I just installed a Standard Horizon HX850S handheld VHF radio (with GPS) as
a backup for our 25 watt fixed VHF. I checked out the VHF transmit and
receive function with a couple of radio check calls to local boaters and
reception was 5 by 5. (Actually the reception was better than that on my
fixed VHF).

Additionally, I wanted to check the DSC functionality of the radio by
placing a ROUTINE call to the local Coast Guard's MMSI number. However,
after transmitting the signal, there was no "acknowledgement" for 5 minutes
and I then cancelled the call. Tried it again later with a routine
transmission to the "Rescue 21" MMSI number - again no acknowledgement.

I was transmitting on the HI setting (6 watts) and was in sight of the local
CG building - so the transmission "should have" triggered the automatic
response. The HX850S is brand new out of a sealed box so I doubt it is
defective... but one never knows.

I really would like to be sure that I can rely on the unit for a distress
call - but of course I won't know that until I am in an distress situation
and push "the red button"!

Any ideas or suggestions on how to check the DSC funtionality?

"claus" wrote in
:

Any ideas or suggestions on how to check the DSC funtionality?



Call CG on Channel 16 VOICE and move them off to 22a, their working
channel. Ask them, point blank, why your call to them on 70 DSC got to
response. Ask them if they support DSC calls and why isn't it turned on.

I bet they don't even have a working DSC radio on Channel 70.....(c;

"claus" wrote in
:

Any ideas or suggestions on how to check the DSC funtionality?



By the way....before you make an issue out of CG's lack of DSC
operation, it might be a good idea to get your GMDSS Operator's License,
which is actually REQUIRED before operating a VHF DSC on Channel 70 in
the FCC regulations......(c;

Here's the regs:
http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/w...7cfr80_07.html

Here's what a NON-LICENSED boat VHF radio is allowed:
Section 80.13 (c):
" (c) A ship station is licensed by rule and does not need an
individual license issued by the FCC if the ship station is not subject
to the radio equipment carriage requirements of any statute, treaty or
agreement to which the United States is signatory, the ship station does
not travel to foreign ports, and the ship station does not make
international communications. A ship station licensed by rule is
authorized to transmit radio signals using a marine radio operating in
the 156-162 MHz band, any type of AIS, any type of EPIRB, and any type
of radar installation. All other transmissions must be authorized under
a ship station license. Even though an individual license is not
required, a ship station licensed by rule must be operated in accordance
with all applicable operating requirements, procedures, and technical
specifications found in this part."

Notice, CAREFULLY, what signals are allowed....Marine Radio (voice?) in
the 156-162 Mhz band, any type AIS, any type EPIRB and any type RADAR.

"All other transmissions must be authorized under a SHIP STATION
LICENSE".....INCLUDING GMDSS AND DSC data transmissions on Channel 70??

NOTHING is said about DSC or GMDSS, which your MMSI and DSC equipment on
VHF are a part of.....It's a kluged up mess!

HOWEVER, in the GMDSS section of the rules, it says:

"PART 80_STATIONS IN THE MARITIME SERVICES--Table of Contents

Subpart W_Global Maritime Distress and Safety System (GMDSS)

Sec. 80.1073 Radio operator requirements for ship stations.

(a) Ships must carry at least two persons holding GMDSS Radio
Operator's Licenses as specified in Sec. 13.2 of this chapter for
distress and safety radio communications purposes. The GMDSS Radio
Operator's License qualifies personnel as GMDSS radio operator for the
purposes of operating GMDSS radio installation, including basic
equipment adjustments as denoted in knowledge requirements specified in
Sec. 13.21 of this chapter.
(1) A qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated to have
primary responsibility for radiocommunications during distress
incidents, except if the vessel operates exclusively within twenty
nautical miles of shore, in which case a qualified restricted radio
operator may be so designated.
(2) A second qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated as
backup for distress and safety radiocommunications, except if the vessel
operates exclusively within twenty nautical miles of shore, in which
case a qualified restricted GMDSS radio operator may be so designated.
(b) A qualified GMDSS radio operator, and a qualified backup, as
specified in paragraph (a) of this section must be:
(1) Available to act as the dedicated radio operator in cases of
distress as described in Sec. 80.1109(a);
(2) Designated to perform as part of normal routine each of the
applicable communications described in Sec. 80.1109(b);
(3) Responsible for selecting HF DSC guard channels and receiving
scheduled maritime safety information broadcasts;
(4) Designated to perform communications described in Sec.
80.1109(c);
(5) Responsible for ensuring that the watches required by Sec.
80.1123 are properly maintained; and
(6) Responsible for ensuring that the ship's navigation position is
entered into all installed DSC equipment, either automatically through a
connected or integral navigation receiver, or manually at least every
four hours when the ship is underway."

