On Sat, 08 Aug 2009 15:53:45 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 11:46:15 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:


"jps" wrote in message
. ..
On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:45:56 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:07:29 -0400, H the K
wrote:

...the Republicans are foched.


Surprisingly strong jobs data signal turning point

By JEANNINE AVERSA (AP) - 32 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - It's the clearest sign yet the recession is finally ending:
Employers laid off far fewer workers in July, the jobless rate dipped
for the first time in 15 months and workers' hours and pay edged upward.
Those are the kind of figures that could give Americans the
psychological boost necessary for recovery to take root after the worst
recession since World War II.

A net total of 247,000 jobs were lost last month, the fewest in a year
and a drastic improvement from the 443,000 that vanished in June.

The Labor Department's report Friday showed that the unemployment rate
dropped a notch to 9.4 percent in July, from 9.5 percent the previous
month. Together with slight increases in the average workweek and wages,
the new figures suggested the economy is in a transition from recession
to recovery.

Don't believe all that. The gov adjusted the figures by dropping off
those who have given up looking for a job.

There were also fewer jobs lost in July than in previous months.
Lot less jobs to lose.


I believe that is true. The companies that were going under, pretty
much have by now.

And so does that not indicate that the loss of jobs is slowing? I
don't get your point.

The real question everyone is asking is when do we hit bottom and
start the real recovery.

When banks start lending money to going concerns that have real
business.

Wall Street seems to think we already have. I am very happy with my
little bag of stocks. Those people who doubled down on their 401k when
everyone else was running like scalded dogs are doing OK. My wife
argued with me about it at the time but she is smiling now.

It was a good opportunity for those with cash. Probably still is if
one is discerning.

Money needs to start flowing at a faster rate and folks need to feel
as though we're headed in the right direction. If so, they'll pull
their hands out of their pockets, perhaps a bit more slowly than they
shoved them in.

A change in mood would certainly help.

In article ,
says...

On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:07:29 -0400, H the K
wrote:

...the Republicans are foched.


Surprisingly strong jobs data signal turning point

By JEANNINE AVERSA (AP) ? 32 minutes ago

WASHINGTON ? It's the clearest sign yet the recession is finally ending:
Employers laid off far fewer workers in July, the jobless rate dipped
for the first time in 15 months and workers' hours and pay edged upward.
Those are the kind of figures that could give Americans the
psychological boost necessary for recovery to take root after the worst
recession since World War II.

A net total of 247,000 jobs were lost last month, the fewest in a year
and a drastic improvement from the 443,000 that vanished in June.

The Labor Department's report Friday showed that the unemployment rate
dropped a notch to 9.4 percent in July, from 9.5 percent the previous
month. Together with slight increases in the average workweek and wages,
the new figures suggested the economy is in a transition from recession
to recovery.

Don't believe all that. The gov adjusted the figures by dropping off
those who have given up looking for a job.
Look at this.
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2009/...-unemployment/

I won't vouch for the numbers - not interested enough to dig deeper.
But they seem closer to reality then the rah rah Wall Street numbers.
Keep in mind pimping for Wall Street is the national past time for
both Dems and Reps.
But Fox hates Obama even more than it loves Wall Street, so I look at
these numbers as a dose of reality.
See that in December 1.5 million unemployed exhaust their unemployment
benefits?
Merry Christmas.

--Vic



Since when did asking non scripted questions become "hate"? It is
frustration with the fact that oppositition are not only shut out, but
kicked around at the same time.

--
Wafa free since 2009

On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 13:46:25 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:

I have done well in the investments also. But a lot of the growth is vapor.
The government, and Wall Street pumping up dogs. How can AIG be profitable
now? All the sudden banks with billions of bad loans are showing big
profits. Mark to Market shenanigans?

One of Warren Buffet's favorite sayings is don't invest in companies
that you can't easily understand. I think it's good advice. If you
can't figure out where the money is coming from, that's not a good
business model. Let somebody else understand it, or not.

"H the K" wrote in message
m...

"The worst may be behind us," President Barack Obama declared. "Today,
we're pointed in the right direction."

Obama can talk all he wants, it isn't going to change a thing. But he is a
good bull****er, but even lib-dims are getting tired of talk a lot and
excuses.

This time of year is supposed to be peek employment. And it remains that
income levels are dropping. Loose 1/2M jobs, replaced with 1/4M lower wage
jobs for a net loss of 1/4M. Sort of like saying I lost 3 pints of blood
and the bleading is slowing down. Obama sure isn't a realist.

