wrote in
messagenews:1174066150.092432.101980@e65g20 00hsc.googlegroups.com...

Lying ahull?

Lying ahull is a very old technique for weathering a storm with
no sail up.
It's not used much any more, since it doesn't give you any
control. A better
technique is heaving to, which leaves sail up and gives you some
ability
to maneauver.

I agree that lying ahull is not a good thing to do. However heaving
to is not possible in all types of sailboats, or at least is more
difficult to do.

The basic technique for heaving to, is to tack from close hauled
without
releasing the jib, then ease the main, and lash the tiller to
leward or the
wheel to windward. This calms the boat down, and can be used to
stop for
lunch, etc.

Here's a long explanation of the various techniques...

http://www.boats.com/news-reviews/ar....html?lid=1284

--
"j" ganz

"heaving to" is a sea anchor and storm sail and "lying ahull" is
basicly adrift and depending on your boat running fair.


That's basically correct given that URL. Heaving to is doing
something to make the boat keep still in good orientation to the
waves. There are other techniques to do that and a sea anchor is one
of them.

Nope... read it again. Heaving to is using your sails and
rudder...
nothing to do with a sea anchor.

Nope, not according to the linked info. To quote:

"But, heaving to is most often done when the wind is really piping.
There
are three generally accepted ways to heave to in a sail boat: lying
to a
sea anchor or para-anchor; lying ahull; and, heaving to under
reduced
sail."

Keith Hughes

Huh?

Three ways:

It says there
"are three generally accepted ways to HEAVE TO in a sailboat"

and lists three ways

1) lying to a sea anchor or para-anchor
2) lying ahull
3) heaving to under reduced sail

Thus, heaving-to is under reduced sail and has nothing to do with a
sea
anchor.

We know what we mean by heaving to because we are sailors. But
that's
not what that passage actually SAYS.


He may have used the term heave-to (incorrectly) in the intro
paragraph, but lying to a sea anchor and heaving to (the technique)
have nothing to do with each other.

Type: define: heave to in google.

Actually, there's a fourth way to heave-to.... I always ask people to
do it on the leward side. g

I'm relatively new to sailing and I never heard of a leward side. Did
you mean leeward side? If you did then you're still not using the right
expression. I believe "lee rail" is what you puke over. But you needn't
worry about puking if you enjoy a steak dinner with baked potato wrapped
in tinfoil at Ted's of Beverly Hills Steakhouse where we like to put our
meat in your mouth.

I'm Ted Bell!

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 10:48:47 -0700, "Capt. JG"
wrote:

"Two meter troll" wrote in message
roups.com...
Lying ahull?

Lying ahull is a very old technique for weathering a storm with no sail up.
It's not used much any more, since it doesn't give you any control. A better
technique is heaving to, which leaves sail up and gives you some ability to
maneauver.

The basic technique for heaving to, is to tack from close hauled without
releasing the jib, then ease the main, and lash the tiller to leward or the
wheel to windward. This calms the boat down, and can be used to stop for
lunch, etc.

Here's a long explanation of the various techniques...

http://www.boats.com/news-reviews/ar....html?lid=1284

Good article. Some of this sounds all too familiar:

==============================================
Heaving-to
Heavy weather sailing

by George Day
Blue Water Sailing

Heavy weather wears on the boat, tears on the sails and gradually
takes a mighty toll on the crew. Exhaustion, from lack of sleep, from
worry and from the persistent roar of waves and wind, can be blamed
for more problems at sea than any other single cause. When you're too
tired to sail on, when the crew is feeling battered and sick, when the
boat seems to be overpowered, you will know it is time to stop for a
while and heave to.
===============================================

Almost prophetic in fact...

On 16 Mar 2007 13:06:23 -0700, "
wrote:

8 knots port to port
will require a fast boat and hard work

8 knots is about average for a fully crewed 50 ft racing sloop being
pushed hard around the clock.

Been there, done that.

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 23:14:40 GMT, Rosalie B.
wrote:

But if the power boat person is more of a
trawler-type person who is used to 8 knots, then 5 knots might not
seem to be so much slower. On paper at least.

There's a huge difference between an 8 kt trawler and a 5 kt sailboat.
A trawler does 200 nautical mile days almost effortlessly regardless
of wind and seas (up to a point of course). With decent weather it is
possible to predict ETAs with a reasonable degree of accuracy.

A sailboat must be managed constantly to maintain 5 kts and there is a
great deal of daily uncertainty because of changing wind direction and
speed.

"Capt. JG" wrote:

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .
"Capt. JG" wrote:
snip

Here's a long explanation of the various techniques...

http://www.boats.com/news-reviews/ar....html?lid=1284

"heaving to" is a sea anchor and storm sail and "lying ahull" is
basicly adrift and depending on your boat running fair.

That's basically correct given that URL. Heaving to is doing
something to make the boat keep still in good orientation to the
waves. There are other techniques to do that and a sea anchor is one
of them.

Nope... read it again. Heaving to is using your sails and rudder...
nothing to do with a sea anchor.

Nope, not according to the linked info. To quote:

"But, heaving to is most often done when the wind is really piping.

