On 2/28/2014 12:22 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 10:11:37 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 2/28/2014 9:43 AM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 09:38:11 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 2/28/2014 8:16 AM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 04:50:05 -0800 (PST), Tim wrote:

On Friday, February 28, 2014 6:31:44 AM UTC-6, John H. wrote:


But, they just got some parts and fixed it! I'd like to see pictures and a story just about that.

But the bottom line was typical Guzzi:



"The alternator died because we were overtaxing it with the two fans—we swapped batteries at each

driver change. The oil-pressure gauge started showing zero psi, yet it kept running, so we kept

driving it. Eventually, it crossed the finish on day two with the checkers."



Reminds me of the time one of my coils died, but the 850T got Sandy and I home on one cylinder -

from Munich to Stuttgart. The bike sounded like a 'Ma Deuce' going down the road without the plug,

but it got us home.

bet it shook like thunder too!

Like shooting the M-2.

The other day you asked about Guzzi's big bike. I came across this review this morning.

http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-ambassador-review-91469.html



Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect
example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction
of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can
almost sense it.

http://www.motorcycle.com/gallery/gallery.php/d/358550-1/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-action-30.jpg

Yup, and it's a beautiful bike also!



I am wondering how other big bike manufacturers like Moto-Guzzi are
dealing with EPA exhaust standards on their new bikes. Harley-Davidson
has been putting catalytic converters on all their bikes since 2010 and
the big, touring models for 2014 will be water-cooled vs the traditional
air cooling.

I heard about this when I bought my last UltraClassic. I went for a
2009 model to avoid the catalytic converter (which were new in the 2010
models). The ones equipped with a cat have to be tuned very lean to
meet EPA emission standards and the lean mixture makes them run hotter
than previous models. There was also talk at the time (apparently
true) that the big bikes would eventually have to go to liquid cooling
because air cooling had too many engine temp variables to meet the EPA
standards. The engine has to be kept at a fairly constant temp (like a
car) in order to meet the emission standards.

Even the 2009 model I had could burn the inside of your right leg if you
got caught in stop and go traffic on a hot day. You could have the bike
programmed to shut off the front cylinder under certain conditions
(stopped, clutch lever pulled, throttle at idle) which would allow the
front cylinder to simply pump air, minus fuel and ignition, in order to
lower the overall engine temp. As soon as you started to hit the
throttle and engage the clutch, it started firing again.



Guzzis have had catalytic converters from about 2003 onward. From the Guzzi forums, it seems like
lots of folks get rid of them (illegally). I've had 'Competition Only' exhaust on my Guzzi since
about 1992, and haven't had a problem with any 'enforcers' yet. It's not as loud as a straight pipe
Harley, so I'm OK on the noise side - but not by much.

Guzzis are still air cooled. I've never had a problem with the heat from the engine, although the
cylinder design would indicate that a lot of heat would blow back on the legs. In cold weather, it's
nice to be able to lay hands on the valve covers at stop lights for a quick warm up. I do it moving
also. I wonder if that rear cylinder on Harleys doesn't get really hot because it's not in the air
flow. I see, looking at Google, they're starting to water cool their engines.

I'd never have thought that Harley would come up with something as advanced as one cylinder shutting
down at a stop light.


It was due to the design of the exhaust on the big bikes. There is (or
was) a crossover that connected right below your right thigh. Not a
problem as long as the bike was moving but on hot days in stop and go
traffic, the area of the crossover started to sear your thigh. Only
happened to me twice ... once on the way to the Cape when traffic at the
bridge got backed up and the other when I went to DC for Rolling
Thunder. We were staying at a motel in Manassas, VA and the ride back
from the Mall was brutal due to traffic.

On 2/28/2014 8:38 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/28/2014 8:16 AM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 04:50:05 -0800 (PST), Tim
wrote:

On Friday, February 28, 2014 6:31:44 AM UTC-6, John H. wrote:


But, they just got some parts and fixed it! I'd like to see pictures
and a story just about that.

But the bottom line was typical Guzzi:



"The alternator died because we were overtaxing it with the two
fans—we swapped batteries at each

driver change. The oil-pressure gauge started showing zero psi, yet
it kept running, so we kept

driving it. Eventually, it crossed the finish on day two with the
checkers."



Reminds me of the time one of my coils died, but the 850T got Sandy
and I home on one cylinder -

from Munich to Stuttgart. The bike sounded like a 'Ma Deuce' going
down the road without the plug,

but it got us home.

bet it shook like thunder too!

