On 2/19/13 9:59 AM, JustWaitAFrekinMinute wrote:


Funny how it's the bigger nanny states, they really don't want their
citizens to have a "say" in their government... Mass is a perfect example.


You should take your anti-psychotic meds before you start posting nonsense.

--
I'm a *Liberal* because I knew the militant christian fundamentalist
racist militaristic xenophobic corporate oligarchy wasn't going to work
for me.

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

For kicks I looked up the leading causes of death in the USA. Data
is the final numbers from 2010 as published by the Center for
Disease
Control.
Surprisingly, firearms related deaths didn't make the top ten and
firearms related homicides weren't even close to the top ten. It's
interesting that deaths caused by traffic accidents numbered about 3
times those of homicides involving firearms, but all the focus is on
more gun control laws.

Personal note: This is not a excuse of deaths caused by firearms,
but
rather an attempt to put it all in perspective.

Heart disease: 597,689
Cancer: 574,743
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 138,080
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 129,476
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 120,859
Alzheimer's disease: 83,494
Diabetes: 69,071
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 50,476
Influenza and Pneumonia: 50,097
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 38,364
Traffic accidents: 33,808
Firearms: 30,470 (19,392 suicides, 11,078 homicides)

Yes, all true, BUT, the thing is, a lot of the natural causes aren't
preventable, and besides, the ONLY one of the above that is
manufactured
to kill is the firearm.

---------------------------------------------

There are millions of gun owners who use, collect and enjoy firearms
who have never killed anything with one, let alone another human.
Realistically, it's a tiny percentage of the population who have and
most of them obtained their weapons illegally.

I am for permits, background checks and I don't object to the taking
of electronic fingerprints for each purchase. But what good does it
do to punish the law abiding population for the actions of a violent
few by limiting the number of purchases and taxing the bananas out of
ammunition?

On Tuesday, February 19, 2013 11:10:15 AM UTC-4, Eisboch wrote:
"iBoaterer" wrote in message

...



In article ,

says...



For kicks I looked up the leading causes of death in the USA. Data

is the final numbers from 2010 as published by the Center for

Disease

Control.

Surprisingly, firearms related deaths didn't make the top ten and

firearms related homicides weren't even close to the top ten. It's

interesting that deaths caused by traffic accidents numbered about 3

times those of homicides involving firearms, but all the focus is on

more gun control laws.



Personal note: This is not a excuse of deaths caused by firearms,

but

rather an attempt to put it all in perspective.



Heart disease: 597,689

Cancer: 574,743

Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 138,080

Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 129,476

Accidents (unintentional injuries): 120,859

Alzheimer's disease: 83,494

Diabetes: 69,071

Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 50,476

Influenza and Pneumonia: 50,097

Intentional self-harm (suicide): 38,364

Traffic accidents: 33,808

Firearms: 30,470 (19,392 suicides, 11,078 homicides)



Yes, all true, BUT, the thing is, a lot of the natural causes aren't

preventable, and besides, the ONLY one of the above that is

manufactured

to kill is the firearm.



---------------------------------------------



There are millions of gun owners who use, collect and enjoy firearms

who have never killed anything with one, let alone another human.

Realistically, it's a tiny percentage of the population who have and

most of them obtained their weapons illegally.



I am for permits, background checks and I don't object to the taking

of electronic fingerprints for each purchase. But what good does it

do to punish the law abiding population for the actions of a violent

few by limiting the number of purchases and taxing the bananas out of

ammunition?


Limiting to one gun purchase a month is a hardship?
Over 5 short years a person could horde 60 guns??
I'd say one gun a year would be plenty.

"True North" wrote in message
...



Limiting to one gun purchase a month is a hardship?
Over 5 short years a person could horde 60 guns??
I'd say one gun a year would be plenty.

--------------------------------------

I belong to a Sportsman's Club, the activities of which includes
target practice with handguns and rifles, skeet and trap shooting, old
black powder muzzle loader shooting, archery, knife and even tomahawk
throwing. If you want to get involved there are competitive events
with other clubs and ranges It's a hobby and interest for many.
There is also active activity in selling and buying different types of
guns plus many collectors. All normal, healthy and legal
transactions with paperwork records sent to the state.

If you only view firearm ownership through the jaundiced eye of the
media hype, your comments are understandable. But it's not reality.

In article ,
says...

On 2/19/2013 9:56 AM, Meyer wrote:
On 2/19/2013 9:55 AM, Salmonbait wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 09:48:20 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:



"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 2/19/13 9:00 AM, Eisboch wrote:
For kicks I looked up the leading causes of death in the USA. Data
is
the final numbers from 2010 as published by the Center for Disease
Control.
Surprisingly, firearms related deaths didn't make the top ten and
firearms related homicides weren't even close to the top ten. It's
interesting that deaths caused by traffic accidents numbered about 3
times those of homicides involving firearms, but all the focus is on
more gun control laws.

Personal note: This is not a excuse of deaths caused by firearms,
but
rather an attempt to put it all in perspective.

