Actually, You have all been a huge help. I like this newsgroup, I think
I'll end up hanging around and having you all help me fix up my
"junker!" :-)

And I don't exactly need saving, I don't think, hopefully. I know I'm
going into a potentially money pit kind of situation. But I think I like
the size of this boat a lot, and even though I loved the idea about
walking through marinas and finding owners who aren't using their boats
and might want to sell them, I stumbled on this deal, I haven't had the
time for that plan yet, and it looks like this Hunter could be a decent
boat at a decent price ($8000 with a main and a spinnaker both in good
shape), nothing earth shattering, but $15,000 is the lowest asking price
in the US for this same boat on boats.com and Yachtworld.com.

---

Review paragraph:

I'm the guy who grew up sailing between HI islands, who needs to get a
big enough, week/weekender, Puget Sound only, family cruiser with
mooring, survey, and essentials for under $10K, who started out asking
about a 68' Newport 30,' then asked about the Pivar Trimaran, and then
about the Hunter 33.' I'm hoping that the Hunter 33' is a serious move
up from the first two, better for my purposes than some 27 footer, and
will hold up for five or ten years with care, using it maybe ten or
twenty times per year. And if I decide to work on it and fix it up, I
stand a good chance of getting some of my money back - like a little
interest-going-the-wrong-way savings account. I'll be mooring it in my
little bay in South Puget Sound.

---

Tell me why I'm nuts so far, if you think I am.

Anyway I think what I really need to know most at this stage comes from
what I think is the best advice I've gotten on this newsgroup so far,
the boat and motor survey and sea trial I'm going to get next weekend. I
can still get out of the purchase if there is anything huge wrong:

-It sounds like some of you don't put a huge amount of confidence in
most surveyors. Is that anal or does that make sense? I'm using "Western
Marine Surveyors," Jerry Vanderner or something like that, in the
Olympia area, I think. Anyone know him?

-I'll be there too for the haul out, what specifically should I look
for? I went to the Hunterowners site and looked at owner reviews of
similar models and found some compression post support problems (I
think) and some deck crack and delamination problems, (I saw quite a few
very small cracks on the deck of the boat I'm getting), a few people had
to repair a blister here and there on the hull, some had no blisters. So
I'll be looking for those and tell the surveyor. What else? Any Hunter
Cherubini owners here?

-I'm hiring a highly recommended guy for $100, Diesel Dave at Swantown,
just to look at the Yanmar diesel.

-I figure I'll get a used storm jib, so what would be the second most
important jib/genoa I need? It might be a while before I can afford a
third jib.

-Tell me anything and everything you think I might want/need to know!

Stephen

Stephen Trapani wrote:
Actually, You have all been a huge help. I like this newsgroup, I think
I'll end up hanging around and having you all help me fix up my
"junker!" :-)

Remembering at all times, of course, the old gag about silk purses &
sow's ears.


And I don't exactly need saving, I don't think, hopefully. I know I'm
going into a potentially money pit kind of situation. But I think I like
the size of this boat a lot, and even though I loved the idea about
walking through marinas and finding owners who aren't using their boats
and might want to sell them, I stumbled on this deal, I haven't had the
time for that plan yet, and it looks like this Hunter could be a decent
boat at a decent price ($8000 with a main and a spinnaker both in good
shape), nothing earth shattering, but $15,000 is the lowest asking price
in the US for this same boat on boats.com and Yachtworld.com.

Hmm..mm another old gag about "if it sounds too good to be true" comes
to mind, but I don't want to be a total wet blanket.

Getting the engine checked out.. very good. Make sure he also checks out
the tranny, the coupling, stuffing box, etc etc... the total power plant
(although this will overlap somewhat with the surveyor)

The surveyor... yes he *will* miss things. All surveyors do. I'd look
for major structural problems, major systems problems, and then
concentrate on the sea trial... check for leaks around the deck &
cockpit VERY carefully... sail the boat hard and look for structural
flexing... *definitely* do a careful look for blisters, the worst
blisters I have ever personally seen were on a 33' Hunter Cherubini.
Surveying this boat is an all day job, 8 hours plus. The sea trial
should be almost as lengthy.

