In article , says...

On 9/5/2012 5:30 PM, Califbill wrote:
"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 14:22:29 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article , says...

On 9/5/2012 1:06 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 17:13:52 -0400, JustWait
wrote:

Well, there is one up by one of our practice tracks. I have seen
it a
dozen times, only once was it actually running and that day, it was
annoying as hell with the noise.. and it's nearly a half mile
maybe a
mile as the crow flies to the mill from the track. Like I said
though,
most times, it's not moving even though there is windy up there
all the
time.

===

How big was it?

The small, fast turning wind generators like you see on cruising
boats, roof tops and small towers can make an annoying whirring
noise.
The big wind farms however use very large towers with slow turning
blades over 100 ft long. They are almost silent in my experience.


http://tuesdaysintempleton.com/2010/...-templeton-ma/

Yes, I know the rave reviews don't complain about the noise, but I
remember it made a thump, thump, thump as it ran that day. Again, I
have
only seen it run once, not really sure if it's doing anything for the
town according to the reviews...

You're insane. Either that or FOX told you they were loud.

http://www.gereports.com/how-loud-is-a-wind-turbine/


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD0v9_zV2uk

http://www.smallwindtips.com/2009/12...urbine-really/

Hmmm GE says wind turbines don't make noise. That is like the UMW
talking about clean coal.

If you live in the big city and are used to noise, they are not bad
but there is a noise. I am sure it is something you can ignore if they
are paying you enough to put the turbines there.

Did you notice there are other links as well? Again, I also have first
hand experience. Usually the prevailing winds make much more noise than
the turbines. Did you watch the video? That's what I heard as well,
nothing.
---------------------------
Depends on the design. I live in sight of Altamont Pass. The older
turbines are noisy. They are removing lots of the older smaller units
and putting in the big 300' diameter generators. Part of the problem
with the older faster ones is the bird kills. Do a Google on bird
kills and wind farms. Lots of the enviros are very down on the farms
for this very reason. Lots of the problem is it is raptors getting
killed as most of the land is open grazing land and lots of ground
squirrels to attract the Raptors, Golden Eagles especially. the other
problem is wind speed. They shut them down when the wind is blowing too
fast as well as not fast enough.


In other words, they aren't up to it.. Something I have been saying for
years..

You stupid moron!!! They are "up to it", and have been for a long time.

In article , says...

On 9/6/2012 12:13 AM, Califbill wrote:
"JustWait" wrote in message ...

On 9/5/2012 5:30 PM, Califbill wrote:
"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 14:22:29 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article , says...

On 9/5/2012 1:06 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 17:13:52 -0400, JustWait
wrote:

Well, there is one up by one of our practice tracks. I have seen
it a
dozen times, only once was it actually running and that day, it
was
annoying as hell with the noise.. and it's nearly a half mile
maybe a
mile as the crow flies to the mill from the track. Like I said
though,
most times, it's not moving even though there is windy up there
all the
time.

===

How big was it?

The small, fast turning wind generators like you see on cruising
boats, roof tops and small towers can make an annoying whirring
noise.
The big wind farms however use very large towers with slow turning
blades over 100 ft long. They are almost silent in my experience.


http://tuesdaysintempleton.com/2010/...-templeton-ma/

Yes, I know the rave reviews don't complain about the noise, but I
remember it made a thump, thump, thump as it ran that day. Again, I
have
only seen it run once, not really sure if it's doing anything for the
town according to the reviews...

You're insane. Either that or FOX told you they were loud.

http://www.gereports.com/how-loud-is-a-wind-turbine/


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD0v9_zV2uk

http://www.smallwindtips.com/2009/12...urbine-really/

Hmmm GE says wind turbines don't make noise. That is like the UMW
talking about clean coal.

If you live in the big city and are used to noise, they are not bad
but there is a noise. I am sure it is something you can ignore if they
are paying you enough to put the turbines there.

