On 3/25/2020 9:15 AM, wrote:
On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 03:18:46 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings,
little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu.

I looked up some info:

The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have
caught it and is beginning to decline.

But the stats are surprising.

According to CDC estimates (USA):

Â*From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been:

38,000,000 – 54,000,000 flu illnesses

17,000,000 – 25,000,000 flu medical visits

390,000 – 710,000 flu hospitalizations

23,000 – 59,000 flu deaths

Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced
data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still
within the ranges shown above.

Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus
(which is an entirely different virus).

Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with
confirmed cases of 53,276.

At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being
way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ...
there's more to this than we are being told.





I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of
COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season"
for it come close to peaking.

Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus
the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19.

Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number between
38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary number. A 1%
death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths.

The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in this
country isÂ* higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death rate is
estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths. Also,
apparently it is far more contagious than flu.

I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over the
years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived.

There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19.

But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.


It seems that what is driving the concern is the percentages of deaths
(flu versus covid-19). Percentages produce
a different perspective than raw numbers. Flu looks like about a
0.15 percent death rate where covid-19 looks like 1.5%. Yet the raw
numbers (about 35,000 versus 700) produces a totally different
perspective.

I am starting to believe we are in for a very long, long ride.
There are some reports of China's infection rate is beginning
to climb again in the area of the initial "ground zero"
which may suggest a second wave of the virus has begun.



Is anyone surprised about China. You can only hide so long from
something like this. It started with one guy and one guy can start it
up again until a significant number of the population is immune. If a
totalitarian culture like China is having this problem, imagine what
happens in a free society.
We are seeing here right now. People who are infected are fleeing New
York and spraying the infection across the country at 600 MPH.



As I mentioned in another post there is no conclusive evidence
that being infected with c-19 makes you immune to being infected
again. Remains to be determined.



--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On 3/25/2020 9:56 AM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/25/20 8:58 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/25/2020 8:42 AM, John wrote:
On Tue, 24 Mar 2020 21:30:41 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings,
little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu.

I looked up some info:

The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have
caught it and is beginning to decline.

But the stats are surprising.

According to CDC estimates (USA):

Â*Â*From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been:

38,000,000 – 54,000,000 flu illnesses

17,000,000 – 25,000,000 flu medical visits

390,000 – 710,000 flu hospitalizations

23,000 – 59,000 flu deaths

Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced
data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still
within the ranges shown above.

Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus
(which is an entirely different virus).

Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with
confirmed cases of 53,276.

At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being
way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ...
there's more to this than we are being told.





I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of
COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season"
for it come close to peaking.

Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus
the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19.

Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number between
38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary number. A 1%
death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths.

The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in this
country isÂ* higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death
rate is
estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths. Also,
apparently it is far more contagious than flu.

I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over the
years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived.

There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19.

But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.


I am tired, so maybe I am screwed up but the flu numbers mean that
those
who got the flu (as of March 14th) is roughly 1,000 times the number of
people who have confirmed corvid-19 (latest number).Â* Deaths due to flu
are roughly 30-40 times those of corvid-19 so far.

I don't know who to believe anymore.Â* Saw Mayor Bill De Blasio earlier
delivering a very dire message of what he sees in our future.Â* Then,
as you say, Trump thinks everything will be hunky-dory in about 3-4
weeks.

I think the bottom line is nobody knows.

I don't think Trump has said everything will be hunky-dory at all. He
would like
to get some folks back into the workplace by Easter. Not all the
folks, and
maybe not a large percent of the folks, but the folks who live and
work in areas
where the virus is not inflicting great damage.


Trump is pulling back somewhat on his original statements to "open the
USA for business".Â* He's now refining it to reflect a limited, slow
"opening" depending on the data available in another 2 or 3 weeks.

I just wish he'd be a little more professional in how he announces
his thoughts, rather than brag about how smart he is.Â* His description
of "the test"Â* being "very unpleasant" with the swab being "stuck way
up into your nose and then a left turn at the eyeball" may be a goofy
attempt at humor but it sure doesn't inspire people to be tested
or to calm the public's concerns.

I understand his concerns.Â* The medical/scientific community being
academics who routinely deal with crunching numbers, creating models,
etc., are not as influenced by the economic ramifications.
Trump and state governors recognize the need for revenues to keep
the country and states operating.

It's a tough balance.



Please. Trump doesn't give a **** about this country. His only concern
is the impact this ****eree might have on his election this fall.

Right. And he's unique in that respect, huh?


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https://www.avg.com

On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 09:53:40 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 08:23:10 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 3/25/2020 8:08 AM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/25/20 3:18 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings,
little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu.

I looked up some info:

The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have
caught it and is beginning to decline.

But the stats are surprising.

According to CDC estimates (USA):

*From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been:

38,000,000 – 54,000,000 flu illnesses

17,000,000 – 25,000,000 flu medical visits

390,000 – 710,000 flu hospitalizations

23,000 – 59,000 flu deaths

Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced
data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still
within the ranges shown above.

Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus
(which is an entirely different virus).

Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with
confirmed cases of 53,276.

At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being
way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ...
there's more to this than we are being told.





I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of
COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season"
for it come close to peaking.

Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus
the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19.

Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number
between 38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary
number. A 1% death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths.

The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in
this country is* higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death
rate is estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths.
Also, apparently it is far more contagious than flu.

I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over
the years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived.

There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19.

But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.


It seems that what is driving the concern is the percentages of deaths
(flu versus covid-19).* Percentages* produce
a different perspective than raw numbers.* Flu looks like about a
0.15 percent death rate where covid-19 looks like 1.5%.** Yet the raw
numbers (about 35,000 versus 700) produces a totally different
perspective.

I am starting to believe we are in for a very long, long ride.
There are some reports of China's infection rate is beginning
to climb again in the area of the initial "ground zero"
which may suggest a second wave of the virus has begun.



I agree and our almost complete unpreparedness for something like this,
plus a POTUS who pooh-poohed it for many weeks, plus all the back and
forth bull**** he is spewing now ain't helping. His daily briefings are
a horror show. He needs to get off that podium, let the experts update
us when they have hard information, and not every day.


If possible (but I know it's asking the impossible) I'd like to focus
this thread on the issues of seasonal flu versus C-19 and not politics.
Nobody was prepared for this.

One possibility is that as a society we have "accepted" the casualties
of the yearly seasonal flu, much like we have pretty much accepted
the casualties as a result of car accidents, suicides and other
deaths. It's just factored into our lives.

Why c-19 is different and the attention it is getting with shutdowns
of businesses, etc. is the question. Probably the level of
contagiousness and the rapid spread throughout the world are factors.

Sources are saying that the rate of infection in places like Italy
are beginning to level off and may even be declining. The graph
on John's link (below) seems to be showing a slowing of world
infections.

If that happens in other countries, the death numbers may still be
lower world-wide than the flu deaths in the USA in one season.

Link:

http://ncov.bii.virginia.edu/dashboard/?fbclid=IwAR0p3SzdCXvoeCqWLpW9e3NJsSPahWEThqxOlw99 hX8cshDW6GbdBdCH-jk

===

I look at those graphs several times a day. There seems to be a daily
anomaly between the morning and evening data, possibly caused by a
reporting lag. In the morning you can convince yourself that there
has been an inflection point and things are starting to level off.
Late in the day that effect seems to disappear.

Here's some info on timing of the updates:

https://nssac.github.io/covid-19/dashboard/

What’s your data level and how often do you update your data?
For USA, we provide data at the county level, and we update it multiple times
during the day;
For China, India, Canada, Germany, Greece, Chile, Brazil, Argentina, Colombia
and Peru, we provide data at the State/Province level and it is updated at least
twice a day;
For Other regions/countries, we provide data at the country level and update it
at least twice a day.
--

Freedom Isn't Free!

Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings,
little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu.

I looked up some info:

The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have
caught it and is beginning to decline.

But the stats are surprising.

According to CDC estimates (USA):

Â*From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been:

38,000,000 – 54,000,000 flu illnesses

17,000,000 – 25,000,000 flu medical visits

390,000 – 710,000 flu hospitalizations

23,000 – 59,000 flu deaths

Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced
data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still
within the ranges shown above.

Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus
(which is an entirely different virus).

Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with
confirmed cases of 53,276.

At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being
way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ...
there's more to this than we are being told.





I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of
COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season"
for it come close to peaking.

Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus
the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19.

Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number between
38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary number. A 1%
death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths.

The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in this
country isÂ* higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death rate is
estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths. Also,
apparently it is far more contagious than flu.

I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over the
years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived.

There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19.

But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.


It seems that what is driving the concern is the percentages of deaths
(flu versus covid-19). Percentages produce
a different perspective than raw numbers. Flu looks like about a
0.15 percent death rate where covid-19 looks like 1.5%. Yet the raw
numbers (about 35,000 versus 700) produces a totally different
perspective.

I am starting to believe we are in for a very long, long ride.
There are some reports of China's infection rate is beginning
to climb again in the area of the initial "ground zero"
which may suggest a second wave of the virus has begun.






Read this morning that the Chinese are opening up Hubei province as the
cases are almost not growing. If a second wave is possible, world is deep
doo doo.

Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/25/20 8:58 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/25/2020 8:42 AM, John wrote:
On Tue, 24 Mar 2020 21:30:41 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings,
little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu.

I looked up some info:

The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have
caught it and is beginning to decline.

But the stats are surprising.

According to CDC estimates (USA):

Â*Â*From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been:

38,000,000 – 54,000,000 flu illnesses

17,000,000 – 25,000,000 flu medical visits

390,000 – 710,000 flu hospitalizations

23,000 – 59,000 flu deaths

Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced
data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still
within the ranges shown above.

Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus
(which is an entirely different virus).

Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with
confirmed cases of 53,276.

At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being
way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ...
there's more to this than we are being told.





I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of
COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season"
for it come close to peaking.

Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus
the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19.

Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number between
38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary number. A 1%
death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths.