See what a mess it all is? Typical Doublespeak......lawyers.

80.1073 (b)(6)----RIGHT THERE AT THE BOTTOM....is the key.....

A qualified GMDSS Radio Operator, and a qualified backup, as specified
in (a) MUST be:
(6) Responsible for ensuring the the ship's navigation position is
entered into all installed DSC equipment, either AUTOMATICALLY THROUGH A
CONNECTED OR INTEGRAL NAVIGATION RECEIVER (GPS) or manually at least
every 4 hours when the ship is undeway."

This section says you are REQUIRED to have a LICENSED GMDSS OPERATOR who
is responsible to see that DSC in your little VHF radio has the proper
position, even if your Garmin hand held is plugged into the little West
Marine VHF feeding it automatically lat/long......REQUIRED
OPERATOR....FOR DSC....no exceptions.

So, which GMDSS OPERATOR license do you need??

" (1) A qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated to have
primary responsibility for radiocommunications during distress
incidents, except if the vessel operates exclusively within twenty
nautical miles of shore, in which case a qualified restricted radio
operator may be so designated.
(2) A second qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated as
backup for distress and safety radiocommunications, except if the vessel
operates exclusively within twenty nautical miles of shore, in which
case a qualified restricted GMDSS radio operator may be so designated."

depends on if you go more or less than 20 miles offshore.....

NOTE - IF YOU GO 3 MILES OFFSHORE YOU ARE ALEADY REQUIRED TO HAVE A SHIP
STATION LICENSE FOR THAT VHF as that is in international waters....3
miles.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/do.html
GMDSS Operator's License.....just the operator who is allowed to make
front panel adjustments like putting MMSI in and calling distress.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/rg.html
If you never venture beyond 20 miles out from the USA shoreline.....


ANY operation of DSC on a pleasure boat in or out of US waters requires
a SHIP STATION LICENSE and at least a primary and backup GMDSS
Operator's Licensed operator...inside or outside that 20 mile limit.

More noise......
http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...b=operations_2
&id=ship_stations

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...b=operations_2
&id=ship_stations#What%20are%20the%20requirements% 20regarding%
20communications%20personnel%20aboard%20GMDSS%20sh ips?

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...b=operations_3
&id=ship_stations

GMDSS operations has NO EXEMPTIONS FOR UNLICENSED VHF STATIONS I can
find.....nada. Just pressing the red button isn't enough....ask the
FCC.....

"Larry" wrote in message
...
"claus" wrote in
:

Any ideas or suggestions on how to check the DSC funtionality?



By the way....before you make an issue out of CG's lack of DSC
operation, it might be a good idea to get your GMDSS Operator's License,
which is actually REQUIRED before operating a VHF DSC on Channel 70 in
the FCC regulations......(c;

Here's the regs:
http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/w...7cfr80_07.html

Here's what a NON-LICENSED boat VHF radio is allowed:
Section 80.13 (c):
" (c) A ship station is licensed by rule and does not need an
individual license issued by the FCC if the ship station is not subject
to the radio equipment carriage requirements of any statute, treaty or
agreement to which the United States is signatory, the ship station does
not travel to foreign ports, and the ship station does not make
international communications. A ship station licensed by rule is
authorized to transmit radio signals using a marine radio operating in
the 156-162 MHz band, any type of AIS, any type of EPIRB, and any type
of radar installation. All other transmissions must be authorized under
a ship station license. Even though an individual license is not
required, a ship station licensed by rule must be operated in accordance
with all applicable operating requirements, procedures, and technical
specifications found in this part."

Notice, CAREFULLY, what signals are allowed....Marine Radio (voice?) in
the 156-162 Mhz band, any type AIS, any type EPIRB and any type RADAR.

"All other transmissions must be authorized under a SHIP STATION
LICENSE".....INCLUDING GMDSS AND DSC data transmissions on Channel 70??

NOTHING is said about DSC or GMDSS, which your MMSI and DSC equipment on
VHF are a part of.....It's a kluged up mess!

HOWEVER, in the GMDSS section of the rules, it says:

"PART 80_STATIONS IN THE MARITIME SERVICES--Table of Contents

Subpart W_Global Maritime Distress and Safety System (GMDSS)

Sec. 80.1073 Radio operator requirements for ship stations.