Did you notice there are other links as well? Again, I also have first
hand experience. Usually the prevailing winds make much more noise than
the turbines. Did you watch the video? That's what I heard as well,
nothing.
---------------------------
Depends on the design. I live in sight of Altamont Pass. The older
turbines are noisy. They are removing lots of the older smaller units
and putting in the big 300' diameter generators. Part of the problem
with the older faster ones is the bird kills. Do a Google on bird
kills and wind farms. Lots of the enviros are very down on the farms
for this very reason. Lots of the problem is it is raptors getting
killed as most of the land is open grazing land and lots of ground
squirrels to attract the Raptors, Golden Eagles especially. the other
problem is wind speed. They shut them down when the wind is blowing too
fast as well as not fast enough.


In other words, they aren't up to it.. Something I have been saying for
years..


---------------------------------
They are up to it, but they are not going to replace a very big
percentage of our power requirements.


I dunno, I am getting the impression the more I look that they are
creating more maintenance jobs, than electricity.

Cite?

... I will look into it
a bit more but I really don't hear a lot about successful "farms" and
most times when I see them in the northeast, they are not moving. Just
sayin'.

Really? Look at the wind farms in CA, western NY, etc.

In article ,
says...

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 17:13:52 -0400, JustWait
wrote:

Well, there is one up by one of our practice tracks. I have seen it a
dozen times, only once was it actually running and that day, it was
annoying as hell with the noise.. and it's nearly a half mile maybe a
mile as the crow flies to the mill from the track. Like I said though,
most times, it's not moving even though there is windy up there all the
time.

===

How big was it?

The small, fast turning wind generators like you see on cruising
boats, roof tops and small towers can make an annoying whirring noise.
The big wind farms however use very large towers with slow turning
blades over 100 ft long. They are almost silent in my experience.

It's more insane right wing bull****. I've been near the ones on
Altamont Pass in CA, never heard a noise from them. I have a relative on
a farm in western PA where they have them now, and no noise.

---------------------------------------------------------
the ones on Altamont are noisy if you are close. Especially the older ones.
If you fish or boat Bethany Reservoir you will be up close and personal with
the turbines.

Been there, not very noisy at all, and they are the old type. The ones
in western PA and western NY are virtually noiseless.

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 17:52:06 -0400, JustWait
wrote:

Most of the comments I have seen are skeptical as to any return at all
from the Mill in Templeton Mass... Like I said, it's usually locked down
and stationary whenever I am there for weekends..

===

Do yourself a favor and visit one of the large wind farms before
making snap judgements. I've seen several that were very impressive
and the people that lived near them had no issues. Here is one of
them:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZZ-6uIKa0o

The background noise that you hear is wind on the microphone.

But Scotty the expert says that they don't work!!!!!

On Thu, 06 Sep 2012 12:23:06 -0400, wrote:

The thing I noticed at the ones we saw in Canada and North Dakota was
more of a thump than a loud noise. You feel it more than hear it.

===

What causes the "thump" ?

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article , says...

On 9/6/2012 12:13 AM, Califbill wrote:
"JustWait" wrote in message ...

On 9/5/2012 5:30 PM, Califbill wrote:
"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 14:22:29 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article , says...

On 9/5/2012 1:06 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 17:13:52 -0400, JustWait

wrote:

Well, there is one up by one of our practice tracks. I have seen
it a
dozen times, only once was it actually running and that day, it
was
annoying as hell with the noise.. and it's nearly a half mile
maybe a
mile as the crow flies to the mill from the track. Like I said
though,
most times, it's not moving even though there is windy up there
all the
time.

===

How big was it?

The small, fast turning wind generators like you see on cruising
boats, roof tops and small towers can make an annoying whirring
noise.
The big wind farms however use very large towers with slow
turning
blades over 100 ft long. They are almost silent in my
experience.


http://tuesdaysintempleton.com/2010/...-templeton-ma/

Yes, I know the rave reviews don't complain about the noise, but I
remember it made a thump, thump, thump as it ran that day. Again, I
have
only seen it run once, not really sure if it's doing anything for
the
town according to the reviews...

You're insane. Either that or FOX told you they were loud.

http://www.gereports.com/how-loud-is-a-wind-turbine/


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD0v9_zV2uk

http://www.smallwindtips.com/2009/12...urbine-really/

Hmmm GE says wind turbines don't make noise. That is like the UMW
talking about clean coal.

