On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 18:46:15 -0700 (PDT), True North wrote:

On Friday, 14 September 2018 22:40:47 UTC-3, Alex wrote:
True North wrote:
Mr. Luddite

- show quoted text -

"I don't necessarily need 240v (split phase) but if my Honda ever gives
up the ghost I'll shop for one.

Speaking of the Honda ... I just pulled it out of the storage shed and
gave it three pulls. Fired right up. Last time it was used was last
winter when we lost power for a couple of days. Still has the same
gas in it that it had then with a splash of Stabil in it. I have it
running right now, trying to run it out of gas so I can use fresh gas
if and when I need it again. It's just purring away on the old gas.

So much for the stories that gas goes bad in a month or two. It may
lose some of it's BTU's so an engine can't develop it's full HP rating
but I see no evidence of that. I put a 1500 watt space heater on it
as a load so it burns the gas faster and it runs just fine."


What the 'ell!
My new Honda 2000 took 7 or eight pulls to get it going in July on fresh gas with Seafoam additive.
I take it out of the basement four times a year, pour the 3 month old gas into my Highlander and get about 8 liters of fresh high test in the can.
Mix the Seafoam in and pour close to half a liter of the new stuff into the generator and start it up to run till it's dry.
Then generator goes back into the basement and the fresh gas sits in my shed until needed or the 3 month mark...which ever comes first.




Probably too much Seafoam. Find some TruFuel 4 stroke fuel and it will
last up to 7 years. I already told you that. Maybe you'll listen/read
this time.

mmmm let's see...your advice vs a Honda dealership...
what to do?

He simply forgot that you place extreme trust in dealers.

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 21:43:14 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 16:16:44 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 14:32:52 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 14:04:59 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 9/14/2018 12:04 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/14/18 11:50 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 11:43 AM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/14/18 11:28 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 10:50 AM, Its Me wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 7:47:42 AM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 21:34:54 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

Well, after we had to evacuate the house for nearly a week while
new hardwoods were being laid, sanded and finished,we are back in
the house today just in time for Florence. At this time the
biggest worry is power outage... the storm is down to a Cat 1,
but is moving so slowly it will dump lots of rain.* We're on a
hill so no worries of flooding, but power is a concern with a
well. Should have pulled the trigger on a gen, but we've briefly
lost power twice in ten years, so it hasn't been at the top of
the list. Work is 10 minutes away, and we have a huge gen,
kitchen and showers so really no big deal.* Plus I have about 5
ways to cook without electricity, so we are OK.

Hope anyone in the path fairs well.* I'll probably just spend my
time painting the newly remodeled parts.* All new appliances next
Tuesday!* Then we'll have a complete kitchen again after almost 3
months.* Whew!

I've heard nothing but good about this generator from the RV crowd.

https://www.harborfreight.com/3500-w...tor-63584.html


As soon as I find a buyer for my Honda 2200, I'm getting the
Predator.


Thanks, but I need 240V@30A to run the well pump.


I don't necessarily need 240v (split phase) but if my Honda ever
gives up the ghost I'll shop for one.

Speaking of the Honda ... I just pulled it out of the storage shed and
gave it three pulls.* Fired right up.* Last time it was used was last
winter when we lost power for a couple of days.* Still has the same
gas in it that it had then with a splash of Stabil in it.* I have it
running right now, trying to run it out of gas so I can use fresh gas
if and when I need it again.* It's just purring away on the old gas.

So much for the stories that gas goes bad in a month or two.* It may
lose some of it's BTU's so an engine can't develop it's full HP rating
but I see no evidence of that.* I put a 1500 watt space heater on it
as a load so it burns the gas faster and it runs just fine.




Ahh, you put Stabil in your generator's tank and the gas was good
enough to start up and run your generator and therefore "So much for
the stories that gas goes bad in a month or two."

Gotta love that scientific methodology.



http://funkyimg.com/i/2Le5c.jpg



Universal truth from a single observation?


Just an additional data point from the time the generator sat for five
years unused with gas in it. (again, used some Stabil). After all that
time it ran, although it took extra pulls for it to fire up.
Once running, it burned up the five year old gas with no problems.

