Gene Kearns wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jul 2009 08:11:16 -0700 (PDT), Monkey Butler penned the
following well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

|Do a Google search for GM Castech Heads and meet all the happy owners.

Castech........right.... Another part farmed out to be cheaply made
in Mexico. Gosh, I am so surprised it is junk!



It's the same old story of U.S. manufacturing...don't make it better,
make it cheaper. But it isn't just U.S. manufacturers who do this.

"BAR" wrote in message
...
Gene Kearns wrote:
On Thu, 16 Jul 2009 19:04:11 -0600, Canuck57 penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

|
|"nada" wrote in message
...
| Vic Smith wrote:
| I posted this to the GM group, which I sometimes participate in, but
I | really like talking to boaters more than anything.
| Boaters are.....just cool!
| Anyway most here have some GM experience, and I know you all like to
| talk about unions.
|
| *********************
|
| So I go into the local GM dealership this morning to get the lower
| intake manifold gasket set for my kid's 95 Bonneville. The "new
| improved" gaskets. Aluminum framed, not plastic. The car's got 80k
miles | on it, and too many GM owners took real big
| hits when the lower manifold gaskets rotted away or plastic upper
| plenum melted away. I bought a Dorman upper plenum elsewhere.
| Way too many with as few as 40k miles, and for cars at least as late
| as 2003 with the 3800 Series 2 engine have the problem.
| Can cause hydrolock, bent rods, warped heads, wiped bearings, etc.
| Some catch it in the early stages and only pay $400-1200 to get it
| fixed. I've spent some time in Pontiac, Buick and Chevy forums
reading | about the pain and expense this poor design has caused.
| There was only very minor relief from GM for these disasters. Hell,
the | new LIM gasket didn't come out until 2006 or 2007. My kid is
putting in | the improved LIM gasket and the improved Gorman
| upper plenum as a preventative measure.
| The plenum was 61 bucks through Amazon and the gasket was
| 75 bucks at GM.
| Then there's going to be some brake and carb cleaner to clean things
| up, and some thread lock.
| So it's going to cost about $150 in parts, and at least 3 hours of
the
| kid's labor. Luckily, he loves doing this stuff. Anyway, one parts
guy | goes to get my gasket set, and I ask one of the
| other guys, probably the manager, who's sitting on his ass rifling
| through paperwork, "What do you think about the new GM?"
| He doesn't hardly look up, and why should he?
| After all, I'm just a customer.
| He says, "I feel good about it. We've got the union costs under
| control." Mumbles something about health costs.
| I said, "Yeah, that union health care was hurting GM, and health care
| is a problem all over."
| He wasn't interested in my comment, and goes on a bit ragging the
| union. Didn't hear it exactly, because the other guy came back with
| my part and pointed me to cashier window about ten feet away.
| The cashier was waiting for me.
| So as I give her the invoice and my credit card something is
bothering
| me. When I asked that guy about the "new GM" I was expecting
| to hear something besides bitching about the union.
| Maybe something about how good the Malibu and Impala are selling, or
a
| new goal toward engineering excellence and customer satisfaction.
| I walk back to the parts desk and said, probably a bit too loudly,
| in order to get this guys attention, but I was actually ****ed.
| "Hey, see this?" I held up the $75 gasket set.
| "The union didn't design the 3800. GM engineers and GM management
| did that. Wasn't the union. Sure as hell wasn't Toyota. And if
they
| did they would have made it right. You want customers, you better
| give them reliability. There's more than one side of a story."
| He admitted that as I walked back to the cashier to sign the receipt
| and get out of there. Didn't really want to say anything else to
him.
| **** him.
| Anyway, a bad experience. Hope this asshole doesn't represent GM's
| future.
|
| --Vic
| Every one of these jerks thing the Unioniozed Workers are getting |
something tghey want but didn't go after. It is hateful envy.
| Those that work at the corner market applied to work there.
| Those that work at GM, Boeing, or wherever applied to work there.
| Thse that choose to be Entrepeanurs should have included choice health
| care into their planning.
| The average wage is supposedly 54,000+ in the US yet thes people bitch
| when an Auto Worker or whomever is approaching that level. They figure
| only Wall Streeters should b e making it.
|
|Be sure to enjoy driving it, US citizens at large now have over $100B
less |in the future to spend on autos. Make it over $1T if you include
bank |bailouts.
|
|No doubt, fewer autos per capita is the future. |

Yes, and that began with NAFTA. A "global economy" means the playing
field gets "leveled."