Heart disease: 597,689
Cancer: 574,743
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 138,080
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 129,476
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 120,859
Alzheimer's disease: 83,494
Diabetes: 69,071
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 50,476
Influenza and Pneumonia: 50,097
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 38,364
Traffic accidents: 33,808
Firearms: 30,470 (19,392 suicides, 11,078 homicides)


There are solid statistically based predictions that state that
firearms
deaths will exceed traffic accident deaths in a couple of years.

Oh, you forgot to list the number of Americans who die of old age.

On a more serious note, I only took one college-level statistics
course
and have forgotten most of what I ever learned about that sort of
math,
so I asked a family member who has taken four graduate-level stats
courses about these sorts of comparisons (gun deaths vs. car deaths
vs.
cancer deaths, et cetera) and got a chuckle in response. "Such
comparisions are based on silliness and are statistically absurd. Yes,
more people die of cancer than of gunshot wounds but...so what?"

==========================

The number that surprised me was deaths by homicide involving
firearms. I read the same thing you did regarding firearm deaths
exceeding traffic deaths by 2015 however that includes suicides.
Unfortunately, although a gun is the method of choice for most
suicides, further gun restrictions won't eliminate them. As stated
in my post, the data is presented simply to put things in
perspective. 11,078 firearms related homicides is too many of course
but it's a reflection of violence in our society ... which also cannot
be totally eliminated. There are bad people in the world. But the
number is not the huge number that some of the media and proponents of
even more gun control measure would like you to believe.

My state has some of the strictest gun control laws in the nation.

Funny how it's the bigger nanny states, they really don't want their
citizens to have a "say" in their government... Mass is a perfect example.

You stupid little fool!!! What does ANY of the above have to do with ANY
state's citizens having a "say" in their government? Do you know
(probably not) that the people that run states are hired BY those
"citizens"? It's called voting.

On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 10:10:15 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:



"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

For kicks I looked up the leading causes of death in the USA. Data
is the final numbers from 2010 as published by the Center for
Disease
Control.
Surprisingly, firearms related deaths didn't make the top ten and
firearms related homicides weren't even close to the top ten. It's
interesting that deaths caused by traffic accidents numbered about 3
times those of homicides involving firearms, but all the focus is on
more gun control laws.

Personal note: This is not a excuse of deaths caused by firearms,
but
rather an attempt to put it all in perspective.

Heart disease: 597,689
Cancer: 574,743
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 138,080
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 129,476
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 120,859
Alzheimer's disease: 83,494
Diabetes: 69,071
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 50,476
Influenza and Pneumonia: 50,097
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 38,364
Traffic accidents: 33,808
Firearms: 30,470 (19,392 suicides, 11,078 homicides)

Yes, all true, BUT, the thing is, a lot of the natural causes aren't
preventable, and besides, the ONLY one of the above that is
manufactured
to kill is the firearm.

---------------------------------------------

There are millions of gun owners who use, collect and enjoy firearms
who have never killed anything with one, let alone another human.
Realistically, it's a tiny percentage of the population who have and
most of them obtained their weapons illegally.

I am for permits, background checks and I don't object to the taking
of electronic fingerprints for each purchase. But what good does it
do to punish the law abiding population for the actions of a violent
few by limiting the number of purchases and taxing the bananas out of
ammunition?

Why is it considered punishment to limit the number of guns and ammo
that are owned by the public?

Is it punishment that I want to own a tank with the capacity to shell
an area of the desert that wouldn't be affected by my hobby? Why
can't I own surface to air missles so that I can shoot down my own
drones? Why can't I own a mortar setup so I can play with it when I
want to?

Why am I being punished?

I wonder what would happen with the suicide stats if guns were
incapable of shooting the person holding them. Would they find
another way? What percentage? Should we make other, less violent
methods available to suicidal persons?

Lastly, what do you suppose the percentages of young people (let's say
under 20) that die in gun related homicides or suicides vs all those
other maladies? I'm sure a lot die in car accidents but all those
stats above? Not so many.

On 2/19/13 11:08 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 09:58:33 -0500, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

The number of suicides by gun might drop if it were a bit more difficult
and time consuming to buy pistols. In my state, there's a waiting period
that ends up running about 10 days from purchase to approval by the
state police. If you are suicidal and want a gun to end it and you don't
have one, you might change your mind in 10 days.

Not likely. Most people who seriously contemplate suicide, eventually
decide to do it.

- - -

You have valid statistics on that?

On 2/19/2013 11:06 AM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On 2/19/2013 9:56 AM, Meyer wrote:
On 2/19/2013 9:55 AM, Salmonbait wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 09:48:20 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:



"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 2/19/13 9:00 AM, Eisboch wrote:
For kicks I looked up the leading causes of death in the USA. Data
is
the final numbers from 2010 as published by the Center for Disease
Control.
Surprisingly, firearms related deaths didn't make the top ten and
firearms related homicides weren't even close to the top ten. It's
interesting that deaths caused by traffic accidents numbered about 3
times those of homicides involving firearms, but all the focus is on
more gun control laws.