I am in the habit of adding Stabil to the gas storage jug immediately
after I fill it with fresh gas. In that way the generator always has
treated gas and it has always fired up and run fine after long periods
of sitting (i.e. 5 years). Just my experience and only with the little
Honda generator. Works for me.

Doing the same now with the gas I use in the little scooter, based on
the luck I've had with the generator. The only difference is that the
scooter uses high test (93 octane) gas.

When it's time to put the motorcycle away for the winter, I'll do the
same for it. In fact, the owner's manual for the Suzuki specifically
says to fill the tank with fresh gas, add an appropriate amount of fuel
stabilizer (the manual recommends Stabil), run the motorcycle for a
while to distribute the treated gas throughout the fuel system including
the fuel injectors before permanently storing the motorcycle.

That is the good thing about being a regular boater. I always have
fresh gas around. My problem now is the cars. We don't drive enough
these days to keep the battery up on all 3 of them. I am not sure my
wife has been behind the wheel for a year.
I should sell one I guess.

Battery Tender works well on autos also.

Right now I an just trying to rotate driving the cars. My wife wants
to keep her Lincoln and she doesn't want me to drive it as my regular
car because I am tough on cars. I guess I could drive the truck but I
really like my little car.

In the winter the truck gets used only for short trips, mostly. I've connected a harness to the
battery that just stays there with the end coming out of the hood. Makes it very easy to connect a
Battery Tender Plus every so often.

http://tinyurl.com/yb2afvkz

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 21:51:39 -0400, Alex wrote:

Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/14/18 2:38 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 14:27:32 -0400, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 9/14/18 2:15 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:14 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 11:28:55 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 9/14/2018 10:50 AM, Its Me wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 7:47:42 AM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 21:34:54 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

Well, after we had to evacuate the house for nearly a week while
new hardwoods were being laid, sanded and finished,we are back in
the house today just in time for Florence. At this time the
biggest worry is power outage... the storm is down to a Cat 1,
but
is moving so slowly it will dump lots of rain. We're on a hill so
no worries of flooding, but power is a concern with a well.
Should
have pulled the trigger on a gen, but we've briefly lost power
twice in ten years, so it hasn't been at the top of the list.
Work
is 10 minutes away, and we have a huge gen, kitchen and
showers so
really no big deal. Plus I have about 5 ways to cook without
electricity, so we are OK.

Hope anyone in the path fairs well. I'll probably just spend my
time painting the newly remodeled parts. All new appliances next
Tuesday! Then we'll have a complete kitchen again after almost 3
months. Whew!

I've heard nothing but good about this generator from the RV
crowd.

https://www.harborfreight.com/3500-w...tor-63584.html



As soon as I find a buyer for my Honda 2200, I'm getting the
Predator.


Thanks, but I need 240V@30A to run the well pump.


I don't necessarily need 240v (split phase) but if my Honda ever
gives
up the ghost I'll shop for one.

Speaking of the Honda ... I just pulled it out of the storage
shed and
gave it three pulls. Fired right up. Last time it was used was
last
winter when we lost power for a couple of days. Still has the same
gas in it that it had then with a splash of Stabil in it. I have it
running right now, trying to run it out of gas so I can use fresh
gas
if and when I need it again. It's just purring away on the old gas.

So much for the stories that gas goes bad in a month or two. It may
lose some of it's BTU's so an engine can't develop it's full HP
rating
but I see no evidence of that. I put a 1500 watt space heater on it
as a load so it burns the gas faster and it runs just fine.



That is the good thing about propane. It doesn't go bad. The problem
is it may be hard to come by and very expensive after a storm. My
generator will run both.



I forgot that Harry looks down at little, gasoline powered generators
because *he* has a big, whole house generator, supplied by a 1,000 gal
propane underground tank. It starts once a week, runs for 10 minutes
and shuts off, similar to my neighbor's generator whole house
generator
he installed three years ago. My neighbor is actually hoping for a
longer term power outage just so he can justify the investment he
made.

I've used my generator twice since Hurricane Wilma in 2005, not
counting
the summer the stone cutters used it everyday when installing the
pool.
Each power outage was of relatively short duration and we got by just
fine with it.

I don't look down my nose at gasoline powered generators. I don't know
if a gasoline-powered generator is available in the size we have that
would be adequate to run one of our furnace/heat pumps, the well pump,
and some appliances and lights. The well pump and heat pump require a
substantial generator to start up and run. In the winter, if you don't
have some heat available, the water pipes in the walls can freeze.
Fixing that would cost a lot more than a generator.

