On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 16:48:10 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 1/21/2016 2:40 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 11:24:42 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


So what? Every minute of the day approximately 20 people in the USA is
a victim of domestic violence. It's not unique to the Palin
family. They are not super humans. It's not right, of course, but to
single out one family's problems for political purposes
isn't right either. If Palin's son is guilty, he should face the music.
If he has military related problems, he should also get help, although
the track record of mental health professionals actually making a
difference isn't all that great. Sometimes I think they can cause more
problems than they solve.

The cure seems to be to drug the person into passivity and that is
ironic since it is usually substance abuse that got them into trouble
in the first place. "Self medicating" is bad but if a doctor
prescribes stronger drugs, it is just "medicine".



It is hard for me to fathom that so many people now-a-days have mental
health issues that require drugs to treat. Seems like being on
anti-depressants is the "in" thing. Same with drugging up every other
school kid because they have ADHD or ADD. For cripes sakes, kids are
*supposed* to be hyperactive and wear their parents out. Their
attention spans are short because they are *kids*, not because there is
something wrong with them. I agree with Harry. We are being duped by
the pharmaceutical industry and the arrangements they have with
hospitals and clinics.


Schools like parents to drug kids because it makes their job easier.
They have already convinced the school boards that results are not
important. Just making them sit there quietly is the main concern.

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:08:27 -0500, John H.
wrote:



I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


The thing that bothers me the most about this is that most of the
people who shaped our history probably would have been called ADD in
school and drugged.

On 1/21/2016 6:08 PM, John H. wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 17:39:29 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 1/21/2016 4:55 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 1/21/16 4:48 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 1/21/2016 2:40 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 11:24:42 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


So what? Every minute of the day approximately 20 people in the USA is
a victim of domestic violence. It's not unique to the Palin
family. They are not super humans. It's not right, of course, but to
single out one family's problems for political purposes
isn't right either. If Palin's son is guilty, he should face the
music.
If he has military related problems, he should also get help, although
the track record of mental health professionals actually making a
difference isn't all that great. Sometimes I think they can cause more
problems than they solve.

The cure seems to be to drug the person into passivity and that is
ironic since it is usually substance abuse that got them into trouble
in the first place. "Self medicating" is bad but if a doctor
prescribes stronger drugs, it is just "medicine".



It is hard for me to fathom that so many people now-a-days have mental
health issues that require drugs to treat. Seems like being on
anti-depressants is the "in" thing. Same with drugging up every other
school kid because they have ADHD or ADD. For cripes sakes, kids are
*supposed* to be hyperactive and wear their parents out. Their
attention spans are short because they are *kids*, not because there is
something wrong with them. I agree with Harry. We are being duped by
the pharmaceutical industry and the arrangements they have with
hospitals and clinics.



It's cheaper in many cases for the insurance companies to pay to drug up
patients rather than pay for enough pragmatic therapy to help them learn
how to control their aberrant behavior. Sometimes, mild forms of drugs
help to, for example, take the edge off patients without turning
them into near zombies, and the talk therapy can be more effective. But
there's no one hat fits all answer with mental illnesses.


Don't get me started on this subject. Drugging up so many young kids to
cure "aberrant behavior" is a lazy, stupid and selfish practice. We all
displayed aberrant behavior from time to time as kids ... sometimes as
adults ... but it certainly doesn't mean drugs are required. I was a
bit of a creative hell raiser as a kid but my corrective "drug" was a
six foot, five inch, 240lb old man. One of his "looks" usually cured
the aberrant behavior ... and quickly.


I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


I am sure there are some cases where medication is needed but I think
it's a fraction of what is being diagnosed and prescribed. Common sense
has become obsolete in many cases.

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 20:22:33 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:08:27 -0500, John H.
wrote:



I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


The thing that bothers me the most about this is that most of the
people who shaped our history probably would have been called ADD in
school and drugged.

In the years that I taught, I never experienced the school putting pressure on the
parents to drug their kids. Unless the counsellors were getting the parents on the
sly, I don't know when it would be taking place. I think it's the teacher complaining
to the parents about behavior/homework, and then the parents asking a doctor what
they should do about it, instead of putting in the effort to fix the problem
themselves.
--

Ban idiots, not guns!

On Fri, 22 Jan 2016 02:36:31 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 1/21/2016 6:08 PM, John H. wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 17:39:29 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 1/21/2016 4:55 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 1/21/16 4:48 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 1/21/2016 2:40 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 11:24:42 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


So what? Every minute of the day approximately 20 people in the USA is
a victim of domestic violence. It's not unique to the Palin
family. They are not super humans. It's not right, of course, but to
single out one family's problems for political purposes
isn't right either. If Palin's son is guilty, he should face the
music.
If he has military related problems, he should also get help, although
the track record of mental health professionals actually making a
difference isn't all that great. Sometimes I think they can cause more
problems than they solve.