Then there are people no longer counted, the real number is 20%, which
removes government adjustment crap.

As for recent market increases, it has more to do with anticipated
inflation. I can just hear Obama touting GDP grew by 1% in a 10% inflation
environment so the recession, which is really a depression is over. Trouble
is, real growth is GDP growth has to be more than inflation or in fact, you
still are in a recession.

Government is going to try to BS out of this, but it isn't going to work.
People are going to be angry when they realize they are being duped by an no
results talk a lot type.

Canuck57 wrote:
"H the K" wrote in message
m...

"The worst may be behind us," President Barack Obama declared. "Today,
we're pointed in the right direction."

Obama can talk all he wants, it isn't going to change a thing. But he is a
good bull****er, but even lib-dims are getting tired of talk a lot and
excuses.

This time of year is supposed to be peek employment. And it remains that
income levels are dropping. Loose 1/2M jobs, replaced with 1/4M lower wage
jobs for a net loss of 1/4M. Sort of like saying I lost 3 pints of blood
and the bleading is slowing down. Obama sure isn't a realist.

Then there are people no longer counted, the real number is 20%, which
removes government adjustment crap.

As for recent market increases, it has more to do with anticipated
inflation. I can just hear Obama touting GDP grew by 1% in a 10% inflation
environment so the recession, which is really a depression is over. Trouble
is, real growth is GDP growth has to be more than inflation or in fact, you
still are in a recession.

Government is going to try to BS out of this, but it isn't going to work.
People are going to be angry when they realize they are being duped by an no
results talk a lot type.



A lot of analysts are saying we're over the hump, also.

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:45:56 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:07:29 -0400, H the K
wrote:

...the Republicans are foched.


Surprisingly strong jobs data signal turning point

By JEANNINE AVERSA (AP) - 32 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - It's the clearest sign yet the recession is finally ending:
Employers laid off far fewer workers in July, the jobless rate dipped
for the first time in 15 months and workers' hours and pay edged upward.
Those are the kind of figures that could give Americans the
psychological boost necessary for recovery to take root after the worst
recession since World War II.

A net total of 247,000 jobs were lost last month, the fewest in a year
and a drastic improvement from the 443,000 that vanished in June.

The Labor Department's report Friday showed that the unemployment rate
dropped a notch to 9.4 percent in July, from 9.5 percent the previous
month. Together with slight increases in the average workweek and wages,
the new figures suggested the economy is in a transition from recession
to recovery.

Don't believe all that. The gov adjusted the figures by dropping off
those who have given up looking for a job.

There were also fewer jobs lost in July than in previous months.

Replaced with service jobs in a hight tourista month of July...

In blood terms, this is like saying the lost of 3 pints and lower blood
pressure, you are bleading at a slower rate.

Not very comforting and a tad bit too optimistic. Realism will come in the
end.

wrote in message
...
On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 11:46:15 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:


"jps" wrote in message
. ..
On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:45:56 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:07:29 -0400, H the K
wrote:

...the Republicans are foched.


Surprisingly strong jobs data signal turning point

By JEANNINE AVERSA (AP) - 32 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - It's the clearest sign yet the recession is finally
ending:
Employers laid off far fewer workers in July, the jobless rate dipped
for the first time in 15 months and workers' hours and pay edged
upward.
Those are the kind of figures that could give Americans the
psychological boost necessary for recovery to take root after the worst
recession since World War II.

A net total of 247,000 jobs were lost last month, the fewest in a year
and a drastic improvement from the 443,000 that vanished in June.

The Labor Department's report Friday showed that the unemployment rate
dropped a notch to 9.4 percent in July, from 9.5 percent the previous
month. Together with slight increases in the average workweek and
wages,
the new figures suggested the economy is in a transition from recession
to recovery.

Don't believe all that. The gov adjusted the figures by dropping off
those who have given up looking for a job.

There were also fewer jobs lost in July than in previous months.
Lot less jobs to lose.


I believe that is true. The companies that were going under, pretty
much have by now.

The real question everyone is asking is when do we hit bottom and
start the real recovery.
Wall Street seems to think we already have. I am very happy with my
little bag of stocks. Those people who doubled down on their 401k when
everyone else was running like scalded dogs are doing OK. My wife
argued with me about it at the time but she is smiling now.