Oh, it's a 500-gallon buried tank. We did have one four-to-five day
power outage in which the genny served us well.

Diesel is a good option for a big generator like that but diesel gets
stale too. Natural gas is best but that is far from universally
available as soon as you get very far out of town



We use propane for heating in the downstairs heat pump (electric
backup), hot water heaters, stovetop, two fireplaces *and* the generator.

Hot water heater? Why would you heat hot water? I guess that's why
they don't make them.

'Professional writers' like to use as many words as possible.

True North Wrote in message:
Keyser Soze

- hide quoted text -

On 9/14/18 5:25 PM, justan wrote:
John H. Wrote in message:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 16:45:15 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 9/14/18 4:29 PM, Tim wrote:
John H
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 14:27:32 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 9/14/18 2:15 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:14 PM, wrote:
- show quoted text -
That is the good thing about propane. It doesn't go bad. The problem
is it may be hard to come by and very expensive after a storm. My
generator will run both.



I forgot that Harry looks down at little, gasoline powered generators
because *he* has a big, whole house generator, supplied by a 1,000 gal
propane underground tank. It starts once a week, runs for 10 minutes
and shuts off, similar to my neighbor's generator whole house generator
he installed three years ago. My neighbor is actually hoping for a
longer term power outage just so he can justify the investment he made.

I've used my generator twice since Hurricane Wilma in 2005, not counting
the summer the stone cutters used it everyday when installing the pool.
Each power outage was of relatively short duration and we got by just
fine with it.

I don't look down my nose at gasoline powered generators. I don't know
if a gasoline-powered generator is available in the size we have that
would be adequate to run one of our furnace/heat pumps, the well pump,
and some appliances and lights. The well pump and heat pump require a
substantial generator to start up and run. In the winter, if you don't
have some heat available, the water pipes in the walls can freeze.
Fixing that would cost a lot more than a generator.

Oh, it's a 500-gallon buried tank. We did have one four-to-five day
power outage in which the genny served us well.

Do you honestly think you need all that when there's a power outage? Most of us could live with a
couple space heaters, refrigerator, and some lights.

Worried about water in pipes? Drain 'em. Buy some bottled water. Fill the bathtubs for the toilet.
You're a mess. If you just have to have running water, leave the faucet trickling. I doesn't get
into the negative numbers around here very much, especially in racist southern MD where you live.

........


John, some people don?t have a survivalists sense. Bad when their total life is dependent on others taking care of them....




Why should I want to be a right-wing survivalist when our generator
keeps us comfortable, winter or summer, if there is a power outage?
Doesn't your idiot buddy Johnny**** carry or use a generator in his
motel room on wheels? Can't he put his dog or wife on a treadmill to
generate whatever electricity he needs, and can't he poop in the woods?

Leaving the water trickling isn't much of a solution when the water in
the pipes comes from a well that has a 220 volt pump motor 225 feet
underground.

When we build our next house, we'll have a propane-fueled permanent
generator there, too.

If you had balls, you'd ask me yourself!

Didn't mean to **** you off so badly. :)


Yes you did. :-)


"The only thing Herring can **** on is his own trousers."


Hee hee!
I agree wholeheartedly and unequivocally with this post!




Don't look now but I noticed he ****ed on yours a few times.
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John H. Wrote in message:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 20:10:09 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 9/14/2018 7:15 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/14/18 6:03 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 4:22 PM, John H. wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 14:27:32 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 9/14/18 2:15 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:14 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 11:28:55 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 9/14/2018 10:50 AM, Its Me wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 7:47:42 AM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 21:34:54 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

Well, after we had to evacuate the house for nearly a week while
new hardwoods were being laid, sanded and finished,we are back in
the house today just in time for Florence. At this time the
biggest worry is power outage... the storm is down to a Cat 1,
but
is moving so slowly it will dump lots of rain. We're on a
hill so
no worries of flooding, but power is a concern with a well.
Should
have pulled the trigger on a gen, but we've briefly lost power
twice in ten years, so it hasn't been at the top of the list.
Work
is 10 minutes away, and we have a huge gen, kitchen and
showers so
really no big deal. Plus I have about 5 ways to cook without
electricity, so we are OK.

