On 18/05/2011 8:13 AM, LilAbner wrote:
On 5/17/2011 8:17 PM, Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 4:33 PM, LilAbner wrote:
On 5/17/2011 6:22 PM, Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 4:02 PM, JustWaitAFrekinMinute! wrote:
On May 17, 5:57 pm, wrote:
On 17/05/2011 2:25 PM, *e#c wrote:

On May 17, 2:09 pm,
wrote:
**** you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

--
Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life!

Are you ranting about HAVING to use one of those new style, over-
priced-mercury-filled power-savers?

Yep, fleabagger greenies botched that good. What is better in city
dumps, mercury or tungsten?

Meanwhile Chinese did the real green thing, now inexpensive LED types
are coming to the market and they make the mercury ones look
inefficient. Last longer too. Chinese made of course and without
excessive carbon taxes.

--
Take a look at ANY country, more debt is more problems. So why do we
allow our governments more debt? Selfishness, greed, denial,
ignorance?

And yet, the pricetag will be about $50 for one ****ing bulb. Clinton
and Gore sold this country to China for a few million in late, dirty
election money, lock stock and barrel...

The Gore variety perhaps.

But in Canada they are starting to show up in 3 packs for $16. LEDs are
not cheaper than mercury yet, but getting there. But then again, I bet
the Chinese don't have political, executive or union corruption that
comes with the bulbs.

Say what?

You can pay Gore pricing if you want, I am sure he will take YOUR money.

The LED's have been experimented with and still used by some RVers..
Most are unhappy with them. The light is weak and so on. It is just hard
to see with them. They are like bunchs of little cheap LEZD flashlights.
They hurt your eyese to look at them but the light they thow out is weak.

The newer ones actually burn my eyes a bit. I am waiting for a
generation or two, they will get better and cheaper. At some point I
will buy them. They seem to be getting better with the difusing of
light each time I see them, some friends just bought some. Even work
with dimmers.
--
Take a look at ANY country, more debt is more problems. So why do we
allow our governments more debt? Selfishness, greed, denial, ignorance?

On Wed, 18 May 2011 15:27:21 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400, Harryk
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
wrote:


F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.

That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction.

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash

I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old.
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.



I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

I had a CFL in an overhead light inside a closed fixture... had a
spare bulb, the regular bulb burned out, so I put it in. It didn't
last very long. I guess the base gets pretty hot and fries the ballast
that way also.

wrote:
On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400,
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
wrote:

F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...
Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.
That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction.

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash
I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old.
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.


I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiG-VpTT3UE

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400, Harryk
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
wrote:


F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.

That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction.

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash

I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old.
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.



I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

Any light strobes at 60Hz because that's the way our A.C. current works!

On May 19, 8:41*am, Hairy Kraut wrote:
In article ,
says...







On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400, Harryk
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
wrote:

F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.

That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them.. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction.

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash

I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old..
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.

I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

Any light strobes at 60Hz because that's the way our A.C. current works!

Sort-of, but not quite right. Our AC power is 60Hz, but you don't
notice the effect so much with incandescent or flourescent bulbs
because they don't extiguish their light nearly as fast as an LED
does. The LED switces off *very* fast, so you can see the effect.
The glowing filament in an incandescent fades slowly, and it masks the
effect.

Also, the rate is actually 120Hz. A cycle, of which there are 60 of
in one second, contains a positive and a negative wave. The
incandescent bulb lights up for both, so it pulses 120 times a
second. The LED, if run from a full-wave rectifier, also pulses at
that frequency. However, from what I've seen, LED bulbs actually are
controlled with a chip that regulates power and temperature. To get
the light output needed, they have to run high currents (for an LED)
through the LEDs, making heat dissapation a problem. One way to
counter that is to turn the LED on/off at some rate to allow it a bit
of time to cool. This is likely the strobing effect that we're
seeing, and it's probably not tied to line frequency (60Hz).

Anyway, for the $40-50 that a 100 watt bulb currently costs, they will
be slow to catch on. Once the economy of scale kicks in, this should
be a viable technology, at least until something better is discovered.

In article ,
says...

On Thu, 19 May 2011 08:41:59 -0400, Hairy Kraut wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400, Harryk
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
wrote:


F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.

That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction.

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash

I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old.
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.



I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

Any light strobes at 60Hz because that's the way our A.C. current works!

The difference is how fast the lamp responds to that change. A
tungsten filament has a large amount of latency and you can select
phosphors in a fluorescent to mitigate the effect but a LED is
instant. If you rectified and filtered the AC you could eliminate the
problem. I am curious about how long these LEDs will last since my
line voltage is on the high side of nominal at 124V. They drive them
pretty hard.

What is really cool in that regard is when you see an LED turn signal or
brake light on a car or truck next to an incandescent bulb. The latency
can really be seen clearly that way.

On May 19, 2:38*pm, wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2011 08:41:59 -0400, Hairy Kraut wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400, Harryk
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
wrote:

F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.

