On Dec 31 2008, 9:00*pm, Curly Surmudgeon
wrote:
On Wed, 31 Dec 2008 16:34:47 -0800, hot-ham-and-cheese wrote:
On Dec 27, 11:38*pm, Curly Surmudgeon wrote:
On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:14:41 -0800, hot-ham-and-cheese wrote:
On Dec 27, 4:02*pm, D Murphy wrote:
wrote in
news:ede6df2a-5d07-4470-a012-
:

ÿ Will they be giving back the $28,000?

They should buy O'bamas senate seat.

That's not nearly enough money. It appears to be $25,000.00 minimum
for an appointed state job. State contracts sell for more. Senate
seats according to Blago are "****ing golden."

We have testimony in Federal court that state jobs and contracts
were sold in exchange for donations to Blagojevich's campaign.

The natural question would be; who was running that campaign and
just how much did the campaign managers know about it.

The answer is Blagojevich, Emanuel, Obama, and Wilhelm ran the
campaign. I find it hard to believe that any member of this team who
ran the budget, hustled donations, bought advertising, and met
regularly didn't know what was going on.

Did Obama not want to deal for the seat because he figured Blago
owed him? Or did he suddenly find some ethics? Time will tell.

I know I'm resting easier now that the Obama transition team has
finished its investigation into the Obama transition team and much
to my surprise found no evidence of "inappropriate" contact with
Blago. Case closed. At least until Blago gets convicted and decides
to sing like Rezko and the rest. Obama will be into his third year
by then.

--

Dan

CNC Videos - http://tinyurl.com/yzdt6d

Hopefully, the feds have made copies of the tapes because once the
new administration puts their guy in charge of the FBI...

Aren't you the guy who was going to support the new president?

--
Regards, Curly

He isn't the new president yet.

Then are we to believe that on January 21st you'll unreservedly support
Obama and lamblast Bush?

*Until then, he's a suspec, no?

I have no idea what a "suspec" is.

Because you are stoopid.

--
Regards, Curly
---------------------------------------------------------------------------*---
* * * *20 Days More of George Walker Bush Plundering the Economy
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- Show quoted text -

On Thu, 01 Jan 2009 06:49:15 -0800, hot-ham-and-cheese wrote:

On Dec 31 2008, 9:00Â*pm, Curly Surmudgeon
wrote:
On Wed, 31 Dec 2008 16:34:47 -0800, hot-ham-and-cheese wrote:
On Dec 27, 11:38Â*pm, Curly Surmudgeon
wrote:
On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:14:41 -0800, hot-ham-and-cheese wrote:
On Dec 27, 4:02Â*pm, D Murphy wrote:
wrote in
news:ede6df2a-5d07-4470-a012-
:

ÿ Will they be giving back the $28,000?

They should buy O'bamas senate seat.

That's not nearly enough money. It appears to be $25,000.00
minimum for an appointed state job. State contracts sell for
more. Senate seats according to Blago are "****ing golden."

We have testimony in Federal court that state jobs and contracts
were sold in exchange for donations to Blagojevich's campaign.

The natural question would be; who was running that campaign and
just how much did the campaign managers know about it.

The answer is Blagojevich, Emanuel, Obama, and Wilhelm ran the
campaign. I find it hard to believe that any member of this team
who ran the budget, hustled donations, bought advertising, and
met regularly didn't know what was going on.

Did Obama not want to deal for the seat because he figured Blago
owed him? Or did he suddenly find some ethics? Time will tell.

I know I'm resting easier now that the Obama transition team has
finished its investigation into the Obama transition team and
much to my surprise found no evidence of "inappropriate" contact
with Blago. Case closed. At least until Blago gets convicted and
decides to sing like Rezko and the rest. Obama will be into his
third year by then.

--

Dan

CNC Videos - http://tinyurl.com/yzdt6d

Hopefully, the feds have made copies of the tapes because once the
new administration puts their guy in charge of the FBI...

Aren't you the guy who was going to support the new president?

--
Regards, Curly

He isn't the new president yet.

Then are we to believe that on January 21st you'll unreservedly support
Obama and lamblast Bush?

Evading the corner you put yourself in?

Â*Until then, he's a suspec, no?

I have no idea what a "suspec" is.

Because you are stoopid.