The Chinese farmer can, now, maybe afford a car.... and to offset
that, Americans (and others) will be forced to make-do with *much*
less....

No Free Ride.


It won't be a leveling of the field, it will be lowering the field.

If you missed the fall of the Roman Empire you are about to see what
happened in real time.

What? Are you out of credit? LOL.

Seriously, more people and a fixed world of resources means more competition
and less room for waste. Simply put, the US and Canada have high levels of
waste and debt. Government costs, right out of whack, executive
compensation out to lunch and the little guy always pays. No rewards for
loyalty, honor or integrity. Just rewards for corruption, bailouts and
debtors.

China owns the US.... just finished reading how they are spending the nearly
$2T of useless excess USDs they have buying up real assets on the world's
market at a real cheap valuations. Cash is king, debtors are whining like
stuck pigs.

A little late to cry, if we in NA wanted it any better we would think before
we vote. Too many years of crooked government and decaying morals. With
the attitude the government will bailout loosers, the taxpayers will have to
shoulder more lost wealth for the corrupt.

Wait until this years mortgage crisis hits the news. The downturn has a
ways to go yet.

The Roman Empire fell for the same reasons, when the equitable values were
lost, so did the empire.

Jack wrote:
On Jul 16, 9:33 pm, Keith Nuttle wrote:
Canuck57 wrote:
"Jim" wrote in message
m...
Vic Smith wrote:
Can cause hydrolock, bent rods, warped heads, wiped bearings, etc.
Some catch it in the early stages and only pay $400-1200 to get it
fixed. I've spent some time in Pontiac, Buick and Chevy forums reading
about the pain and expense this poor design has caused.
This is why GM is doomed. Not only would I never buy another one, but
when I see one on the highway I look to see what the fool who bought one
looks like.
Ditto. A friend is gong to be buying a car shortly, says anything but a GM.
Me, I will not even rent one.
Is that why I have only gotten 200,000 trouble free miles on my last
several GM automobiles?

When you spread 200,000 miles over "several" vehicles, that's not many
miles per vehicle, so there's not much of a chance to have a problem.

If you're saying that you've put 200,000 miles *each* on several GM
vehicles and have had no problem, I'd have to call BS. Statistically
impossible.

You need to leave the computer and come out to the real world. There are
no statistics involved. When you make trips to points that are 150 to
700 miles from where you live a couple of times per month, 200,000 miles
on one car is not impossible. In fact It is quite normal in the areas
where I have lived.

I have friends who are commuting 150 miles round trip each day. About a
year ago I was driving 70 miles round trip to work. It has been years
since I have to change even a simple thing like an alternator. I have
never lost an engine nor been left stranded by a car not working.

So I don't know where you are getting your information.

Keith Nuttle wrote:
Jack wrote:
On Jul 16, 9:33 pm, Keith Nuttle wrote:
Canuck57 wrote:
"Jim" wrote in message
m...
Vic Smith wrote:
Can cause hydrolock, bent rods, warped heads, wiped bearings, etc.
Some catch it in the early stages and only pay $400-1200 to get it
fixed. I've spent some time in Pontiac, Buick and Chevy forums
reading
about the pain and expense this poor design has caused.
This is why GM is doomed. Not only would I never buy another one, but
when I see one on the highway I look to see what the fool who
bought one
looks like.
Ditto. A friend is gong to be buying a car shortly, says anything
but a GM.
Me, I will not even rent one.
Is that why I have only gotten 200,000 trouble free miles on my last
several GM automobiles?