Hope anyone in the path fairs well. I'll probably just spend my
time painting the newly remodeled parts. All new appliances next
Tuesday! Then we'll have a complete kitchen again after almost 3
months. Whew!

I've heard nothing but good about this generator from the RV
crowd.

https://www.harborfreight.com/3500-w...tor-63584.html



As soon as I find a buyer for my Honda 2200, I'm getting the
Predator.


Thanks, but I need 240V@30A to run the well pump.


I don't necessarily need 240v (split phase) but if my Honda ever
gives
up the ghost I'll shop for one.

Speaking of the Honda ... I just pulled it out of the storage
shed and
gave it three pulls. Fired right up. Last time it was used was
last
winter when we lost power for a couple of days. Still has the same
gas in it that it had then with a splash of Stabil in it. I have it
running right now, trying to run it out of gas so I can use fresh
gas
if and when I need it again. It's just purring away on the old gas.

So much for the stories that gas goes bad in a month or two. It may
lose some of it's BTU's so an engine can't develop it's full HP
rating
but I see no evidence of that. I put a 1500 watt space heater on it
as a load so it burns the gas faster and it runs just fine.



That is the good thing about propane. It doesn't go bad. The problem
is it may be hard to come by and very expensive after a storm. My
generator will run both.



I forgot that Harry looks down at little, gasoline powered generators
because *he* has a big, whole house generator, supplied by a 1,000 gal
propane underground tank. It starts once a week, runs for 10 minutes
and shuts off, similar to my neighbor's generator whole house
generator
he installed three years ago. My neighbor is actually hoping for a
longer term power outage just so he can justify the investment he
made.

I've used my generator twice since Hurricane Wilma in 2005, not
counting
the summer the stone cutters used it everyday when installing the
pool.
Each power outage was of relatively short duration and we got by just
fine with it.

I don't look down my nose at gasoline powered generators. I don't know
if a gasoline-powered generator is available in the size we have that
would be adequate to run one of our furnace/heat pumps, the well pump,
and some appliances and lights. The well pump and heat pump require a
substantial generator to start up and run. In the winter, if you don't
have some heat available, the water pipes in the walls can freeze.
Fixing that would cost a lot more than a generator.

Oh, it's a 500-gallon buried tank. We did have one four-to-five day
power outage in which the genny served us well.

Do you honestly think you need all that when there's a power outage?
Most of us could live with a
couple space heaters, refrigerator, and some lights.

Worried about water in pipes? Drain 'em. Buy some bottled water. Fill
the bathtubs for the toilet.
You're a mess. If you just have to have running water, leave the
faucet trickling. I doesn't get
into the negative numbers around here very much, especially in racist
southern MD where you live.



In an insulated house up my way it takes far more than a day or two of
temps near zero or below to start being concerned with frozen pipes.
Don't think it gets that cold in Harry's neck of the woods.



How long does it take? Do you know? We've had winters in which the temps
were in the single digits for a few days and only up in the teens later
in that week. Would that be enough to freeze the pipes in an unheated
house?

I stated that it takes far more than a day or two of temps near zero or
below. How do I know? Because I've experienced it.

Insulation is nothing more than a time delay for heat loss. However,
that time delay can be quite lengthy for a well insulated house. The
delay is also a factor of the delta T of the ambient temperature outside
and the temperature inside the house and how often water flows through
the pipes. During the last 2 day outage we experienced in our former
house the outside temps during the day didn't rise above 12 degrees (F)
and nights were below zero. After two days the house temp was still
at 62 degrees inside. That's when I decided to hook the generator up
to the heating system. Fortunately, power was restored a few hours later.

If your house is poorly insulated or (worse yet) water pipes in outside
walls were not installed properly, (meaning ending up between the
insulation and the outside walls) you may have problems faster.

Only time I've experienced frozen (and burst) water pipes was in Mrs.E's
unheated horse barn where there was no insulation at all, the water
pipes were exposed and I forgot to plug in the heat tape/rope on them.



OK, you've blown his mind. He'll probably shut up for a while.


