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#41
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posted to rec.boats
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![]() wrote in message ... On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 18:18:45 -0400, Harry ? wrote: On 7/11/10 6:12 PM, wrote: On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 15:08:08 -0400, wrote: Genghis Khan was quite a few steps up on the ladder of civilization from the clowns that now rule Afghanistan. For one thing, he was a uniter, which distinguishes him from, say, George W. Bush, who was a divider. Actually Clinton was the divider. The last president to **** off that many people was Andrew Johnson. Bush just drove the wedge in a little deeper on your side. Really? So at the end of Clinton's presidency, you're going to claim that the US was ridiculed and thought little of worldwide compared to when Bush was IN office? |
#42
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posted to rec.boats
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![]() wrote in message ... On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 18:16:48 -0400, bpuharic wrote: On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 15:41:59 -0400, wrote: I don't believe the Kabul government really has much influence in the area where the AQ guys are hiding. That is why we failed at Tora Bora. we failed in TB because scum bag bush refused to send in US troops when we had osama cornered. the 'new republic' had an excellent article earlier this year on this exact event I don't think BL was going to stay put for the month or two it would take to safely deploy a division. We saw what happens when you don't do the groundwork in Somalia. This started as a quiet hit on Bin Laden but by the time he got to Tora Bora that was not going to work. Bush didn't want another war. Come on. We had him in a corner. We just needed to finish the job, but instead we handed off the responsibility to paid thugs who let him go. Bush didn't want another war? Are you sure? After all, he was "listening" to his generals (until they contradicted Rumsfeld anyway). |
#43
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posted to rec.boats
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![]() wrote in message ... On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 14:37:36 -0700, "nom=de=plume" wrote: Then why are we saying this wart is about terrorism? There was not a single Taliban involved with 9/11. They were Saudis who simply traveled through Afghanistan. If that was all it took, we should be attacking Germany and Spain where the final plans were developed. Untrue. They may not have participated in the planning, but they refused to give up bin laden, etc. They didn't "simply travel" through. They took over and their extremist views allowed bin laden's crowd to have a safe-haven. Don't try and rewrite Bush's failures. So what are you going to do about Pakistan where he has done the same thing? You're claiming BL is in charge in Pakistan? Well, that's news to the Pakistanis! Anyone who thinks Karzai or the Junta de jour in Pakistan actually has much influence in the tribal areas is deluded. Which make up (in Pakistan) a relatively small area. The "Countries" we are trying to ally with are so corrupt any deal we may hammer out with them is just a love letter in the sand, to be wiped out with the next tide. And, your solution is.... isolationism? I think we tried that. It is possible to lose the whore region and then we would cause problems for India, Israel and most of the rest of the world. Whore region? ![]() |
#44
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posted to rec.boats
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![]() wrote in message news ![]() On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 14:41:14 -0700, "nom=de=plume" wrote: I agree with Harry on this one. Generals are hammers, all problems look like nails to them. Did you ever see the movie "The battle of the Bulge"? Watch the Robert Ryan monologue at the end of the movie where he says he will do anything to keep wearing that uniform and waging war. I see the same thing in our military policy. That's why it's fortunate that the military are under civilian control. Not to beat it to death, but that's why McCrystal was booted. McChrystal was booted for letting his staff talk too much. Obama says there were no real policy differences between them. This is not Truman MacArthur And for him talking to much.... which usurps Presidential (civilian) authority. |
#45
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posted to rec.boats
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![]() wrote in message ... On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 18:00:54 -0400, John H wrote: Did you ever see the movie "The battle of the Bulge"? Watch the Robert Ryan monologue at the end of the movie where he says he will do anything to keep wearing that uniform and waging war. I see the same thing in our military policy. No one would deny that the job of Generals is to fight wars. Do you deny that they are controlled by politicians? If we are in Afghanistan another ten years, it will be because Presidents wanted us there. -- With all du respect, you won't find many generals who will say "we can't win" no matter how hopeless the mission is and they have no authority to question the objective of the mission. Seems to me that they would give honest opinions if asked. |
#46
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posted to rec.boats