When you spread 200,000 miles over "several" vehicles, that's not many
miles per vehicle, so there's not much of a chance to have a problem.

If you're saying that you've put 200,000 miles *each* on several GM
vehicles and have had no problem, I'd have to call BS. Statistically
impossible.

You need to leave the computer and come out to the real world. There are
no statistics involved. When you make trips to points that are 150 to
700 miles from where you live a couple of times per month, 200,000 miles
on one car is not impossible. In fact It is quite normal in the areas
where I have lived.

I have friends who are commuting 150 miles round trip each day. About a
year ago I was driving 70 miles round trip to work. It has been years
since I have to change even a simple thing like an alternator. I have
never lost an engine nor been left stranded by a car not working.

So I don't know where you are getting your information.


My last year of undergraduate college, I was working a full-time night
job five days a week at an employer 50 miles away...for a round-trip of
about 100 miles.

About 190 trips, right? Close to 20,000 miles, on a used Volvo PV544
that had 80,000 miles on it when I bought. Never missed a beat.

On Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:33:05 -0400, Keith Nuttle
wrote:


I have friends who are commuting 150 miles round trip each day. About a
year ago I was driving 70 miles round trip to work. It has been years
since I have to change even a simple thing like an alternator. I have
never lost an engine nor been left stranded by a car not working.

Longest commute I did was 75 miles a day, for about 2 1/2 years.
That about 50k miles just for the commuting part.
Seems many Californians have long commutes, and maybe the same for
those in those big states where people live far from work.
Easy enough to put on big miles.
I've seen plenty of 3 year-old cars with +100k on the odo.
Seem to recall seeing some 2 year old cars with the same.
I've never been stranded by a Chevy, but I take care of my cars.

--Vic

On Jul 17, 2:33*pm, Keith Nuttle wrote:
Jack wrote:
On Jul 16, 9:33 pm, Keith Nuttle wrote:
Canuck57 wrote:
"Jim" wrote in message
news:ssadne4ppbSDzcLXnZ2dnUVZ_hxi4p2d@earthlink .com...
Vic Smith wrote:
Can cause hydrolock, bent rods, warped heads, wiped bearings, etc.
Some catch it in the early stages and only pay $400-1200 to get it
fixed. I've spent some time in Pontiac, Buick and Chevy forums reading
about the pain and expense this poor design has caused.
This is why GM is doomed. *Not only would I never buy another one, but
when I see one on the highway I look to see what the fool who bought one
looks like.
Ditto. *A friend is gong to be buying a car shortly, says anything but a GM.
Me, I will not even rent one.
Is that why I have only gotten 200,000 trouble free miles on my last
several GM automobiles?

When you spread 200,000 miles over "several" vehicles, that's not many
miles per vehicle, so there's not much of a chance to have a problem.

If you're saying that you've put 200,000 miles *each* on several GM
vehicles and have had no problem, I'd have to call BS. *Statistically
impossible.

You need to leave the computer and come out to the real world. There are
no statistics involved. *When you make trips to points that are 150 to
700 miles from where you live a couple of times per month, 200,000 miles
on one car is not impossible. In fact It is quite normal in the areas
where I have lived.

I have friends who are commuting 150 miles round trip each day. *About a
year ago I was driving 70 miles round trip to work. *It has been years
since I have to change even a simple thing like an alternator. *I have
never lost an engine nor been left stranded by a car not working.

So I don't know where you are getting your information.

Please slow down and re-read my post. I never said that you weren't
putting 200k miles on a vehicle. Of course it can be done, and is
fairly regularly. Your friend that's commuting 150 miles round trip
is doing it every 4-5 years.

However, you said you've done it in "several" GM vehicles, all
"trouble-free". If we say that several equals four, then we're
talking about roughly a twenty year span. Considering GM's lack of
quality over that period, it is statistically unlikely that you''ve
racked up 800,000 miles on GM vehicles with only oil and filter and
tires, and without an alternator, starter, AC compressor, wheel
bearing, differential, oil leaks, blown tranny, or any of 100 other
maladies that affected GM vehicles over the last 20 years. Hondas and
Toyotas don't have *that* kind of reliability, and we *are* talking
about GM here.