That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction.

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash

I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old.
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.

I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

Any light strobes at 60Hz because that's the way our A.C. current works!

The difference is how fast the lamp responds to that change. A
tungsten filament has a large amount of latency and you can select
phosphors in a fluorescent to mitigate the effect but a LED is
instant. If you rectified and filtered the AC you could eliminate the
problem. I am curious about how long these LEDs will last since my
line voltage is on the high side of nominal at 124V. They drive them
pretty hard.

See my post elsewhere in this thread... the LED's aren't being driven
by a simple half or full wave rectifier, they are being driven by a
chip that regulates their drive signal. That's why these AC bulbs are
so expensive... they aren't just a string of LEDs, they also have a
heat sink and drive circuitry to control them.

On 19/05/2011 1:27 PM, Jack. wrote:
On May 19, 2:38 pm, wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2011 08:41:59 -0400, Hairy wrote:
In ,
says...

On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400,
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
wrote:

F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.

That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction.

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash

I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old.
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.

I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

Any light strobes at 60Hz because that's the way our A.C. current works!

The difference is how fast the lamp responds to that change. A
tungsten filament has a large amount of latency and you can select
phosphors in a fluorescent to mitigate the effect but a LED is
instant. If you rectified and filtered the AC you could eliminate the
problem. I am curious about how long these LEDs will last since my
line voltage is on the high side of nominal at 124V. They drive them
pretty hard.

See my post elsewhere in this thread... the LED's aren't being driven
by a simple half or full wave rectifier, they are being driven by a
chip that regulates their drive signal. That's why these AC bulbs are
so expensive... they aren't just a string of LEDs, they also have a
heat sink and drive circuitry to control them.

Huh? Not at all. A LED is a rectifier, a diode that emits light.
Simple resister on the end is all they have.

--resister---forward led-----forward led.....----
\-reverse led-/ \-reverse led..../

Just pairs of LEDs opposed to each other in a series and a resistor on
the end, so if the phase is positive one lights, on the opposite phase
the other one lights. At 60 hertz each, 120 hertz pulsed light. The
most common way to build them.

You could also get fancy, a 2 cent bridge rectifier, 2 cent small cap,
one cent resister and again the sequence of LED (not pairs) if you want
to get rid of the 60/120 hertz thing. But not usually done for a few
reasons as the current drive is sustained and more burn out might occur.

Either way, early 1970's basic electronic components from radio shack.
But the new LEDs are brighter and white.

No reason they shouldn't be cheap.

And certainly no American company could make them cheap like China. In
fact, many countries in SE Asia have mandated LEDs, and decommissioning
of neon for commercial purposes, burns too much juice for a small
island. Skipping the Al Gore make him rich mercury screw up.

--
Take a look at ANY country, more debt is more problems. So why do we
allow our governments more debt? Selfishness, greed, denial, ignorance?

On May 19, 4:22*pm, Canuck57 wrote:
On 19/05/2011 1:27 PM, Jack. wrote:





On May 19, 2:38 pm, wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2011 08:41:59 -0400, Hairy *wrote:
In ,
says...

On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400,
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
*wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
*wrote:

F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.

That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction..

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash

I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old.
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.

I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

Any light strobes at 60Hz because that's the way our A.C. current works!

The difference is how fast the lamp responds to that change. A
tungsten filament has a large amount of latency and you can select
phosphors in a fluorescent to mitigate the effect but a LED is
instant. If you rectified and filtered the AC you could eliminate the
problem. I am curious about how long these LEDs will last since my
line voltage is on the high side of nominal at 124V. They drive them
pretty hard.

See my post elsewhere in this thread... the LED's aren't being driven
by a simple half or full wave rectifier, they are being driven by a
chip that regulates their drive signal. *That's why these AC bulbs are
so expensive... they aren't just a string of LEDs, they also have a
heat sink and drive circuitry to control them.

Huh? *Not at all. *A LED is a rectifier, a diode that emits light.
Simple resister on the end is all they have.

* * --resister---forward led-----forward led.....----
* * * * * * * *\-reverse led-/ \-reverse led..../

Just pairs of LEDs opposed to each other in a series and a resistor on
the end, so if the phase is positive one lights, on the opposite phase
the other one lights. *At 60 hertz each, 120 hertz pulsed light. *The
most common way to build them.

You could also get fancy, a 2 cent bridge rectifier, 2 cent small cap,
one cent resister and again the sequence of LED (not pairs) if you want
to get rid of the 60/120 hertz thing. *But not usually done for a few
reasons as the current drive is sustained and more burn out might occur.

Either way, early 1970's basic electronic components from radio shack.
But the new LEDs are brighter and white.

No reason they shouldn't be cheap.