If you live in the big city and are used to noise, they are not bad
but there is a noise. I am sure it is something you can ignore if they
are paying you enough to put the turbines there.

Did you notice there are other links as well? Again, I also have first
hand experience. Usually the prevailing winds make much more noise than
the turbines. Did you watch the video? That's what I heard as well,
nothing.
---------------------------
Depends on the design. I live in sight of Altamont Pass. The older
turbines are noisy. They are removing lots of the older smaller units
and putting in the big 300' diameter generators. Part of the problem
with the older faster ones is the bird kills. Do a Google on bird
kills and wind farms. Lots of the enviros are very down on the farms
for this very reason. Lots of the problem is it is raptors getting
killed as most of the land is open grazing land and lots of ground
squirrels to attract the Raptors, Golden Eagles especially. the other
problem is wind speed. They shut them down when the wind is blowing
too
fast as well as not fast enough.


In other words, they aren't up to it.. Something I have been saying for
years..


---------------------------------
They are up to it, but they are not going to replace a very big
percentage of our power requirements.


I dunno, I am getting the impression the more I look that they are
creating more maintenance jobs, than electricity.

Cite?

... I will look into it
a bit more but I really don't hear a lot about successful "farms" and
most times when I see them in the northeast, they are not moving. Just
sayin'.

Really? Look at the wind farms in CA, western NY, etc.

---------------------------
Living near the wind farms in California and towing the boat by them when
going to the Delta and lakes, you see lots of dead windmills. Especially
the older models. The new ones take less overall maintenance as there are
fewer for the same power output. But figuring the amount of dead old ones,
how much actual energy gain did we get? Figure the energy to manufacture
and install and maintain them. Plus look at the growth of energy
consumption. We need to change the connectors to most rechargeable
electronic to the same type. Then you would not have to have 10 different
wall warts plugged in consuming energy when nothing is being charged.
Probably Nuclear is the only answer to having enough electrical energy
without the environmental drawbacks of coal mining and oil usage. We just
have to decide how to handle the waste from a nuke plant, which is not that
much high level amount wise.

On Thu, 6 Sep 2012 10:12:39 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:

The new ones take less overall maintenance as there are
fewer for the same power output. But figuring the amount of dead old ones,
how much actual energy gain did we get?

===

As an engineer you must know about climbing up the learning curve.
This modern generation of wind farms is less than 10 years old which
is not exactly a mature technology yet. Considering that each large
windmill saves the energy equivalent of $400/hour of fossil fuel, it's
worth some time and effort.

From a strategic standpoint it is very important that we figure out
how to make ourselves independent of middle eastern energy sources.
They don't like us very much and it's only a matter of time before the
entire region becomes unstable and unreliable.

I'm beginning to think there's yet another sailboat in my future.
(please note clever introduction of an on topic subject)

On Thu, 06 Sep 2012 15:24:47 -0400, wrote:

If you want to worry about that, look at our Israel policy.

===

I wouldn't touch that with *your* ten foot pole.

On Thu, 06 Sep 2012 15:33:20 -0400, wrote:

Sailboats are a whole other thing. If you want to sail, do it. That is
a tried and true technology but it was pushed to the "hobby" category
by the drawbacks.

===

Sailing can be a lot of fun in good conditions but it's a lousy way to
get somewhere unless you want to cross oceans in a small boat. I
still sail a little bit with other people but don't think I'd ever get
my wife interested in cruising on a sailboat again.

"thunder" wrote in message ...

On Thu, 06 Sep 2012 16:56:19 -0700, Califbill wrote:

Yes we are on the learning curve, but it will be near impossible to
really get enough reliable energy via wind or solar to replace most of
the power plants. Especially with the growth in energy consumption.

Maybe not most of the power plants, but plans are for 20% by 2030. South
Dakota is already producing 20% of their needs with wind energy. Iowa is
right on their tail.
-----------------------------
Lots of wind, open land and little population or manufacturing. Easy to
supply 20%. Do not know the percentage anymore but in the 1970's 50% of the
people lived within 500 miles of NYC. So how do you supply that dense
population? Where are the consistant winds?