But I guess if you don't call interior and exterior parts falling off
"trouble", and fixing a transmission at 120k is normal maintenance,
then OK. GM should hire you for a commercial. :-)

Don White wrote:
"H the K" wrote in message
m...
BAR wrote:
H the K wrote:
Jack wrote:
On Jul 16, 1:24 pm, nada wrote:


My ex wife worked at the Lordstown, Ohio GM plant. She intentially
shut down the line one day, and the union protected her and kept her
from being fired. She told me the stories of how she and her co-
workers harmed the company, messed with the cars, and generally were
just bad employees, and through it all they kept their jobs and kept
getting raises and bennies. There's a word for how people feel about
this kind of union-bred crap, but it's certainly not "envy".

So, your ex-wife was a loser. So are you. What a surprise.
Should she have been fired and civilly charged?

For marrying jackoff? Isn't that punishment enough?

~~ Snerk ~~
True enough!



You are still dumb and you are still WAFA's lemming.

Carry on, beer fetcher...

d

H the K wrote:
Jack wrote:
On Jul 17, 8:29 am, BAR wrote:
H the K wrote:
Jack wrote:
On Jul 16, 1:24 pm, nada wrote:
My ex wife worked at the Lordstown, Ohio GM plant. She intentially
shut down the line one day, and the union protected her and kept her
from being fired. She told me the stories of how she and her co-
workers harmed the company, messed with the cars, and generally were
just bad employees, and through it all they kept their jobs and kept
getting raises and bennies. There's a word for how people feel about
this kind of union-bred crap, but it's certainly not "envy".
So, your ex-wife was a loser. So are you. What a surprise.
Should she have been fired and civilly charged?

Of course. Unfortunately, union protection in the workplace
encourages this type of behavior. The union tells you that management
is out to get you, so they enable this kind of stuff. That's criminal.


It's a nice tale you tell, jackoff, and your ex probably told it to you
just to raise your blood pressure, in the hope you'd FOAD and she could
collect some insurance.

I recall several incidents at unionized plants. Once, a worker "stopped
the line" when he was quite literally devoured by a machine on which
management had removed the safety devices. Management, of course, wanted
the machine cleaned so it wouldn't mess up product.

At another facility, an employee was seriously injured when a product
robot cart ran over him. It was equipped with special impact sensing
bumpers that were supposed to stop immediately if they touched anything.
The "fail-safe" was some sort of line preceding the cart that was
attached to the overhead power track. The employee's body derailed the
robocart and it stopped. Finally

At an investigation, the manager of the plant was eager to demonstrate
how safe the devices were. So he had the robocart cranked up while he
stood in its path. Yep. The bumpers touched his legs, and the cart kept
on coming. He couldn't grab the pull-cord safety line because, well,
because he was already on his way to the concrete floor and the line was
out of his reach.

That particular gem was on TV. :)

Oh. Management. You bet your ass it is out to get you.

Cite? Didn't think so.

****ing narcissists...

d

Gene wrote:
In article , says...
The Roman Empire fell for the same reasons, when the equitable values were
lost, so did the empire.



Oh... crap.... and all of this time I had been told it was "moral
decay." 'Ya learn somethin' new every day!

You will find that usually they go hand in hand.

On Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:15:01 -0600, Canuck57 wrote:


China owns the US....

I may not be happy with the exodus of jobs from here to there, but make
no mistake, China needs us, far more than we need them. China may become
the economic powerhouse, but before it does, it will have to address it's
institutional social issues. Or, do you really believe it's "blend" of
communism and capitalism will work in the long term?


Wait until this years mortgage crisis hits the news. The downturn has a
ways to go yet.

LOL, you should stop concentrating on the lagging indicators, and start
concentrating on the leading indicators. We are by no means out of the
woods, but the recovery started several months ago. By fall, it should
be clear to even the most obtuse.