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On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 18:17:58 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote: With all du respect, you won't find many generals who will say "we can't win" no matter how hopeless the mission is and they have no authority to question the objective of the mission. Seems to me that they would give honest opinions if asked. Giving honest opinions is not conducive to a long career in the military. |
#47
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posted to rec.boats
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![]() "Wayne.B" wrote in message ... On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 18:17:58 -0700, "nom=de=plume" wrote: With all du respect, you won't find many generals who will say "we can't win" no matter how hopeless the mission is and they have no authority to question the objective of the mission. Seems to me that they would give honest opinions if asked. Giving honest opinions is not conducive to a long career in the military. So, when a President asks for an honest assessment of a military situation, the general should lie? I believe that a general has already had a "long career" in the military, and he or she should be valued for his/her honest opinion. |
#48
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posted to rec.boats
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On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 20:51:51 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote: Giving honest opinions is not conducive to a long career in the military. So, when a President asks for an honest assessment of a military situation, the general should lie? I believe that a general has already had a "long career" in the military, and he or she should be valued for his/her honest opinion. Giving an assessment is not the same thing as offering an opinion. An assessment is a highly structured process based on underlying factual data and probability analysis. |
#49
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posted to rec.boats
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![]() "Harry " wrote in message m... On 7/11/10 8:46 AM, John H wrote: On Jul 10, 7:52 pm, Harry wrote: ...it is out to **** us all...forever... General George Casey, the Chief of Staff of the Army, said today the United States could face another "decade or so" of persistent conflict in Iraq and Afghanistan. In two months, the U.S. will have been at war in Afghanistan for nine years. - - - These whores will do anything to stay in uniform. Harry, it's not August yet, but I'm going to give you an early reply to one of your posts. Your comment about General Casey's remarks was about the most stupid, ****ing thing you've said in years. Now I know some folks will argue about it was *really* the *most* stupid thing you've said, but they're wrong. It was. Generals do not keep wars going. Politicians keep wars going. Obama could have had us out of both Iraq and Afghanistan well over a year ago. *Obama* is making the choice of keeping us there. General Casey is noting that it could take another decade or so to accomplish what the friggin' politician, to wit: Obama, wants to accomplish. Since Obama has his head up his ass and doesn't have any idea of his goals over there, your grandchildren could well end up there. If things change in your family, you might even hear about it. Pray for a Republican president. She'll probably either **** or get off the pot with regard to Afghanistan. Remember the Iraq surge that 'wouldn't work' but did? OK, see you again in September...unless you do some *really* stupid again. Wow...herring thinks I give a damn whether he responds directly to one of my posts. That's some ego working over there in herringville. The posit is that the "officer corps" will do anything it can to stay in uniform, including prolonging war. Without a heavy-duty war to keep themselves busy, the officer corps will shrink, and so should the amount of dollars wasted on the "military-industrial" complex. The last presidents we had who knew anything real about "modern" war and the military from the highest levels were Eisenhower and to a lesser degree, George H.W. Bush. There is nothing worth accomplishing in Afghanistan. If Obama thinks otherwise, it is because his "military advisers" told him there was. The Iraqi surge merely postponed the inevitable. Iraq will fall apart once we pull out. Either that, or it will be ruled by a right-winger with close ties to some ayatollah. The military establishment will **** us over every time. If it didn't, half of its officers would be mustered out to become substitute teachers. Didn't think it was possible but you did it. You just admitted that Obama, with no military experience and little knowledge, has become subservient to the military and it's advisors. Supposed to be the other way around. Military leadership reports the facts as they see them. The Commander in Chief is ultimately responsible for policy and giving the orders. In your eyes (and words) it's not Obama's fault. Now it's "his military advisors" who are shaping policy and are to blame. This country is in a leadership crisis right now, a quality Obama is unfortunately demonstrating a lack of. Nice guy and all, gives good speeches, etc., but little to offer in true leadership qualities. GTMO is still operating. A trillion dollar economic stimulus program has failed. We are still in Iraq. We are escalating in Afghanistan. I really haven't noticed any "change". Have you? CC |
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