Like shooting the M-2.

The other day you asked about Guzzi's big bike. I came across this
review this morning.

http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-ambassador-review-91469.html




Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect
example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction
of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can
almost sense it.

http://www.motorcycle.com/gallery/gallery.php/d/358550-1/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-action-30.jpg

troll.

On Friday, February 28, 2014 10:11:37 AM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/28/2014 9:43 AM, Poco Loco wrote:

On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 09:38:11 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:



On 2/28/2014 8:16 AM, Poco Loco wrote:

On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 04:50:05 -0800 (PST), Tim wrote:



On Friday, February 28, 2014 6:31:44 AM UTC-6, John H. wrote:





But, they just got some parts and fixed it! I'd like to see pictures and a story just about that.



But the bottom line was typical Guzzi:







"The alternator died because we were overtaxing it with the two fans--we swapped batteries at each



driver change. The oil-pressure gauge started showing zero psi, yet it kept running, so we kept



driving it. Eventually, it crossed the finish on day two with the checkers."







Reminds me of the time one of my coils died, but the 850T got Sandy and I home on one cylinder -



from Munich to Stuttgart. The bike sounded like a 'Ma Deuce' going down the road without the plug,



but it got us home.



bet it shook like thunder too!



Like shooting the M-2.



The other day you asked about Guzzi's big bike. I came across this review this morning.



http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-ambassador-review-91469.html







Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect

example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction

of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can

almost sense it.



http://www.motorcycle.com/gallery/gallery.php/d/358550-1/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-action-30.jpg



Yup, and it's a beautiful bike also!







I am wondering how other big bike manufacturers like Moto-Guzzi are

dealing with EPA exhaust standards on their new bikes. Harley-Davidson

has been putting catalytic converters on all their bikes since 2010 and

the big, touring models for 2014 will be water-cooled vs the traditional

air cooling.



I heard about this when I bought my last UltraClassic. I went for a

2009 model to avoid the catalytic converter (which were new in the 2010

models). The ones equipped with a cat have to be tuned very lean to

meet EPA emission standards and the lean mixture makes them run hotter

than previous models. There was also talk at the time (apparently

true) that the big bikes would eventually have to go to liquid cooling

because air cooling had too many engine temp variables to meet the EPA

standards. The engine has to be kept at a fairly constant temp (like a

car) in order to meet the emission standards.



Even the 2009 model I had could burn the inside of your right leg if you

got caught in stop and go traffic on a hot day. You could have the bike

programmed to shut off the front cylinder under certain conditions

(stopped, clutch lever pulled, throttle at idle) which would allow the

front cylinder to simply pump air, minus fuel and ignition, in order to

lower the overall engine temp. As soon as you started to hit the

throttle and engage the clutch, it started firing again.

My brother in NC has a 2009 Harley. His shuts down the front cylinder at stop lights as you mentioned. His came that way, no extra programming required. He's been happy with it - no problems. He's happy that he waited for the 2009. He'd had one before but he was looking forward to all the changes that came with the 2009 model. (Of which I know nothing, naturally.)

As soon as I asked him about it, he says, "What's up, you thinking of buying a Harley, finally?" Told him I might do so when the Guzzi hits 50 years old.

On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 13:52:38 -0600, HanK wrote:

On 2/28/2014 8:38 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/28/2014 8:16 AM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 04:50:05 -0800 (PST), Tim
wrote:

On Friday, February 28, 2014 6:31:44 AM UTC-6, John H. wrote:


But, they just got some parts and fixed it! I'd like to see pictures
and a story just about that.

But the bottom line was typical Guzzi:



"The alternator died because we were overtaxing it with the two
fans—we swapped batteries at each

driver change. The oil-pressure gauge started showing zero psi, yet
it kept running, so we kept

driving it. Eventually, it crossed the finish on day two with the
checkers."



Reminds me of the time one of my coils died, but the 850T got Sandy
and I home on one cylinder -

from Munich to Stuttgart. The bike sounded like a 'Ma Deuce' going
down the road without the plug,

but it got us home.

bet it shook like thunder too!

Like shooting the M-2.

The other day you asked about Guzzi's big bike. I came across this
review this morning.

http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-ambassador-review-91469.html




Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect
example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction
of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can
almost sense it.

http://www.motorcycle.com/gallery/gallery.php/d/358550-1/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-action-30.jpg

troll.