(a) Ships must carry at least two persons holding GMDSS Radio
Operator's Licenses as specified in Sec. 13.2 of this chapter for
distress and safety radio communications purposes. The GMDSS Radio
Operator's License qualifies personnel as GMDSS radio operator for the
purposes of operating GMDSS radio installation, including basic
equipment adjustments as denoted in knowledge requirements specified in
Sec. 13.21 of this chapter.
(1) A qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated to have
primary responsibility for radiocommunications during distress
incidents, except if the vessel operates exclusively within twenty
nautical miles of shore, in which case a qualified restricted radio
operator may be so designated.
(2) A second qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated as
backup for distress and safety radiocommunications, except if the vessel
operates exclusively within twenty nautical miles of shore, in which
case a qualified restricted GMDSS radio operator may be so designated.
(b) A qualified GMDSS radio operator, and a qualified backup, as
specified in paragraph (a) of this section must be:
(1) Available to act as the dedicated radio operator in cases of
distress as described in Sec. 80.1109(a);
(2) Designated to perform as part of normal routine each of the
applicable communications described in Sec. 80.1109(b);
(3) Responsible for selecting HF DSC guard channels and receiving
scheduled maritime safety information broadcasts;
(4) Designated to perform communications described in Sec.
80.1109(c);
(5) Responsible for ensuring that the watches required by Sec.
80.1123 are properly maintained; and
(6) Responsible for ensuring that the ship's navigation position is
entered into all installed DSC equipment, either automatically through a
connected or integral navigation receiver, or manually at least every
four hours when the ship is underway."

See what a mess it all is? Typical Doublespeak......lawyers.

80.1073 (b)(6)----RIGHT THERE AT THE BOTTOM....is the key.....

A qualified GMDSS Radio Operator, and a qualified backup, as specified
in (a) MUST be:
(6) Responsible for ensuring the the ship's navigation position is
entered into all installed DSC equipment, either AUTOMATICALLY THROUGH A
CONNECTED OR INTEGRAL NAVIGATION RECEIVER (GPS) or manually at least
every 4 hours when the ship is undeway."

This section says you are REQUIRED to have a LICENSED GMDSS OPERATOR who
is responsible to see that DSC in your little VHF radio has the proper
position, even if your Garmin hand held is plugged into the little West
Marine VHF feeding it automatically lat/long......REQUIRED
OPERATOR....FOR DSC....no exceptions.

So, which GMDSS OPERATOR license do you need??

" (1) A qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated to have
primary responsibility for radiocommunications during distress
incidents, except if the vessel operates exclusively within twenty
nautical miles of shore, in which case a qualified restricted radio
operator may be so designated.
(2) A second qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated as
backup for distress and safety radiocommunications, except if the vessel
operates exclusively within twenty nautical miles of shore, in which
case a qualified restricted GMDSS radio operator may be so designated."

depends on if you go more or less than 20 miles offshore.....

NOTE - IF YOU GO 3 MILES OFFSHORE YOU ARE ALEADY REQUIRED TO HAVE A SHIP
STATION LICENSE FOR THAT VHF as that is in international waters....3
miles.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/do.html
GMDSS Operator's License.....just the operator who is allowed to make
front panel adjustments like putting MMSI in and calling distress.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/rg.html
If you never venture beyond 20 miles out from the USA shoreline.....


ANY operation of DSC on a pleasure boat in or out of US waters requires
a SHIP STATION LICENSE and at least a primary and backup GMDSS
Operator's Licensed operator...inside or outside that 20 mile limit.

More noise......
http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...b=operations_2
&id=ship_stations

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...b=operations_2
&id=ship_stations#What%20are%20the%20requirements% 20regarding%
20communications%20personnel%20aboard%20GMDSS%20sh ips?

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...b=operations_3
&id=ship_stations

GMDSS operations has NO EXEMPTIONS FOR UNLICENSED VHF STATIONS I can
find.....nada. Just pressing the red button isn't enough....ask the
FCC.....


GREAT SCOTT!!!

In article ,
"claus" wrote:

I just installed a Standard Horizon HX850S handheld VHF radio (with GPS) as
a backup for our 25 watt fixed VHF. I checked out the VHF transmit and
receive function with a couple of radio check calls to local boaters and
reception was 5 by 5. (Actually the reception was better than that on my
fixed VHF).

Additionally, I wanted to check the DSC functionality of the radio by
placing a ROUTINE call to the local Coast Guard's MMSI number. However,
after transmitting the signal, there was no "acknowledgement" for 5 minutes
and I then cancelled the call. Tried it again later with a routine
transmission to the "Rescue 21" MMSI number - again no acknowledgement.

I was transmitting on the HI setting (6 watts) and was in sight of the local
CG building - so the transmission "should have" triggered the automatic
response. The HX850S is brand new out of a sealed box so I doubt it is
defective... but one never knows.