The cure seems to be to drug the person into passivity and that is
ironic since it is usually substance abuse that got them into trouble
in the first place. "Self medicating" is bad but if a doctor
prescribes stronger drugs, it is just "medicine".



It is hard for me to fathom that so many people now-a-days have mental
health issues that require drugs to treat. Seems like being on
anti-depressants is the "in" thing. Same with drugging up every other
school kid because they have ADHD or ADD. For cripes sakes, kids are
*supposed* to be hyperactive and wear their parents out. Their
attention spans are short because they are *kids*, not because there is
something wrong with them. I agree with Harry. We are being duped by
the pharmaceutical industry and the arrangements they have with
hospitals and clinics.



It's cheaper in many cases for the insurance companies to pay to drug up
patients rather than pay for enough pragmatic therapy to help them learn
how to control their aberrant behavior. Sometimes, mild forms of drugs
help to, for example, take the edge off patients without turning
them into near zombies, and the talk therapy can be more effective. But
there's no one hat fits all answer with mental illnesses.


Don't get me started on this subject. Drugging up so many young kids to
cure "aberrant behavior" is a lazy, stupid and selfish practice. We all
displayed aberrant behavior from time to time as kids ... sometimes as
adults ... but it certainly doesn't mean drugs are required. I was a
bit of a creative hell raiser as a kid but my corrective "drug" was a
six foot, five inch, 240lb old man. One of his "looks" usually cured
the aberrant behavior ... and quickly.


I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


I am sure there are some cases where medication is needed but I think
it's a fraction of what is being diagnosed and prescribed. Common sense
has become obsolete in many cases.


My oldest grandson (18) definitely needs the medication. Without it he can't control
himself, and he knows it.
--

Ban idiots, not guns!

On 1/22/2016 7:53 AM, John H. wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 20:22:33 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:08:27 -0500, John H.
wrote:



I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


The thing that bothers me the most about this is that most of the
people who shaped our history probably would have been called ADD in
school and drugged.

In the years that I taught, I never experienced the school putting pressure on the
parents to drug their kids. Unless the counsellors were getting the parents on the
sly, I don't know when it would be taking place. I think it's the teacher complaining
to the parents about behavior/homework, and then the parents asking a doctor what
they should do about it, instead of putting in the effort to fix the problem
themselves.


I've witnessed just the opposite. The school systems and even
individual teachers are diagnosing kids and recommending to the parents
that they be put on medication. Went through this with my daughter and
her oldest kid. One of his teachers talked to her about it and even
admitted that she herself (the teacher) was on medication for adult ADD.
My daughter took him to his doctor and the doctor got bull ****. The
kid (my grandson) was a perfectly normal, typical young adolescent going
through the process of growing up. That f'in 24 year old teacher
should be fired.

That was about 5 years ago. He has since graduated from high school, is
attending a trade school, working and is doing just fine.

On 1/22/16 9:32 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 1/22/2016 7:53 AM, John H. wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 20:22:33 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:08:27 -0500, John H.
wrote:



I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on
Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of
course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking
a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not
politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was
classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's
another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


The thing that bothers me the most about this is that most of the
people who shaped our history probably would have been called ADD in
school and drugged.

In the years that I taught, I never experienced the school putting
pressure on the
parents to drug their kids. Unless the counsellors were getting the
parents on the
sly, I don't know when it would be taking place. I think it's the
teacher complaining
to the parents about behavior/homework, and then the parents asking a
doctor what
they should do about it, instead of putting in the effort to fix the
problem
themselves.


I've witnessed just the opposite. The school systems and even
individual teachers are diagnosing kids and recommending to the parents
that they be put on medication. Went through this with my daughter and
her oldest kid. One of his teachers talked to her about it and even
admitted that she herself (the teacher) was on medication for adult ADD.
My daughter took him to his doctor and the doctor got bull ****. The
kid (my grandson) was a perfectly normal, typical young adolescent going
through the process of growing up. That f'in 24 year old teacher
should be fired.

That was about 5 years ago. He has since graduated from high school, is
attending a trade school, working and is doing just fine.



What percentage of kids are being diagnosed that way? 1%, 5%, more?

On 1/22/2016 10:34 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 1/22/16 9:32 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 1/22/2016 7:53 AM, John H. wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 20:22:33 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:08:27 -0500, John H.
wrote:



I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on
Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of
course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking
a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not
politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was
classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's
another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


The thing that bothers me the most about this is that most of the
people who shaped our history probably would have been called ADD in
school and drugged.