Observant troll! :)

On 2/28/2014 3:05 PM, John H wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2014 10:11:37 AM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/28/2014 9:43 AM, Poco Loco wrote:

On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 09:38:11 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:



On 2/28/2014 8:16 AM, Poco Loco wrote:

On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 04:50:05 -0800 (PST), Tim wrote:



On Friday, February 28, 2014 6:31:44 AM UTC-6, John H. wrote:





But, they just got some parts and fixed it! I'd like to see pictures and a story just about that.



But the bottom line was typical Guzzi:







"The alternator died because we were overtaxing it with the two fans--we swapped batteries at each



driver change. The oil-pressure gauge started showing zero psi, yet it kept running, so we kept



driving it. Eventually, it crossed the finish on day two with the checkers."







Reminds me of the time one of my coils died, but the 850T got Sandy and I home on one cylinder -



from Munich to Stuttgart. The bike sounded like a 'Ma Deuce' going down the road without the plug,



but it got us home.



bet it shook like thunder too!



Like shooting the M-2.



The other day you asked about Guzzi's big bike. I came across this review this morning.



http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-ambassador-review-91469.html







Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect

example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction

of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can

almost sense it.



http://www.motorcycle.com/gallery/gallery.php/d/358550-1/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-action-30.jpg



Yup, and it's a beautiful bike also!







I am wondering how other big bike manufacturers like Moto-Guzzi are

dealing with EPA exhaust standards on their new bikes. Harley-Davidson

has been putting catalytic converters on all their bikes since 2010 and

the big, touring models for 2014 will be water-cooled vs the traditional

air cooling.



I heard about this when I bought my last UltraClassic. I went for a

2009 model to avoid the catalytic converter (which were new in the 2010

models). The ones equipped with a cat have to be tuned very lean to

meet EPA emission standards and the lean mixture makes them run hotter

than previous models. There was also talk at the time (apparently

true) that the big bikes would eventually have to go to liquid cooling

because air cooling had too many engine temp variables to meet the EPA

standards. The engine has to be kept at a fairly constant temp (like a

car) in order to meet the emission standards.



Even the 2009 model I had could burn the inside of your right leg if you

got caught in stop and go traffic on a hot day. You could have the bike

programmed to shut off the front cylinder under certain conditions

(stopped, clutch lever pulled, throttle at idle) which would allow the

front cylinder to simply pump air, minus fuel and ignition, in order to

lower the overall engine temp. As soon as you started to hit the

throttle and engage the clutch, it started firing again.

My brother in NC has a 2009 Harley. His shuts down the front cylinder at stop lights as you mentioned. His came that way, no extra programming required. He's been happy with it - no problems. He's happy that he waited for the 2009. He'd had one before but he was looking forward to all the changes that came with the 2009 model. (Of which I know nothing, naturally.)

As soon as I asked him about it, he says, "What's up, you thinking of buying a Harley, finally?" Told him I might do so when the Guzzi hits 50 years old.



I originally had a 2002 Harley UltraClassic. I traded it in on the 2009
model mainly for two reasons. First, I heard that models after 2009
would have the catalytic converters and would run hotter due to having
to be tuned very lean. The other reason, and more important, is that
Harley added another gear .. basically an overdrive ... and increased
the hp in the 2009 model. I liked that a lot. I've forgotten the exact
numbers but cruising at 70-75 mph on the highway, the engine was only
turning about 2400-2600 RPM. The overdrive (or 6th gear) wasn't
recommended under 60 mph.

On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 17:57:19 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 2/28/2014 3:05 PM, John H wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2014 10:11:37 AM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/28/2014 9:43 AM, Poco Loco wrote:

On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 09:38:11 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:



On 2/28/2014 8:16 AM, Poco Loco wrote:

On Fri, 28 Feb 2014 04:50:05 -0800 (PST), Tim wrote:



On Friday, February 28, 2014 6:31:44 AM UTC-6, John H. wrote:





But, they just got some parts and fixed it! I'd like to see pictures and a story just about that.



But the bottom line was typical Guzzi:







"The alternator died because we were overtaxing it with the two fans--we swapped batteries at each



driver change. The oil-pressure gauge started showing zero psi, yet it kept running, so we kept



driving it. Eventually, it crossed the finish on day two with the checkers."