Yeah, right, your illiterate ramblings are my fault. Just like Bush's
titanic ****ups are Obamas fault.

Looks like Rudy is another of your aliases, lying hypocrite.

--
Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
19 Days More of George Walker Bush Plundering the Economy
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

On Jan 1, 12:33*pm, Curly Surmudgeon wrote:
On Thu, 01 Jan 2009 06:49:15 -0800, hot-ham-and-cheese wrote:
On Dec 31 2008, 9:00*pm, Curly Surmudgeon
wrote:
On Wed, 31 Dec 2008 16:34:47 -0800, hot-ham-and-cheese wrote:
On Dec 27, 11:38*pm, Curly Surmudgeon
wrote:
On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:14:41 -0800, hot-ham-and-cheese wrote:
On Dec 27, 4:02*pm, D Murphy wrote:
wrote in
news:ede6df2a-5d07-4470-a012-
:

ÿ Will they be giving back the $28,000?

They should buy O'bamas senate seat.

That's not nearly enough money. It appears to be $25,000.00
minimum for an appointed state job. State contracts sell for
more. Senate seats according to Blago are "****ing golden."

We have testimony in Federal court that state jobs and contracts
were sold in exchange for donations to Blagojevich's campaign.

The natural question would be; who was running that campaign and
just how much did the campaign managers know about it.

The answer is Blagojevich, Emanuel, Obama, and Wilhelm ran the
campaign. I find it hard to believe that any member of this team
who ran the budget, hustled donations, bought advertising, and
met regularly didn't know what was going on.

Did Obama not want to deal for the seat because he figured Blago
owed him? Or did he suddenly find some ethics? Time will tell.

I know I'm resting easier now that the Obama transition team has
finished its investigation into the Obama transition team and
much to my surprise found no evidence of "inappropriate" contact
with Blago. Case closed. At least until Blago gets convicted and
decides to sing like Rezko and the rest. Obama will be into his
third year by then.

--

Dan

CNC Videos - http://tinyurl.com/yzdt6d

Hopefully, the feds have made copies of the tapes because once the
new administration puts their guy in charge of the FBI...

Aren't you the guy who was going to support the new president?

--
Regards, Curly

He isn't the new president yet.

Then are we to believe that on January 21st you'll unreservedly support
Obama and lamblast Bush?

Evading the corner you put yourself in?

*Until then, he's a suspec, no?

I have no idea what a "suspec" is.

Because you are stoopid.

Yeah, right, your illiterate ramblings are my fault. *Just like Bush's
titanic ****ups are Obamas fault.

Even an imbecile could have seen I short-stroked the "t." You are
dumber than an imbecile.

Looks like Rudy is another of your aliases, lying hypocrite.

Who is Rudy?

Cliff wrote in
:


No I don't. But there's this search engine called Google and if you
use it you can find loads of them. Like this one -

http://pardonpower.com/2008/12/can-p...on-he-has.html


That looks like bunkum.

Says you.

I did some searches g.

Did your car keys finally turn up?


Presidents can revoke pardons and commutations issued by other
presidents as well as ones they issued themselves.

HTH

HTH


Wow thanks for enlightening us.

--

Dan

CNC Videos - http://tinyurl.com/yzdt6d

Cliff wrote in
:

On 27 Dec 2008 21:02:48 GMT, D Murphy wrote:


I know I'm resting easier now that the Obama transition team has
finished its investigation into the Obama transition team and much to
my surprise found no evidence of "inappropriate" contact with Blago.

Neither did the federal prosecutor.

Fitzgerald never said any such thing.

They don't even like each other IIRC.

What does "like" have to do with it?

--

Dan

On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 02:41:20 +0000, D Murphy wrote:

Cliff wrote in
:

On 27 Dec 2008 21:02:48 GMT, D Murphy wrote:


I know I'm resting easier now that the Obama transition team has
finished its investigation into the Obama transition team and much to
my surprise found no evidence of "inappropriate" contact with Blago.

Neither did the federal prosecutor.

Fitzgerald never said any such thing.

Yes, Fitzgerald did:

“I should be clear that the complaint makes no allegations whatsoever
about the president-elect or his conduct�

They don't even like each other IIRC.

What does "like" have to do with it?

Exercise your own deductive reasoning skills. The answer is easy.


