On Sat, 27 Apr 2013 09:35:42 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:

Stories like this don't get much media attention:

http://www.abc4.com/mostpopular/story/conceal-and-carry-stabbing-salt-lake-city-smiths/NDNrL1gxeE2rsRhrWCM9dQ.cspx

Agreed but perhaps it's because they don't happen as often as the
other kind of events. Suicide by gun happens 17,000 times a year on
average. Homicides add another 13,000 to 15,000.

Don't know if you ever watch Jon Stewart, but John Oliver just did a
brilliant 3 part series on Australia's effort to curb gun violence.
Highly recommned checking it out if you haven't seen it.

Enacated by conservatives, BTW.

In article , says...

On Sat, 27 Apr 2013 09:35:42 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:

Stories like this don't get much media attention:

http://www.abc4.com/mostpopular/story/conceal-and-carry-stabbing-salt-lake-city-smiths/NDNrL1gxeE2rsRhrWCM9dQ.cspx

Agreed but perhaps it's because they don't happen as often as the
other kind of events. Suicide by gun happens 17,000 times a year on
average. Homicides add another 13,000 to 15,000.

Don't know if you ever watch Jon Stewart, but John Oliver just did a
brilliant 3 part series on Australia's effort to curb gun violence.
Highly recommned checking it out if you haven't seen it.

Enacated by conservatives, BTW.

A fake news reporter on a fake news show? Really?

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 20:44:31 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 13:10:42 -0700, jps wrote:

Don't know if you ever watch Jon Stewart, but John Oliver just did a
brilliant 3 part series on Australia's effort to curb gun violence.
Highly recommned checking it out if you haven't seen it.

Enacated by conservatives, BTW.

The thing Oliver and most other people ignore is that although the
number of gun homicides fell, the number of murders remained pretty
constant only dropping about the same time US crime rates dropped.
(the last 8-10 years)
In fact the murder rate in Australia actually rose slightly for the 3
years after the buy back.

http://www.gunsandcrime.org/homihisty.gif

Sorry, Greg. Hard to take any of that seriously considering we
haven't a clue about the author or the veracity of research behind the
numbers.

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 13:10:42 -0700, jps wrote:

Don't know if you ever watch Jon Stewart, but John Oliver just did a
brilliant 3 part series on Australia's effort to curb gun violence.
Highly recommned checking it out if you haven't seen it.

Enacated by conservatives, BTW.

The thing Oliver and most other people ignore is that although the
number of gun homicides fell, the number of murders remained pretty
constant only dropping about the same time US crime rates dropped.
(the last 8-10 years)
In fact the murder rate in Australia actually rose slightly for the 3
years after the buy back.

http://www.gunsandcrime.org/homihisty.gif

Guns are great, more guns somehow equates to less gun death, got it....
HOW?

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 18:21:01 -0700, jps wrote:

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 20:44:31 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 13:10:42 -0700, jps wrote:

Don't know if you ever watch Jon Stewart, but John Oliver just did a
brilliant 3 part series on Australia's effort to curb gun violence.
Highly recommned checking it out if you haven't seen it.

Enacated by conservatives, BTW.

The thing Oliver and most other people ignore is that although the
number of gun homicides fell, the number of murders remained pretty
constant only dropping about the same time US crime rates dropped.
(the last 8-10 years)
In fact the murder rate in Australia actually rose slightly for the 3
years after the buy back.

http://www.gunsandcrime.org/homihisty.gif

Sorry, Greg. Hard to take any of that seriously considering we
haven't a clue about the author or the veracity of research behind the
numbers.

Do you believe the Australian government?

http://www.aic.gov.au/media_library/...tandi359-1.png

Please show me how more guns equals less gun deaths.

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 21:57:29 -0400, iBoaterer
wrote:

In article ,
says...


http://www.aic.gov.au/media_library/...tandi359-1.png

Please show me how more guns equals less gun deaths.

You always try to change the subject don't you. We are talking about
the murder rate.

I bet the dead people (or their family) don't care that the murderer
used a knife or a blunt instrument.
If you look at this chart, you see MORE people were murdered the year
after the guns were confiscated and they had a huge spike in 2001-2002
with virtually no guns in the country.