Unless Fat Harry's house is built like a barn he shouldn't have
pipe burst problems. I had magic heat in 3 of my houses which
kept the basements quite comfortable in weather Fat Harry doesn't
see in South Maryland.
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John H. Wrote in message:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 16:02:10 -0700 (PDT), True North wrote:

John H

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 07:50:06 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 7:47:42 AM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 21:34:54 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

Well, after we had to evacuate the house for nearly a week while new hardwoods were being laid, sanded and finished,we are back in the house today just in time for Florence. At this time the biggest worry is power outage... the storm is down to a Cat 1, but is moving so slowly it will dump lots of rain. We're on a hill so no worries of flooding, but power is a concern with a well. Should have pulled the trigger on a gen, but we've briefly lost power twice in ten years, so it hasn't been at the top of the list. Work is 10 minutes away, and we have a huge gen, kitchen and showers so really no big deal. Plus I have about 5 ways to cook without electricity, so we are OK.

Hope anyone in the path fairs well. I'll probably just spend my time painting the newly remodeled parts. All new appliances next Tuesday! Then we'll have a complete kitchen again after almost 3 months. Whew!

I've heard nothing but good about this generator from the RV crowd.

https://www.harborfreight.com/3500-w...tor-63584.html

As soon as I find a buyer for my Honda 2200, I'm getting the Predator.

Thanks, but I need 240V@30A to run the well pump.

"Sold the Honda today. But, Harbor Freight is out of the generator I want. Actually, they're out of
all generators. Hope we don't lose power for too long. I think our longest outage, in 27 years with
this company, has been for about four hours."


Duh!
Considering we're in the middle of hurricane season, it might gave been prudent to get the new generator and test drive it before selling the Honda.

Next week is plenty soon enough. I strongly doubt we'll have any problems with this hurricane. And
if the electricity goes for a day or two, which hasn't happened in the past 27 years, we'll manage.
Thanks for the kind thoughts though.


Nobody bothered to correct his spelling mistake.
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On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 10:10:50 -0400 (EDT), justan wrote:

John H. Wrote in message:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 20:10:09 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 9/14/2018 7:15 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/14/18 6:03 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 4:22 PM, John H. wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 14:27:32 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 9/14/18 2:15 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:14 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 11:28:55 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 9/14/2018 10:50 AM, Its Me wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 7:47:42 AM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 21:34:54 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

Well, after we had to evacuate the house for nearly a week while
new hardwoods were being laid, sanded and finished,we are back in
the house today just in time for Florence. At this time the
biggest worry is power outage... the storm is down to a Cat 1,
but
is moving so slowly it will dump lots of rain. We're on a
hill so
no worries of flooding, but power is a concern with a well.
Should
have pulled the trigger on a gen, but we've briefly lost power
twice in ten years, so it hasn't been at the top of the list.
Work
is 10 minutes away, and we have a huge gen, kitchen and
showers so
really no big deal. Plus I have about 5 ways to cook without
electricity, so we are OK.

Hope anyone in the path fairs well. I'll probably just spend my
time painting the newly remodeled parts. All new appliances next
Tuesday! Then we'll have a complete kitchen again after almost 3
months. Whew!

I've heard nothing but good about this generator from the RV
crowd.

https://www.harborfreight.com/3500-w...tor-63584.html



As soon as I find a buyer for my Honda 2200, I'm getting the
Predator.


Thanks, but I need 240V@30A to run the well pump.


I don't necessarily need 240v (split phase) but if my Honda ever
gives
up the ghost I'll shop for one.

Speaking of the Honda ... I just pulled it out of the storage
shed and
gave it three pulls. Fired right up. Last time it was used was
last
winter when we lost power for a couple of days. Still has the same
gas in it that it had then with a splash of Stabil in it. I have it
running right now, trying to run it out of gas so I can use fresh
gas
if and when I need it again. It's just purring away on the old gas.

So much for the stories that gas goes bad in a month or two. It may
lose some of it's BTU's so an engine can't develop it's full HP
rating
but I see no evidence of that. I put a 1500 watt space heater on it
as a load so it burns the gas faster and it runs just fine.



That is the good thing about propane. It doesn't go bad. The problem
is it may be hard to come by and very expensive after a storm. My
generator will run both.