--
Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
20 Days More of George Walker Bush Plundering the Economy
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Curly Surmudgeon wrote in news:495db4a9$0
:

On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 02:41:20 +0000, D Murphy wrote:

Cliff wrote in
:

On 27 Dec 2008 21:02:48 GMT, D Murphy wrote:


I know I'm resting easier now that the Obama transition team has
finished its investigation into the Obama transition team and much to
my surprise found no evidence of "inappropriate" contact with Blago.

Neither did the federal prosecutor.

Fitzgerald never said any such thing.

Yes, Fitzgerald did:

“I should be clear that the complaint makes no allegations whatsoever
about the president-elect or his conduct�

Nope. All that says is that the indictment is about Blagojevich and makes
no claims about Obama.

Here is the whole quote:

"I should make clear, the complaint makes no allegations about the
president-elect whatsoever, his conduct. This part of the scheme lost
steam when the person that the governor thought was the president-
elect's choice of senator took herself out of the running. But after the
deal never happened, this is the governor's reaction, quote, "They're not
willing to give me anything but appreciation. Bleep them," close quote.
And again, the bleep is a redaction."

Later there was this exchange:

Q Would you please address one thing? And that is, when Blagojevich walks
out of here today, unless I'm mistaken about the constitution of
Illinois, he will still be governor. He will still have the power to make
the appointment to the Senate seat. He will still have the power whether
or not he's going to sign the bill that you are concerned about.

Also would you address the fact -- and I know you've referred to this --
would you just address whether or not President-elect Obama was aware
that any of these things were taking place?

MR. FITZGERALD: Okay. I'm not going to speak for what the president-elect
was aware of. We make no allegations that he's aware of anything, and
that's as simply as I can put it.

And the first part, my understanding is that he is the sitting governor
of Illinois today, now, and that is not something we have any say in or
control over. So at the end of the day, he will be the sitting governor.

Later yet:

Q You spoke before about if Senator -- you didn't know -- no awareness
that Senator or President-elect Barack Obama knew about this. So is it
safe to say he has not been briefed? And can you also tell us if any
phone calls were made to President-elect Obama that you intercepted, or
to Rahm Emanuel?

MR. FITZGERALD: "Okay. I'm not going to go down anything that's not in
the complaint.

And what I simply said before is, I'm not going to -- I have enough
trouble speaking for myself. I'm not going to try and speak in the voice
of a president or a president-elect.

So I simply pointed out that if you look at the complaint, there's no
allegation that the president-elect -- there's no reference in the
complaint to any conversations involving the president-elect or
indicating that the president-elect was aware of it. And that's all I can
say."

I see nothing in Fitzgerald's comments that definitively says "Obama's
transition team had no inappropriate contact with Blagojevich regarding
the Senate seat."

Quite the opposite in fact. How could Blagojevich be ****ed about Obama
not offering him something in exchange for the seat other than
"gratitude" if nobody from Obama's team had talked to Blagojevich about a
deal?

There is nothing ilegal about being approached with an offer to exchange
say an ambassadorship for Blago in exchange for Jarret getting the seat.
Nor is the Obama team even required to report it. But one would think a
change agent and reformer would report it. So apparently Obama is neither
of those things.


They don't even like each other IIRC.

What does "like" have to do with it?

Exercise your own deductive reasoning skills. The answer is easy.

In Illinois politics "like" has zip to do with anything. Think about
this: Why did Obama work so hard to get Blagojevich elected?

--

Dan

CNC Videos - http://tinyurl.com/yzdt6d

On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 22:06:50 +0000, D Murphy wrote:

Curly Surmudgeon wrote in news:495db4a9$0
:

On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 02:41:20 +0000, D Murphy wrote:

Cliff wrote in
:

On 27 Dec 2008 21:02:48 GMT, D Murphy wrote:


I know I'm resting easier now that the Obama transition team has
finished its investigation into the Obama transition team and much to
my surprise found no evidence of "inappropriate" contact with Blago.

Neither did the federal prosecutor.

Fitzgerald never said any such thing.

Yes, Fitzgerald did:

“I should be clear that the complaint makes no allegations whatsoever
about the president-elect or his conduct�

Nope. All that says is that the indictment is about Blagojevich and
makes no claims about Obama.