I'm quite aware of how LED's work, I'm an Electronics Engineer. You
are technically correct that you *could* build an LED lamp that would
run from 120v AC with a minimum of components, but it's operation,
life, and effeciency would be very marginal. We're not talking about
lighting up a simple single LED, these modern 100w LED lamps use
active thermal management, switching power supplies, and other tricks
to provide a light that people can tolerate in a home setting for
their primary source of light. Take a look at:

http://www.earthled.com/evolux-led-light-bulb.html

This is why the bulbs are so expensive. It's not as simple as you
think.

On 19/05/2011 3:14 PM, Jack. wrote:
On May 19, 4:22 pm, wrote:
On 19/05/2011 1:27 PM, Jack. wrote:





On May 19, 2:38 pm, wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2011 08:41:59 -0400, Hairy wrote:
In ,
says...

On Wed, 18 May 2011 14:07:45 -0400,
wrote:

Canuck57 wrote:
On 17/05/2011 8:27 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2011 21:41:50 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Tue, 17 May 2011 14:09:47 -0400, I_am_Tosk
wrote:

F*ck you Al Gore you hypocritical piece of ****...

Scott, with all due respect, energy efficiency is something we should
all be interested in. It turns out that high efficiency bulbs,
especially LEDs, are a good long term investment. Yes, they cost
more, and yes, they still have a few rough edges, but over the useful
life of the bulb the cost per hour is a lot lower. That should be of
interest to anyone who is thrifty. Costs will drop as volume builds
and the technology improves. It's already happening.

That is only true if you actually get the expected life out of them. I
am still waiting. Most LEDs in light bulbs are driven at such high
currents that I do not see them lasting as long as the prediction.

I am not having wonderful experiences with CFLs and I went for them
big time. I seem to be having early end of life at something like
10-15 % based on 20 - 30 lamps. I have had at least 5 bad ones.

No I didn't call EPA when I threw them away. I did break one (not in
the 5) and I cleaned it up with a big wad of wet paper towel.
I threw everything in the trash

I find the batches and brands of CFLs have different lifetimes. Some
lots, they last only a year maybe two. But have some now 7 years old.
Seems to vary quit a bit in the quality and longevity.

I bought some CFL floodlight bulbs for a trio of recessed ceiling
fixtures. They seem to be working out ok...low wattage, brighter than
the incandescent bulbs they replaced, seemingly cooler, whiter white.

I had a couple of those in my motion lights and they both died an
early death. My electrical folks say it is because the ballast is
above the reflector so the heat does not get radiated out of the bell.
They say they are having the same trouble with "R" style CFLs in
recessed cans.

BTW one thing I notice with the LEDs I have is (the decora night light
thing) that they "strobe" when you have motion across them. It is 60hz
so you don't notice it most of the time but if you are walking past
one you definitely get the 80s disco thing going on.

Any light strobes at 60Hz because that's the way our A.C. current works!

The difference is how fast the lamp responds to that change. A
tungsten filament has a large amount of latency and you can select
phosphors in a fluorescent to mitigate the effect but a LED is
instant. If you rectified and filtered the AC you could eliminate the
problem. I am curious about how long these LEDs will last since my
line voltage is on the high side of nominal at 124V. They drive them
pretty hard.

See my post elsewhere in this thread... the LED's aren't being driven
by a simple half or full wave rectifier, they are being driven by a
chip that regulates their drive signal. That's why these AC bulbs are
so expensive... they aren't just a string of LEDs, they also have a
heat sink and drive circuitry to control them.

Huh? Not at all. A LED is a rectifier, a diode that emits light.
Simple resister on the end is all they have.

--resister---forward led-----forward led.....----
\-reverse led-/ \-reverse led..../

Just pairs of LEDs opposed to each other in a series and a resistor on
the end, so if the phase is positive one lights, on the opposite phase
the other one lights. At 60 hertz each, 120 hertz pulsed light. The
most common way to build them.

You could also get fancy, a 2 cent bridge rectifier, 2 cent small cap,
one cent resister and again the sequence of LED (not pairs) if you want
to get rid of the 60/120 hertz thing. But not usually done for a few
reasons as the current drive is sustained and more burn out might occur.

Either way, early 1970's basic electronic components from radio shack.
But the new LEDs are brighter and white.

No reason they shouldn't be cheap.


I'm quite aware of how LED's work, I'm an Electronics Engineer. You
are technically correct that you *could* build an LED lamp that would
run from 120v AC with a minimum of components, but it's operation,
life, and effeciency would be very marginal. We're not talking about
lighting up a simple single LED, these modern 100w LED lamps use
active thermal management, switching power supplies, and other tricks
to provide a light that people can tolerate in a home setting for
their primary source of light. Take a look at:

http://www.earthled.com/evolux-led-light-bulb.html

This is why the bulbs are so expensive. It's not as simple as you
think.

EarthLED charges far too much. Costco has them here much cheaper than that.

You will see the prices drop to $3 a bulb in a year or two, US inflation
excluded. Say about 20 Yuan.
--
Take a look at ANY country, more debt is more problems. So why do we
allow our governments more debt? Selfishness, greed, denial, ignorance?