Reminds me of the time one of my coils died, but the 850T got Sandy and I home on one cylinder -



from Munich to Stuttgart. The bike sounded like a 'Ma Deuce' going down the road without the plug,



but it got us home.



bet it shook like thunder too!



Like shooting the M-2.



The other day you asked about Guzzi's big bike. I came across this review this morning.



http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-ambassador-review-91469.html







Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect

example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction

of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can

almost sense it.



http://www.motorcycle.com/gallery/gallery.php/d/358550-1/2013-moto-guzzi-california-1400-touring-action-30.jpg



Yup, and it's a beautiful bike also!







I am wondering how other big bike manufacturers like Moto-Guzzi are

dealing with EPA exhaust standards on their new bikes. Harley-Davidson

has been putting catalytic converters on all their bikes since 2010 and

the big, touring models for 2014 will be water-cooled vs the traditional

air cooling.



I heard about this when I bought my last UltraClassic. I went for a

2009 model to avoid the catalytic converter (which were new in the 2010

models). The ones equipped with a cat have to be tuned very lean to

meet EPA emission standards and the lean mixture makes them run hotter

than previous models. There was also talk at the time (apparently

true) that the big bikes would eventually have to go to liquid cooling

because air cooling had too many engine temp variables to meet the EPA

standards. The engine has to be kept at a fairly constant temp (like a

car) in order to meet the emission standards.



Even the 2009 model I had could burn the inside of your right leg if you

got caught in stop and go traffic on a hot day. You could have the bike

programmed to shut off the front cylinder under certain conditions

(stopped, clutch lever pulled, throttle at idle) which would allow the

front cylinder to simply pump air, minus fuel and ignition, in order to

lower the overall engine temp. As soon as you started to hit the

throttle and engage the clutch, it started firing again.

My brother in NC has a 2009 Harley. His shuts down the front cylinder at stop lights as you mentioned. His came that way, no extra programming required. He's been happy with it - no problems. He's happy that he waited for the 2009. He'd had one before but he was looking forward to all the changes that came with the 2009 model. (Of which I know nothing, naturally.)

As soon as I asked him about it, he says, "What's up, you thinking of buying a Harley, finally?" Told him I might do so when the Guzzi hits 50 years old.



I originally had a 2002 Harley UltraClassic. I traded it in on the 2009
model mainly for two reasons. First, I heard that models after 2009
would have the catalytic converters and would run hotter due to having
to be tuned very lean. The other reason, and more important, is that
Harley added another gear .. basically an overdrive ... and increased
the hp in the 2009 model. I liked that a lot. I've forgotten the exact
numbers but cruising at 70-75 mph on the highway, the engine was only
turning about 2400-2600 RPM. The overdrive (or 6th gear) wasn't
recommended under 60 mph.

Well, if you get ready to sell it, let me know. I could maybe own a Harley as a second bike. But if
I rode it to Rolling Thunder, the bike wouldn't get near the attention the Moto Guzzi does. Most of
those folks are like, "Wow, I thought they stopped making those right after World War Two."

My bro loves his 2009,

On Friday, February 28, 2014 5:10:59 PM UTC-6, John H. wrote:

I rode it to Rolling Thunder, the bike wouldn't get near the attention the Moto Guzzi does. Most of

those folks are like, "Wow, I thought they stopped making those right after World War Two."


They stopped improving them after WWII. It's hard to improve a hammer.

On 2/28/2014 6:38 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:

Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect
example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction
of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can
almost sense it.

I'll be damned if I can figure out how you guys think you can possibly
discern a subtle pressure applied to the bars from a static photograph...?

On 3/1/2014 12:08 AM, thumper wrote:
On 2/28/2014 6:38 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:

Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect
example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction
of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can
almost sense it.

I'll be damned if I can figure out how you guys think you can possibly
discern a subtle pressure applied to the bars from a static photograph...?



Trolls have amazing abilities beyond that of we mere mortals...

On 3/1/2014 12:08 AM, thumper wrote:
On 2/28/2014 6:38 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:

Almost hate to mention this but the picture in your link is a perfect
example of counter-steering. Very slight pressure against the direction
of the turn keep front fork and wheel aligned with rear wheel. You can
almost sense it.

I'll be damned if I can figure out how you guys think you can possibly
discern a subtle pressure applied to the bars from a static photograph...?




You turn your way, I'll turn mine. :-)

(all you have to do is to look at the front fork and wheel angle closely)

That's enough though. I wasn't in a "troll" mode. It was just an
observation.