Here is the whole quote:

"I should make clear, the complaint makes no allegations about the
president-elect whatsoever, his conduct. This part of the scheme lost
steam when the person that the governor thought was the president-
elect's choice of senator took herself out of the running. But after the
deal never happened, this is the governor's reaction, quote, "They're
not willing to give me anything but appreciation. Bleep them," close
quote. And again, the bleep is a redaction."

Later there was this exchange:

Q Would you please address one thing? And that is, when Blagojevich
walks out of here today, unless I'm mistaken about the constitution of
Illinois, he will still be governor. He will still have the power to
make the appointment to the Senate seat. He will still have the power
whether or not he's going to sign the bill that you are concerned about.

Also would you address the fact -- and I know you've referred to this --
would you just address whether or not President-elect Obama was aware
that any of these things were taking place?

MR. FITZGERALD: Okay. I'm not going to speak for what the
president-elect was aware of. We make no allegations that he's aware of
anything, and that's as simply as I can put it.

And the first part, my understanding is that he is the sitting governor
of Illinois today, now, and that is not something we have any say in or
control over. So at the end of the day, he will be the sitting governor.

Later yet:

Q You spoke before about if Senator -- you didn't know -- no awareness
that Senator or President-elect Barack Obama knew about this. So is it
safe to say he has not been briefed? And can you also tell us if any
phone calls were made to President-elect Obama that you intercepted, or
to Rahm Emanuel?

MR. FITZGERALD: "Okay. I'm not going to go down anything that's not in
the complaint.

And what I simply said before is, I'm not going to -- I have enough
trouble speaking for myself. I'm not going to try and speak in the voice
of a president or a president-elect.

So I simply pointed out that if you look at the complaint, there's no
allegation that the president-elect -- there's no reference in the
complaint to any conversations involving the president-elect or
indicating that the president-elect was aware of it. And that's all I
can say."

I see nothing in Fitzgerald's comments that definitively says "Obama's
transition team had no inappropriate contact with Blagojevich regarding
the Senate seat."

Quite the opposite in fact. How could Blagojevich be ****ed about Obama
not offering him something in exchange for the seat other than
"gratitude" if nobody from Obama's team had talked to Blagojevich about
a deal?

There is nothing ilegal about being approached with an offer to exchange
say an ambassadorship for Blago in exchange for Jarret getting the seat.
Nor is the Obama team even required to report it. But one would think a
change agent and reformer would report it. So apparently Obama is
neither of those things.


They don't even like each other IIRC.

What does "like" have to do with it?

Exercise your own deductive reasoning skills. The answer is easy.

In Illinois politics "like" has zip to do with anything.

Generally, sure, but that doesn't prove all are corrupt.

Think about this: Why did Obama work so hard to get Blagojevich elected?

Did he? Seriously, I'm not blowing you off, I've seen no indication that
Obama worked "hard to get Blagojevich elected."

--
Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
15 Days More of George Walker Bush Plundering the Economy
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Curly Surmudgeon wrote in
:

Did he? Seriously, I'm not blowing you off, I've seen no indication
that Obama worked "hard to get Blagojevich elected."


Obama, Emanuel, and David Wilhelm ran his first gubernatorial campaign.
Obama came over after his guy lost in the primaries to Blagojevich. Obama
also endorsed and spoke for Blagojevich's reelection campaign in 2006,
long after it was known the Feds were breathing down his neck.

According to Rahm Emanuel, Emanuel, Obama, Blagojevich's campaign co-
chair David Wilhelm, and another Blagojevich staffer "were the top
strategists of Blagojevich's 2002 gubernatorial victory," meeting weekly
to outline campaign strategies.

Since all the bad PR from Blagojevich's indictment, Wilhelm says Emanuel
"overstated" Obama's role. Before the scandal broke Wilhelm, et al seemed
fine with the comment. Quite the opposite in fact. This experience was
used as an example to show that Obama had the political savy to win a
presidential election.

The initial gubernatorial campaign was where the "pay to play"
allegations first surfaced aginst Blagojevich. Blago got into a fairly
public family feud with his father-in-law Chicago Alderman Mel Reynolds
shortly after taking office and Alderman Mel accused him of awarding
contracts, state jobs, and positions in his administration in exchange
for campaign contributions.

Blago set records for gubernatorial campaign fund raising. The feds are
particularly interested in the statistical improbabilty that $25,000.00
donors recieved a disproportionate number of state jobs, appointments,
and contracts.