I forgot that Harry looks down at little, gasoline powered generators
because *he* has a big, whole house generator, supplied by a 1,000 gal
propane underground tank. It starts once a week, runs for 10 minutes
and shuts off, similar to my neighbor's generator whole house
generator
he installed three years ago. My neighbor is actually hoping for a
longer term power outage just so he can justify the investment he
made.

I've used my generator twice since Hurricane Wilma in 2005, not
counting
the summer the stone cutters used it everyday when installing the
pool.
Each power outage was of relatively short duration and we got by just
fine with it.

I don't look down my nose at gasoline powered generators. I don't know
if a gasoline-powered generator is available in the size we have that
would be adequate to run one of our furnace/heat pumps, the well pump,
and some appliances and lights. The well pump and heat pump require a
substantial generator to start up and run. In the winter, if you don't
have some heat available, the water pipes in the walls can freeze.
Fixing that would cost a lot more than a generator.

Oh, it's a 500-gallon buried tank. We did have one four-to-five day
power outage in which the genny served us well.

Do you honestly think you need all that when there's a power outage?
Most of us could live with a
couple space heaters, refrigerator, and some lights.

Worried about water in pipes? Drain 'em. Buy some bottled water. Fill
the bathtubs for the toilet.
You're a mess. If you just have to have running water, leave the
faucet trickling. I doesn't get
into the negative numbers around here very much, especially in racist
southern MD where you live.



In an insulated house up my way it takes far more than a day or two of
temps near zero or below to start being concerned with frozen pipes.
Don't think it gets that cold in Harry's neck of the woods.



How long does it take? Do you know? We've had winters in which the temps
were in the single digits for a few days and only up in the teens later
in that week. Would that be enough to freeze the pipes in an unheated
house?

I stated that it takes far more than a day or two of temps near zero or
below. How do I know? Because I've experienced it.

Insulation is nothing more than a time delay for heat loss. However,
that time delay can be quite lengthy for a well insulated house. The
delay is also a factor of the delta T of the ambient temperature outside
and the temperature inside the house and how often water flows through
the pipes. During the last 2 day outage we experienced in our former
house the outside temps during the day didn't rise above 12 degrees (F)
and nights were below zero. After two days the house temp was still
at 62 degrees inside. That's when I decided to hook the generator up
to the heating system. Fortunately, power was restored a few hours later.

If your house is poorly insulated or (worse yet) water pipes in outside
walls were not installed properly, (meaning ending up between the
insulation and the outside walls) you may have problems faster.

Only time I've experienced frozen (and burst) water pipes was in Mrs.E's
unheated horse barn where there was no insulation at all, the water
pipes were exposed and I forgot to plug in the heat tape/rope on them.



OK, you've blown his mind. He'll probably shut up for a while.


Unless Fat Harry's house is built like a barn he shouldn't have
pipe burst problems. I had magic heat in 3 of my houses which
kept the basements quite comfortable in weather Fat Harry doesn't
see in South Maryland.

Back in the early 90's we had some pretty cold weather. Pipes froze at the underground meter outside
the house which stopped the flow of water. I put a light bulb down there which thawed the pipes
enough to get the water flowing again. The pipe going through the garage to the outside spicket
burst. But there was no insulation there. It's not been that cold here since then.

On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 10:15:34 -0400 (EDT), justan wrote:

John H. Wrote in message:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 16:02:10 -0700 (PDT), True North wrote:

John H

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 07:50:06 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 7:47:42 AM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 21:34:54 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

Well, after we had to evacuate the house for nearly a week while new hardwoods were being laid, sanded and finished,we are back in the house today just in time for Florence. At this time the biggest worry is power outage... the storm is down to a Cat 1, but is moving so slowly it will dump lots of rain. We're on a hill so no worries of flooding, but power is a concern with a well. Should have pulled the trigger on a gen, but we've briefly lost power twice in ten years, so it hasn't been at the top of the list. Work is 10 minutes away, and we have a huge gen, kitchen and showers so really no big deal. Plus I have about 5 ways to cook without electricity, so we are OK.

Hope anyone in the path fairs well. I'll probably just spend my time painting the newly remodeled parts. All new appliances next Tuesday! Then we'll have a complete kitchen again after almost 3 months. Whew!

I've heard nothing but good about this generator from the RV crowd.

https://www.harborfreight.com/3500-w...tor-63584.html

As soon as I find a buyer for my Honda 2200, I'm getting the Predator.