My guess, and only a guess but as good as any is that we will see a mini
recovery, but are at least 10 years out for a full sustained recovery. Much
like 1982, whole parts of the economy took 6 or more years to reach former
levels.

Government fiscal policy right now is inflationary, even a mild recovery
will trigger inflation. Say it hits 10% per year. But GDP grows by 1%.
Government will falsely say the recession is over, but the 9% slip is still
technically recessionary in value and to jobs. It will severly temper any
recovery.

Middle class cutbacks will occur for years as will the governments loss on
revenue. This is the real reason behind the health care push, an excuse to
open up on higher levels of taxation the government wants. Raise taxes 10%,
sending 8% to pork and current government excesses, and 2% to health care.
Government wants more taxes out of the people as even they know they can't
create money forever.

Spells for a 10 year recovery, and could be turbulant. But the markets will
bounce for a mini recovery, than bounce down again. A few of these will
occur. Some growth in number values will occur because of inflation, but
not in hard wealth value.

The wild card is that this recession is much worse than 1982, and the
governments are racking up debt at an unparalleled rate ever seen before. I
suspect the 70's inflation will be surpassed as a result of liberal congress
money management.

Short of it, a false recovery and this will last a decade or more.

"NotNow" wrote in message
...
Canuck57 wrote:
"H the K" wrote in message
m...

"The worst may be behind us," President Barack Obama declared. "Today,
we're pointed in the right direction."

Obama can talk all he wants, it isn't going to change a thing. But he is
a good bull****er, but even lib-dims are getting tired of talk a lot and
excuses.

This time of year is supposed to be peek employment. And it remains that
income levels are dropping. Loose 1/2M jobs, replaced with 1/4M lower
wage jobs for a net loss of 1/4M. Sort of like saying I lost 3 pints of
blood and the bleading is slowing down. Obama sure isn't a realist.

Then there are people no longer counted, the real number is 20%, which
removes government adjustment crap.

As for recent market increases, it has more to do with anticipated
inflation. I can just hear Obama touting GDP grew by 1% in a 10%
inflation environment so the recession, which is really a depression is
over. Trouble is, real growth is GDP growth has to be more than
inflation or in fact, you still are in a recession.

Government is going to try to BS out of this, but it isn't going to work.
People are going to be angry when they realize they are being duped by an
no results talk a lot type.

A lot of analysts are saying we're over the hump, also.

The same analysts that said to buy dot.com IPOs? The same ones that said
buy 10 houses and flip them? The same analysts that are making $700k a year
pimping bad investments?

"Calif Bill" wrote in message
m...

wrote in message
...
On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 11:46:15 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:


"jps" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:45:56 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 19:07:29 -0400, H the K
wrote:

...the Republicans are foched.


Surprisingly strong jobs data signal turning point

By JEANNINE AVERSA (AP) - 32 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - It's the clearest sign yet the recession is finally
ending:
Employers laid off far fewer workers in July, the jobless rate dipped
for the first time in 15 months and workers' hours and pay edged
upward.
Those are the kind of figures that could give Americans the
psychological boost necessary for recovery to take root after the
worst
recession since World War II.

A net total of 247,000 jobs were lost last month, the fewest in a year
and a drastic improvement from the 443,000 that vanished in June.

The Labor Department's report Friday showed that the unemployment rate
dropped a notch to 9.4 percent in July, from 9.5 percent the previous
month. Together with slight increases in the average workweek and
wages,
the new figures suggested the economy is in a transition from
recession
to recovery.

Don't believe all that. The gov adjusted the figures by dropping off
those who have given up looking for a job.

There were also fewer jobs lost in July than in previous months.
Lot less jobs to lose.


I believe that is true. The companies that were going under, pretty
much have by now.

The real question everyone is asking is when do we hit bottom and
start the real recovery.
Wall Street seems to think we already have. I am very happy with my
little bag of stocks. Those people who doubled down on their 401k when
everyone else was running like scalded dogs are doing OK. My wife
argued with me about it at the time but she is smiling now.

I have done well in the investments also. But a lot of the growth is
vapor. The government, and Wall Street pumping up dogs. How can AIG be
profitable now? All the sudden banks with billions of bad loans are
showing big profits. Mark to Market shenanigans?

Agreed. Funny accounting principles at work. The bad loans were shifted out
to the government banks. Much like GM, sell off the good (and some bad)
parts, package it for the taxpayer and dump it in their lap. Dirty
corruption of a huge kind.

In essense, the very currency is now in question. Is the USD going to hold
it's value or sink?