It's also worth noting that Obama sponsored legislation that made
Blagojevich's pay to play schemes involving state hospitals possible. The
hospital board members now under indictment contributed large monetary
donations to Obama's campaign.

None of this means that Obama is guilty of any wrong doing. But I would
sure like to see a candid interview between Obama and a journalist who
has some in depth knowledge of these scandals and doesn't think that
Obama is the second coming.

That will never happen.

--

Dan

CNC Videos - http://tinyurl.com/yzdt6d

On Mon, 05 Jan 2009 02:23:36 +0000, D Murphy wrote:

Curly Surmudgeon wrote in
:

Did he? Seriously, I'm not blowing you off, I've seen no indication
that Obama worked "hard to get Blagojevich elected."


Obama, Emanuel, and David Wilhelm ran his first gubernatorial campaign.
Obama came over after his guy lost in the primaries to Blagojevich.

In what capacity was Obama involved?

Obama also endorsed and spoke for Blagojevich's reelection campaign in
2006, long after it was known the Feds were breathing down his neck.

If true, this is not good. Got a cite that shows public knowledge of a
federal investigation in progress prior to Obama's involvement? The one
in your sig line has nothing to do with the issue. Don't do that lots of
people are still on dialup and that was a movie link...

According to Rahm Emanuel, Emanuel, Obama, Blagojevich's campaign co-
chair David Wilhelm, and another Blagojevich staffer "were the top
strategists of Blagojevich's 2002 gubernatorial victory," meeting weekly
to outline campaign strategies.

Have a cite for this?

Since all the bad PR from Blagojevich's indictment, Wilhelm says Emanuel
"overstated" Obama's role. Before the scandal broke Wilhelm, et al
seemed fine with the comment. Quite the opposite in fact. This
experience was used as an example to show that Obama had the political
savy to win a presidential election.

Politicians often take credit where not due, Obama hasn't to my knowledge
but Emanuel well might. Third hand, not an indictment of Obama.

The initial gubernatorial campaign was where the "pay to play"
allegations first surfaced aginst Blagojevich. Blago got into a fairly
public family feud with his father-in-law Chicago Alderman Mel Reynolds
shortly after taking office and Alderman Mel accused him of awarding
contracts, state jobs, and positions in his administration in exchange
for campaign contributions.

To my understanding this is also the time Obama began distancing himself
from Blagojevich. Never again did they work together directly although
they had some parallel agendas and programs.

From here on down you've presented an indictment of Blago, nothing
contained within pertains to Obama.

My take is that when Obama was a political neophyte he attached himself
to those who shared some degree of commonality with the intention of
furthering programs he believed in with the benefit of later, personal,
advantage. This is how politics works. But to this point in time no one
has connected Obama with nefarious actions.

Later, as Obama saw what went on in Springfield and Chicago, he had
recriminations for involvement with a few early characters and distanced
himself from any relationship. This is substantiated by the Federal
Attorney investigating Blago.

Note that I am not, was not, an Obama supporter. I did not vote for him
either. I definitely do not agree with his spending programs. Others I
support strongly like rebuilding our scientific leadership. I see Obama
as an intelligent man who rectifies past mistakes and does not repeat
them. But I will certainly be observing any future connection with
corruption under the microscope.

Blago set records for gubernatorial campaign fund raising. The feds are
particularly interested in the statistical improbabilty that $25,000.00
donors recieved a disproportionate number of state jobs, appointments,
and contracts.

It's also worth noting that Obama sponsored legislation that made
Blagojevich's pay to play schemes involving state hospitals possible.
The hospital board members now under indictment contributed large
monetary donations to Obama's campaign.

None of this means that Obama is guilty of any wrong doing. But I would
sure like to see a candid interview between Obama and a journalist who
has some in depth knowledge of these scandals and doesn't think that
Obama is the second coming.

That will never happen.

As would I but neither of us should expect Obama to put himself at risk
even before his Presidency begins. He has a tremendous amount of work
ahead, more than any president can possibly cope with. Bush has left an
administration full of land mines for his successor. Almost enough to
make me wish McCain had won to be the scapegoat.

_Almost_.

--
Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
15 Days More of George Walker Bush Plundering the Economy
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