I really would like to be sure that I can rely on the unit for a distress
call - but of course I won't know that until I am in an distress situation
and push "the red button"!

Any ideas or suggestions on how to check the DSC funtionality?

and what makes you think that the USCG actually has DSC fitted to ALL
their Remote Site VHF Receivers? USCG Comm Stations rarely have local
receives, and rely on Remote Site and High Site Receivers to provide
Area 1 coverage. the US is far behind, ever other country, in fitting
DSC into their Radio Systems. You should ask your CongressKritter,
why they haven't funded the upgrade for the last DECADE......

On Jul 14, 3:02*pm, Larry wrote:
...
Notice, CAREFULLY, what signals are allowed....Marine Radio (voice?) in
the 156-162 Mhz band, any type AIS, any type EPIRB and any type RADAR.

DSC is on marine VHF channel 70 at 156.525MHz. Hmmm... Anyway, in
practice you're almost certainly ok using DSC in US waters. For those
of us who travel internationally the rules are more than a little
funky but I haven't heard of anyone getting in trouble using the same
old licenses we've always carried...

When we left Honolulu the CG there didn't have operational DSC and
were relying on relays when DSC alarms were set off. So, it wouldn't
be shocking if the CG where Claus is doesn't have DSC either.

-- Tom.

"You" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"claus" wrote:
.. Tried it again later with a routine
transmission to the "Rescue 21" MMSI number - again no acknowledgement.


and what makes you think that the USCG actually has DSC fitted to ALL
their Remote Site VHF Receivers? USCG Comm Stations rarely have local
receives, and rely on Remote Site and High Site Receivers to provide
Area 1 coverage. the US is far behind, ever other country, in fitting
DSC into their Radio Systems. You should ask your CongressKritter,
why they haven't funded the upgrade for the last DECADE......

Surely, the CG must have DSC receivers in their much ballyhooed "Rescue 21"
system - at least that is what the relevant U.S. Coast Guard web page says,
viz.

"
Benefits to Boaters
Digital Selective Calling

No new equipment is needed for you to benefit from Rescue 21. The new
system will increase the Coast Guard's ability to respond to distress calls
in the coastal zone. However, you can help us improve response time by using
a marine-band VHF-radio equipped with digital selective calling (DSC). If
properly registered with a Maritime Mobile Service Identity (MMSI) number
and interfaced with GPS or Loran, the DSC radio signal transmits vital
vessel information, position, and the nature of distress (if entered) at the
push of a button. In an emergency, with one push of a button, your DSC radio
will send an automated digital distress alert containing your MMSI number
and position to other DSC-equipped vessels and rescue facilities. DSC will
provide a quicker and more accurate response by the Coast Guard."

On Jul 14, 3:56*pm, "claus" wrote:
...
Surely, the CG must have DSC receivers in their much ballyhooed "Rescue 21"
system - at least that is what the relevant U.S. Coast Guard web page says,
viz.
...

If you look around on that web page I think you'll find that only a
handful of groups have DSC numbers and not all of them are
operational. So, while the CG strongly encourages you to get DSC, by
and large they don't have them and they also are having lots of issues
with false alarms. Since DSC isn't reliable as an emergency calling
system and is much less useful than a cell phone I wouldn't even
bother with it. If you need help and are in VHF range use voice
otherwise use the EPRIB. AIS is very cool, IMO, DSC is FUBAR,
YMMV . Still, if you must DSC, I think Larry is right, call your
local group on the phone, or on 16 and switch to 22A, and ask them if
they are DSC operational.

-- Tom.

wrote in message
...
On Jul 14, 3:56 pm, "claus" wrote:
....
Surely, the CG must have DSC receivers in their much ballyhooed "Rescue
21"
system - at least that is what the relevant U.S. Coast Guard web page
says,
viz.
....
Still, if you must DSC, I think Larry is right, call your
local group on the phone, or on 16 and switch to 22A, and ask them if
they are DSC operational.

You will enjoy this - the local group (Seattle) don't even answer their
phone... they must be very busy....

Have you tried to contact the USCG office to see it they have a DSC radio up and running? In some locations the USCG do not have DSC setup for VHF yet.

Another way to test the HX850S is to program a MMSI of a radio that you know has DSC into the individual directory of the HX850S. Next, set a time when the user will be on the boat and test the HX850S by transmitting an Individual call to the other vessel.

I am quite sure the HX850S is working as not only have we confirmed operation before shipping, but also this morning I pulled a new radio from inventory and confirmed it is able to transmit and receive DSC calls.

I invite you to contact me at 800/767-2450 if you need further assistance.

Best regards,

Scott Iverson
Product Manager
Standard Horizon