Personal note: This is not a excuse of deaths caused by firearms,
but
rather an attempt to put it all in perspective.

Heart disease: 597,689
Cancer: 574,743
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 138,080
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 129,476
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 120,859
Alzheimer's disease: 83,494
Diabetes: 69,071
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 50,476
Influenza and Pneumonia: 50,097
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 38,364
Traffic accidents: 33,808
Firearms: 30,470 (19,392 suicides, 11,078 homicides)


There are solid statistically based predictions that state that
firearms
deaths will exceed traffic accident deaths in a couple of years.

Oh, you forgot to list the number of Americans who die of old age.

On a more serious note, I only took one college-level statistics
course
and have forgotten most of what I ever learned about that sort of
math,
so I asked a family member who has taken four graduate-level stats
courses about these sorts of comparisons (gun deaths vs. car deaths
vs.
cancer deaths, et cetera) and got a chuckle in response. "Such
comparisions are based on silliness and are statistically absurd. Yes,
more people die of cancer than of gunshot wounds but...so what?"

==========================

The number that surprised me was deaths by homicide involving
firearms. I read the same thing you did regarding firearm deaths
exceeding traffic deaths by 2015 however that includes suicides.
Unfortunately, although a gun is the method of choice for most
suicides, further gun restrictions won't eliminate them. As stated
in my post, the data is presented simply to put things in
perspective. 11,078 firearms related homicides is too many of course
but it's a reflection of violence in our society ... which also cannot
be totally eliminated. There are bad people in the world. But the
number is not the huge number that some of the media and proponents of
even more gun control measure would like you to believe.

My state has some of the strictest gun control laws in the nation.

Funny how it's the bigger nanny states, they really don't want their
citizens to have a "say" in their government... Mass is a perfect example.

You stupid little fool!!!

You fat old drunk... do you really think I am gonna' read anything you
write?

"jps" wrote in message
...


Lastly, what do you suppose the percentages of young people (let's say
under 20) that die in gun related homicides or suicides vs all those
other maladies? I'm sure a lot die in car accidents but all those
stats above? Not so many.

--------------------------------------------------

Interestingly, I recently looked up the statistics on automobile
accidents.

By far, the most occur with drivers between the ages of 45 and 55.
It's something like 20 percent.

Old farts (like me) account for less than 6 percent.

On 2/19/13 11:33 AM, JustWaitAFrekinMinute wrote:
On 2/19/2013 11:06 AM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On 2/19/2013 9:56 AM, Meyer wrote:
On 2/19/2013 9:55 AM, Salmonbait wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 09:48:20 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:



"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 2/19/13 9:00 AM, Eisboch wrote:
For kicks I looked up the leading causes of death in the USA. Data
is
the final numbers from 2010 as published by the Center for Disease
Control.
Surprisingly, firearms related deaths didn't make the top ten and
firearms related homicides weren't even close to the top ten. It's
interesting that deaths caused by traffic accidents numbered about 3
times those of homicides involving firearms, but all the focus is on
more gun control laws.

Personal note: This is not a excuse of deaths caused by firearms,
but
rather an attempt to put it all in perspective.

Heart disease: 597,689
Cancer: 574,743
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 138,080
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 129,476
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 120,859
Alzheimer's disease: 83,494
Diabetes: 69,071
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 50,476
Influenza and Pneumonia: 50,097
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 38,364
Traffic accidents: 33,808
Firearms: 30,470 (19,392 suicides, 11,078 homicides)


There are solid statistically based predictions that state that
firearms
deaths will exceed traffic accident deaths in a couple of years.

Oh, you forgot to list the number of Americans who die of old age.

On a more serious note, I only took one college-level statistics
course
and have forgotten most of what I ever learned about that sort of
math,
so I asked a family member who has taken four graduate-level stats
courses about these sorts of comparisons (gun deaths vs. car deaths
vs.
cancer deaths, et cetera) and got a chuckle in response. "Such
comparisions are based on silliness and are statistically absurd.
Yes,
more people die of cancer than of gunshot wounds but...so what?"

==========================

The number that surprised me was deaths by homicide involving
firearms. I read the same thing you did regarding firearm deaths
exceeding traffic deaths by 2015 however that includes suicides.
Unfortunately, although a gun is the method of choice for most
suicides, further gun restrictions won't eliminate them. As stated
in my post, the data is presented simply to put things in
perspective. 11,078 firearms related homicides is too many of course
but it's a reflection of violence in our society ... which also
cannot
be totally eliminated. There are bad people in the world. But the
number is not the huge number that some of the media and
proponents of
even more gun control measure would like you to believe.

My state has some of the strictest gun control laws in the nation.

Funny how it's the bigger nanny states, they really don't want their
citizens to have a "say" in their government... Mass is a perfect
example.

You stupid little fool!!!

You fat old drunk... do you really think I am gonna' read anything you
write?



Yup. Because...you do.

--
I'm a *Liberal* because I knew the militant christian fundamentalist
racist militaristic xenophobic corporate oligarchy wasn't going to work
for me.