Thanks, but I need 240V@30A to run the well pump.

"Sold the Honda today. But, Harbor Freight is out of the generator I want. Actually, they're out of
all generators. Hope we don't lose power for too long. I think our longest outage, in 27 years with
this company, has been for about four hours."


Duh!
Considering we're in the middle of hurricane season, it might gave been prudent to get the new generator and test drive it before selling the Honda.

Next week is plenty soon enough. I strongly doubt we'll have any problems with this hurricane. And
if the electricity goes for a day or two, which hasn't happened in the past 27 years, we'll manage.
Thanks for the kind thoughts though.


Nobody bothered to correct his spelling mistake.

I'm being nice to Don.

John H. wrote:
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 10:10:50 -0400 (EDT), justan wrote:

John H. Wrote in message:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 20:10:09 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 9/14/2018 7:15 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/14/18 6:03 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 4:22 PM, John H. wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 14:27:32 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 9/14/18 2:15 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:14 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 11:28:55 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 9/14/2018 10:50 AM, Its Me wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 7:47:42 AM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 21:34:54 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

Well, after we had to evacuate the house for nearly a week while
new hardwoods were being laid, sanded and finished,we are back in
the house today just in time for Florence. At this time the
biggest worry is power outage... the storm is down to a Cat 1,
but
is moving so slowly it will dump lots of rain. We're on a
hill so
no worries of flooding, but power is a concern with a well.
Should
have pulled the trigger on a gen, but we've briefly lost power
twice in ten years, so it hasn't been at the top of the list.
Work
is 10 minutes away, and we have a huge gen, kitchen and
showers so
really no big deal. Plus I have about 5 ways to cook without
electricity, so we are OK.

Hope anyone in the path fairs well. I'll probably just spend my
time painting the newly remodeled parts. All new appliances next
Tuesday! Then we'll have a complete kitchen again after almost 3
months. Whew!

I've heard nothing but good about this generator from the RV
crowd.

https://www.harborfreight.com/3500-w...tor-63584.html




As soon as I find a buyer for my Honda 2200, I'm getting the
Predator.


Thanks, but I need 240V@30A to run the well pump.


I don't necessarily need 240v (split phase) but if my Honda ever
gives
up the ghost I'll shop for one.

Speaking of the Honda ... I just pulled it out of the storage
shed and
gave it three pulls. Fired right up. Last time it was used was
last
winter when we lost power for a couple of days. Still has the same
gas in it that it had then with a splash of Stabil in it. I have it
running right now, trying to run it out of gas so I can use fresh
gas
if and when I need it again. It's just purring away on the old gas.

So much for the stories that gas goes bad in a month or two. It may
lose some of it's BTU's so an engine can't develop it's full HP
rating
but I see no evidence of that. I put a 1500 watt space heater on it
as a load so it burns the gas faster and it runs just fine.



That is the good thing about propane. It doesn't go bad. The problem
is it may be hard to come by and very expensive after a storm. My
generator will run both.



I forgot that Harry looks down at little, gasoline powered generators
because *he* has a big, whole house generator, supplied by a 1,000 gal
propane underground tank. It starts once a week, runs for 10 minutes
and shuts off, similar to my neighbor's generator whole house
generator
he installed three years ago. My neighbor is actually hoping for a
longer term power outage just so he can justify the investment he
made.

I've used my generator twice since Hurricane Wilma in 2005, not
counting
the summer the stone cutters used it everyday when installing the
pool.
Each power outage was of relatively short duration and we got by just
fine with it.

I don't look down my nose at gasoline powered generators. I don't know
if a gasoline-powered generator is available in the size we have that
would be adequate to run one of our furnace/heat pumps, the well pump,
and some appliances and lights. The well pump and heat pump require a
substantial generator to start up and run. In the winter, if you don't
have some heat available, the water pipes in the walls can freeze.
Fixing that would cost a lot more than a generator.

Oh, it's a 500-gallon buried tank. We did have one four-to-five day
power outage in which the genny served us well.

Do you honestly think you need all that when there's a power outage?
Most of us could live with a
couple space heaters, refrigerator, and some lights.