Compile a careful and deadly accurate list of everything you'd need to
fix (lifeline stanchion bases?) or replace (Steering sheave bushings?)
before actually using the boat, then take the time to cost it out very
carefully.

Hunters can be a lot of boat for the money, which is exactly what you're
looking for. It can also turn around and bite the life out of your
wallet! It sounds like you are taking all the right steps... other than
not buying a boat at all, which is logical but of course out of the
question

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

DSK wrote:

The surveyor... yes he *will* miss things. All surveyors do. I'd look
for major structural problems, major systems problems, and then
concentrate on the sea trial... check for leaks around the deck &
cockpit VERY carefully... sail the boat hard and look for structural
flexing...

Thanks for the advice. How do I look for that? Like sail with only the
mainsail to twisty the boat, and look where?

This boat hasn't been sailed for a while, I think. How do I make sure
the stays are close to right? Should I worry about that? It's
deckstepped with a compression post.

Stephen

Stephen Trapani wrote:
Thanks for the advice. How do I look for that? Like sail with only the
mainsail to twisty the boat, and look where?

You'll want enough wind to heel the boat at least 20 degrees, 30 would
be better. Look carefully at the joints between the hull & the
structural bulkheads, at the forward end of the saloon (on some boats,
the door jams... this is a sign of flexing) and at the forward end of
the cockpit. There should be no movement at all of the hull relative to
the bulkheads... unfortunately, at least a little movement is very
common... so the question then becomes "how much is too much?" If the
tabbing is cracking or already broken, that much can be fixed (in fact
it's not even very difficult although it's an unpleasant job) and will
restore some of the strength. But it's an issue because flexing causes
leaks, causes tremendous stress on other parts of the boat, and will
eventually lead to structural failure.


This boat hasn't been sailed for a while, I think. How do I make sure
the stays are close to right? Should I worry about that? It's
deckstepped with a compression post.

Getting the mast set up properly isn't an issue for the sea trial,
unless it's *really* hosed. But the mast tuning will affect things like
pointing, weather helm, and definitely speed. For the sea trial, be more
concerned about whether the rigging is sound & complete.

You'll definitely want to know if the compression post (and everything
it's connected to) is sound, It's relatively common for the compression
post to butt against a wooden beam under the coach roof, under the mast
step; and any wood structure in this area *has* to be totally dry &
sound. This is another area where structural flexing can be evident &
very destructive. One thing to look for is: are the shrouds & side stays
tight when at the pier, and then the lee side shrouds get very loose
under a press of sail? This is a sign that the mast is compressing
something in the hull that it shouldn't be.

Personally, I like to see every sail flown, to make sure that it has all
the rig components (you'd be amazed at how many people are carrying
sails around that they don't have sheets for, or the sheet lead is
comically inefficient) and isn't going to come unstitched the first five
minutes the wind gets her grip on it. How much of the running rigging
is going to need replacing? Do all the winches & clutches work? Turning
to the standing rigging (even more important) are the swaged terminals
about to break open? This is less of a worry if the standing rigging has
been replaced within say ten years. There are a lot of boats that have
been missing important pieces of the rigging for so long the owner has
forgotten it used to be there.

Most of the time, owners who don't sail their boats much do not have a
realistic picture of their boat. Many cannot tell you basic things about
their boat & it's systems... how many seacocks, where they all are; much
less exactly what they are for and the last time they were serviced...

You will not be able to learn *everything* about the boat during survey
& sea trial, but that should be the goal. You definitely want to see
every bit or wiring & plumbing & rigging do it's job, or fail in trying.
That way you won't have any (or at least, fewer) unhealthy and/or
expensive surprises later on. I hope this helps.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King