You take some graph spikes to make outlandish claims? Not wise.
Then somebody just links this.
http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2013/s3694783.htm
Here's the bottom line:
"...the number of homicide victims in Australia has dropped by 31 per
cent over the last decade and the proportion of murder or manslaughter
crimes committed by firearm has dropped to an historic low of 13 per
cent."
So basically what you've said about Aussies just changing weapons to
commit even more murder - is gun-nut bull****.
So is your above "virtually no guns in the country" gun-nut bull****
There are +3 million registered civilian guns, and many illegally held
guns in Australia.
Luckily for Aussies, 90% of their gun deaths are suicide or domestic
incidents.
Besides, Australian laws are just used as a red herring for gun-nut
Americans. Totally different country.
Just a way to distract from the fact that the gun-nuts here want it kept
legal to sell guns to anybody without a background check. That includes
criminals and nutjobs. That way they keep themselves "legal" when they
sell to criminals and nutjobs.
Legal trash anyway.

This did not come from the NRA either. It is from the Australian
government.

You should be ashamed of yourself, posting that bull**** graph, then
spinning yarns about what it means.

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 21:57:29 -0400, iBoaterer
wrote:

In article ,
says...


http://www.aic.gov.au/media_library/...tandi359-1.png

Please show me how more guns equals less gun deaths.

You always try to change the subject don't you. We are talking about
the murder rate.

Okay, show me how more guns lowers the murder rate....

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 1 May 2013 09:04:18 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 29 Apr 2013 21:57:29 -0400, iBoaterer
wrote:

In article ,
says...


http://www.aic.gov.au/media_library/...tandi359-1.png

Please show me how more guns equals less gun deaths.

You always try to change the subject don't you. We are talking about
the murder rate.

Okay, show me how more guns lowers the murder rate....


You certainly can't use Australia to show it cut the murder rate. They
don't shoot as many people but the government's own numbers showed the
decline in murder was a straight line through the destruction of
millions of guns. There wasn't even a blip.

Our murder rate is declining on a similar slope and we have a lot more
guns every year.

I'll ask one more time, show me how more guns equates to a lower murder
rate. Let's take your average city. One would think that according to
you, a ghetto where just about every teen and adult has guns that the
murder rate would be lower there than in a middle class neighborhood
where every kid and adult doesn't have a gun, right?

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 1 May 2013 12:10:57 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

Okay, show me how more guns lowers the murder rate....


You certainly can't use Australia to show it cut the murder rate. They
don't shoot as many people but the government's own numbers showed the
decline in murder was a straight line through the destruction of
millions of guns. There wasn't even a blip.

Our murder rate is declining on a similar slope and we have a lot more
guns every year.

I'll ask one more time, show me how more guns equates to a lower murder
rate. Let's take your average city. One would think that according to
you, a ghetto where just about every teen and adult has guns that the
murder rate would be lower there than in a middle class neighborhood
where every kid and adult doesn't have a gun, right?


Who said more guns? That is a straw man you set up. I am just saying
and demonstrating with Australia's actual statistics, taking away guns
has a minimal effect on the overall murder rate.

Go back to the beginning of the thread, that's where you'll find your
answer.

On 5/1/13 7:05 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 1 May 2013 17:14:11 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

Who said more guns? That is a straw man you set up. I am just saying
and demonstrating with Australia's actual statistics, taking away guns
has a minimal effect on the overall murder rate.

Go back to the beginning of the thread, that's where you'll find your
answer.

OK the top note in this thread links this article

SALT LAKE CITY (ABC 4 News) - A citizen with a gun stopped a knife
wielding man as he began stabbing people Thursday evening at the
downtown Salt Lake City Smith's store.

That gun meant less murders.




Cumberland County Toddler Shot and Killed After Tragic Accident

Around 1:30 yesterday afternoon Kentucky State Police were called to a
shooting on Lawson Bottom Rd. in Burkesville.

Police say, 2-year-old Caroline Sparks was shot and it was her
five-year-old brother, Christian, who pulled the trigger.

A close family friend, Monica Pepper was with the Sparks family minutes
after the shooting.

She says Christian was not playing with the gun before his mother left
the room.

"She just stepped out for a second. She set the mop bucket down and
heard the gun go off. The child didn't have the gun in his hand when she
was in there with him. She would have never walked outside," she says.

The gun was given to Christian as a gift.