In the years that I taught, I never experienced the school putting
pressure on the
parents to drug their kids. Unless the counsellors were getting the
parents on the
sly, I don't know when it would be taking place. I think it's the
teacher complaining
to the parents about behavior/homework, and then the parents asking a
doctor what
they should do about it, instead of putting in the effort to fix the
problem
themselves.


I've witnessed just the opposite. The school systems and even
individual teachers are diagnosing kids and recommending to the parents
that they be put on medication. Went through this with my daughter and
her oldest kid. One of his teachers talked to her about it and even
admitted that she herself (the teacher) was on medication for adult ADD.
My daughter took him to his doctor and the doctor got bull ****. The
kid (my grandson) was a perfectly normal, typical young adolescent going
through the process of growing up. That f'in 24 year old teacher
should be fired.

That was about 5 years ago. He has since graduated from high school, is
attending a trade school, working and is doing just fine.



What percentage of kids are being diagnosed that way? 1%, 5%, more?


I don't know but ask any parent with kids in junior high school and
I think you find the situation is far more prevalent than you would
imagine. As old farts we tend to drift away from what is going on
in schools today.

On Fri, 22 Jan 2016 10:34:58 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 1/22/16 9:32 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 1/22/2016 7:53 AM, John H. wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 20:22:33 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:08:27 -0500, John H.
wrote:



I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on
Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of
course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking
a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not
politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was
classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's
another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


The thing that bothers me the most about this is that most of the
people who shaped our history probably would have been called ADD in
school and drugged.

In the years that I taught, I never experienced the school putting
pressure on the
parents to drug their kids. Unless the counsellors were getting the
parents on the
sly, I don't know when it would be taking place. I think it's the
teacher complaining
to the parents about behavior/homework, and then the parents asking a
doctor what
they should do about it, instead of putting in the effort to fix the
problem
themselves.


I've witnessed just the opposite. The school systems and even
individual teachers are diagnosing kids and recommending to the parents
that they be put on medication. Went through this with my daughter and
her oldest kid. One of his teachers talked to her about it and even
admitted that she herself (the teacher) was on medication for adult ADD.
My daughter took him to his doctor and the doctor got bull ****. The
kid (my grandson) was a perfectly normal, typical young adolescent going
through the process of growing up. That f'in 24 year old teacher
should be fired.

That was about 5 years ago. He has since graduated from high school, is
attending a trade school, working and is doing just fine.



What percentage of kids are being diagnosed that way? 1%, 5%, more?

So what is 1% of middle schoolers? (206,050 kids in 2012- US census
bureau)

On Fri, 22 Jan 2016 09:32:03 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 1/22/2016 7:53 AM, John H. wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 20:22:33 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:08:27 -0500, John H.
wrote:



I'm on your side on this one. I think most of my grandkids are on Ritalin or some
damn thing. I blame computers and computer games, and parents, of course. But mostly
I blame the damn doctors who prescribe the ****. Of course, smacking a kid on the
butt is not the 'liberal progressive' thing to do. Probably not politically correct
either.

I know of no one in my generation, or the following one, who was classified ADD or
ADHD. Although, I have heard of 'adult onset' ADD. I think that's another
narcissistic ploy for attention.


The thing that bothers me the most about this is that most of the
people who shaped our history probably would have been called ADD in
school and drugged.

In the years that I taught, I never experienced the school putting pressure on the
parents to drug their kids. Unless the counsellors were getting the parents on the
sly, I don't know when it would be taking place. I think it's the teacher complaining
to the parents about behavior/homework, and then the parents asking a doctor what
they should do about it, instead of putting in the effort to fix the problem
themselves.


I've witnessed just the opposite. The school systems and even
individual teachers are diagnosing kids and recommending to the parents
that they be put on medication. Went through this with my daughter and
her oldest kid. One of his teachers talked to her about it and even
admitted that she herself (the teacher) was on medication for adult ADD.
My daughter took him to his doctor and the doctor got bull ****. The
kid (my grandson) was a perfectly normal, typical young adolescent going
through the process of growing up. That f'in 24 year old teacher
should be fired.

That was about 5 years ago. He has since graduated from high school, is
attending a trade school, working and is doing just fine.

If I were a parent and a teacher said something like that to me, I'd have her ass in
front of the school administration for stepping way out of bounds. There is no way
I'd ever have recommended anything like that to a parent. And, if I had, my principal
would have had my ass for breakfast.
--

Ban idiots, not guns!