Worried about water in pipes? Drain 'em. Buy some bottled water. Fill
the bathtubs for the toilet.
You're a mess. If you just have to have running water, leave the
faucet trickling. I doesn't get
into the negative numbers around here very much, especially in racist
southern MD where you live.



In an insulated house up my way it takes far more than a day or two of
temps near zero or below to start being concerned with frozen pipes.
Don't think it gets that cold in Harry's neck of the woods.



How long does it take? Do you know? We've had winters in which the temps
were in the single digits for a few days and only up in the teens later
in that week. Would that be enough to freeze the pipes in an unheated
house?

I stated that it takes far more than a day or two of temps near zero or
below. How do I know? Because I've experienced it.

Insulation is nothing more than a time delay for heat loss. However,
that time delay can be quite lengthy for a well insulated house. The
delay is also a factor of the delta T of the ambient temperature outside
and the temperature inside the house and how often water flows through
the pipes. During the last 2 day outage we experienced in our former
house the outside temps during the day didn't rise above 12 degrees (F)
and nights were below zero. After two days the house temp was still
at 62 degrees inside. That's when I decided to hook the generator up
to the heating system. Fortunately, power was restored a few hours later.

If your house is poorly insulated or (worse yet) water pipes in outside
walls were not installed properly, (meaning ending up between the
insulation and the outside walls) you may have problems faster.

Only time I've experienced frozen (and burst) water pipes was in Mrs.E's
unheated horse barn where there was no insulation at all, the water
pipes were exposed and I forgot to plug in the heat tape/rope on them.



OK, you've blown his mind. He'll probably shut up for a while.


Unless Fat Harry's house is built like a barn he shouldn't have
pipe burst problems. I had magic heat in 3 of my houses which
kept the basements quite comfortable in weather Fat Harry doesn't
see in South Maryland.

Back in the early 90's we had some pretty cold weather. Pipes froze at
the underground meter outside
the house which stopped the flow of water. I put a light bulb down there
which thawed the pipes
enough to get the water flowing again. The pipe going through the garage
to the outside spicket
burst. But there was no insulation there. It's not been that cold here since then.


Lots of places have weird weather at times. Back in about 1983, forget
which year, we had freezing weather for a week. Kept the pool pump on
24/7 for a week. Still had about 4� of ice on the pool. Did not lose
any pipes but a few thousand in landscaping. Most of the time the losers
we will ever see is maybe 27f sometime in the night for a couple days a
winter, with 50 high during the day.

John H. Wrote in message:
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 10:15:34 -0400 (EDT), justan wrote:

John H. Wrote in message:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 16:02:10 -0700 (PDT), True North wrote:

John H

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 07:50:06 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 7:47:42 AM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 21:34:54 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

Well, after we had to evacuate the house for nearly a week while new hardwoods were being laid, sanded and finished,we are back in the house today just in time for Florence. At this time the biggest worry is power outage... the storm is down to a Cat 1, but is moving so slowly it will dump lots of rain. We're on a hill so no worries of flooding, but power is a concern with a well. Should have pulled the trigger on a gen, but we've briefly lost power twice in ten years, so it hasn't been at the top of the list. Work is 10 minutes away, and we have a huge gen, kitchen and showers so really no big deal. Plus I have about 5 ways to cook without electricity, so we are OK.

Hope anyone in the path fairs well. I'll probably just spend my time painting the newly remodeled parts. All new appliances next Tuesday! Then we'll have a complete kitchen again after almost 3 months. Whew!

I've heard nothing but good about this generator from the RV crowd.

https://www.harborfreight.com/3500-w...tor-63584.html

As soon as I find a buyer for my Honda 2200, I'm getting the Predator.

Thanks, but I need 240V@30A to run the well pump.

"Sold the Honda today. But, Harbor Freight is out of the generator I want. Actually, they're out of
all generators. Hope we don't lose power for too long. I think our longest outage, in 27 years with
this company, has been for about four hours."


Duh!
Considering we're in the middle of hurricane season, it might gave been prudent to get the new generator and test drive it before selling the Honda.

Next week is plenty soon enough. I strongly doubt we'll have any problems with this hurricane. And
if the electricity goes for a day or two, which hasn't happened in the past 27 years, we'll manage.
Thanks for the kind thoughts though.


Nobody bothered to correct his spelling mistake.

I'm being nice to Don.


He's such a sensitive boy.
--
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