There
are three generally accepted ways to heave to in a sail boat: lying to a
sea anchor or para-anchor; lying ahull; and, heaving to under reduced
sail."


Three ways:

It says there
"are three generally accepted ways to HEAVE TO in a sailboat"

and lists three ways

1) lying to a sea anchor or para-anchor
2) lying ahull
3) heaving to under reduced sail

Thus, heaving-to is under reduced sail and has nothing to do with a sea
anchor.

We know what we mean by heaving to because we are sailors. But that's
not what that passage actually SAYS.

He may have used the term heave-to (incorrectly) in the intro paragraph, but
lying to a sea anchor and heaving to (the technique) have nothing to do with
each other.

Who is the HE you refer to as using the term incorrectly. You gave
this URL as an explanation. Why do that if you think that what is
written is incorrect?

I think the person who wrote the explanation is using 'heave to' in
the general sense of storm weather tactics.

Don't be so quick to criticize a non-sailor for actually reading what
is written instead of what you think was written. Because the point
is to explain what a sailboat would do in case of a storm differently
than what a power boat would do. The OP grasped quite quickly that
lying ahull would perhaps not be a wise idea, and why that would be
so. Why nitpick about what he is calling heaving to?

Note: It is necessary to practice heaving to just as anything else,
and while you might want to do it first in good weather, it might be a
good idea to try it sometime in heavy weather conditions. We do it
with the staysail and main or with the staysail and jib, and one of
the other people who has our type of boat says that one of those ways
is wrong. (I don't remember which he says is correct.) I'm pretty
sure that we don't use the main and jib, but I could be wrong about
that.

We also have a sea anchor, but have not practiced with it yet because
in the Chesapeake there's too much traffic for it to be needed. Plus
there's a lot of places to hide.

It's also a good idea to have the canvas reduced before you really
need to do it.

Type: define: heave to in google.

Actually, there's a fourth way to heave-to.... I always ask people to do it
on the leward side. g

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 21:12:59 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

A sailboat must be managed constantly to maintain 5 kts and there is a
great deal of daily uncertainty because of changing wind direction and
speed.

Unless it's a Mac 26M.

I'll be headed north in June from south Florida with my GB49. Let's
head out into the Gulf Stream together for two or three days of
around the clock passage making. We can compare notes and daily
averages when you get to Morehead City, NC.

Call me on the radio if you start falling behind and I'll make
sympathetic clucking noises. Bring plenty of fuel; marinas are a bit
sparse out there.

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 21:46:24 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

My preference is gunkholing in the Keys. You're welcome to tag along,
but a lot of it requires 18"' draft and beaching. We could race down
from Port Charlotte. I'll have plenty of gas, most of it used in the
Coleman stove. Have a good trip!

Well, that's what our dinghy is for - different boats for different
trips. We'll have to go through the Keys on our way north since the
Ortona Lock is scheduled to be closed on the Okeechobee Waterway.

http://www.cruisersnet.net/index.php...6_articleid=15

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 22:06:10 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 23:14:40 GMT, Rosalie B.
wrote:

But if the power boat person is more of a
trawler-type person who is used to 8 knots, then 5 knots might not
seem to be so much slower. On paper at least.

There's a huge difference between an 8 kt trawler and a 5 kt sailboat.
A trawler does 200 nautical mile days almost effortlessly regardless
of wind and seas (up to a point of course). With decent weather it is
possible to predict ETAs with a reasonable degree of accuracy.

A sailboat must be managed constantly to maintain 5 kts and there is a
great deal of daily uncertainty because of changing wind direction and
speed.

Unless it's a Mac 26M.

--Vic

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 22:03:08 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

Well, that's what our dinghy is for - different boats for different
trips. We'll have to go through the Keys on our way north since the
Ortona Lock is scheduled to be closed on the Okeechobee Waterway.

http://www.cruisersnet.net/index.php...6_articleid=15

Maybe they'll push it back to July, and you can traverse.
How do you like boating that piece?
Stopped there on the road once and had fried gator.
Pretty good.

It's an intersting trip if you don't do it too often, and it saves
well over 200 miles which translates to time and $$$s at today's
diesel prices.

We usually stay over at Roland Martin's Marina in Clewiston. The
local bar scene there is a hoot but bring plenty of skeeter repellant.
We donated a can to the band last time we were there just to keep them
playing.

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 22:33:30 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 21:12:59 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

A sailboat must be managed constantly to maintain 5 kts and there is a
great deal of daily uncertainty because of changing wind direction and
speed.

Unless it's a Mac 26M.

I'll be headed north in June from south Florida with my GB49. Let's
head out into the Gulf Stream together for two or three days of
around the clock passage making. We can compare notes and daily
averages when you get to Morehead City, NC.

Call me on the radio if you start falling behind and I'll make
sympathetic clucking noises. Bring plenty of fuel; marinas are a bit
sparse out there.

My preference is gunkholing in the Keys. You're welcome to tag along,
but a lot of it requires 18"' draft and beaching. We could race down
from Port Charlotte. I'll have plenty of gas, most of it used in the
Coleman stove. Have a good trip!

--Vic