The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in this
country isÂ* higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death rate is
estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths. Also,
apparently it is far more contagious than flu.

I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over the
years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived.

There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19.

But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.


I am tired, so maybe I am screwed up but the flu numbers mean that those
who got the flu (as of March 14th) is roughly 1,000 times the number of
people who have confirmed corvid-19 (latest number).Â* Deaths due to flu
are roughly 30-40 times those of corvid-19 so far.

I don't know who to believe anymore.Â* Saw Mayor Bill De Blasio earlier
delivering a very dire message of what he sees in our future.Â* Then,
as you say, Trump thinks everything will be hunky-dory in about 3-4
weeks.

I think the bottom line is nobody knows.

I don't think Trump has said everything will be hunky-dory at all. He
would like
to get some folks back into the workplace by Easter. Not all the
folks, and
maybe not a large percent of the folks, but the folks who live and
work in areas
where the virus is not inflicting great damage.


Trump is pulling back somewhat on his original statements to "open the
USA for business".Â* He's now refining it to reflect a limited, slow
"opening" depending on the data available in another 2 or 3 weeks.

I just wish he'd be a little more professional in how he announces
his thoughts, rather than brag about how smart he is.Â* His description
of "the test"Â* being "very unpleasant" with the swab being "stuck way up
into your nose and then a left turn at the eyeball" may be a goofy
attempt at humor but it sure doesn't inspire people to be tested
or to calm the public's concerns.

I understand his concerns.Â* The medical/scientific community being
academics who routinely deal with crunching numbers, creating models,
etc., are not as influenced by the economic ramifications.
Trump and state governors recognize the need for revenues to keep
the country and states operating.

It's a tough balance.

Please. Trump doesn't give a **** about this country. His only concern
is the impact this ****eree might have on his election this fall.


What an ignoramus you are.

Bill Wrote in message:
Keyser Soze wrote: On 3/25/20 8:58 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 3/25/2020 8:42 AM, John wrote: On Tue, 24 Mar 2020 21:30:41 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings, little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu. I looked up some info: The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have caught it and is beginning to decline. But the stats are surprising. According to CDC estimates (USA): From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been: 38,000,000 +IBM 54,000,000 flu illnesses 17,000,000 +IBM 25,000,000 flu medical visits 390,000 +IBM 710,000 flu hospitalizations 23,000 +IBM 59,000 flu deaths Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still within the ranges shown above. Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus (which is an entirely different virus). Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with confirmed cases of 53,276. At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ... there's more to this than we are being told. I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season" for it come close to peaking. Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19. Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number between 38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary number. A 1% death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths. The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in this country is higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death rate is estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths. Also, apparently it is far more contagious than flu. I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over the years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived. There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19. But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says. I am tired, so maybe I am screwed up but the flu numbers mean that those who got the flu (as of March 14th) is roughly 1,000 times the number of people who have confirmed corvid-19 (latest number). Deaths due to flu are roughly 30-40 times those of corvid-19 so far. I don't know who to believe anymore. Saw Mayor Bill De Blasio earlier delivering a very dire message of what he sees in our future. Then, as you say, Trump thinks everything will be hunky-dory in about 3-4 weeks. I think the bottom line is nobody knows. I don't think Trump has said everything will be hunky-dory at all. He would like to get some folks back into the workplace by Easter. Not all the folks, and maybe not a large percent of the folks, but the folks who live and work in areas where the virus is not inflicting great damage. Trump is pulling back somewhat on his original statements to "open the USA for business". He's now refining it to reflect a limited, slow "opening" depending on the data available in another 2 or 3 weeks. I just wish he'd be a little more professional in how he announces his thoughts, rather than brag about how smart he is. His description of "the test" being "very unpleasant" with the swab being "stuck way up into your nose and then a left turn at the eyeball" may be a goofy attempt at humor but it sure doesn't inspire people to be tested or to calm the public's concerns. I understand his concerns. The medical/scientific community being academics who routinely deal with crunching numbers, creating models, etc., are not as influenced by the economic ramifications. Trump and state governors recognize the need for revenues to keep the country and states operating. It's a tough balance. Please. Trump doesn't give a **** about this country. His only concern is the impact this ****eree might have on his election this fall. What an ignoramus you are.

How many ways are there to say Fat Harry is an ignorant jackass.
Too many to enumerate, I'd guess.
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Wrote in message:
On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 03:18:46 -0400, "Mr. wrote:On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings, little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu. I looked up some info: The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have caught it and is beginning to decline. But the stats are surprising. According to CDC estimates (USA): From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been: 38,000,000 +IBM 54,000,000 flu illnesses 17,000,000 +IBM 25,000,000 flu medical visits 390,000 +IBM 710,000 flu hospitalizations 23,000 +IBM 59,000 flu deaths Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still within the ranges shown above. Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus (which is an entirely different virus). Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with confirmed cases of 53,276. At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ... there's more to this than we are being told. I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season" for it come close to peaking. Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19. Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number between 38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary number. A 1% death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths. The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in this country is higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death rate is estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths. Also, apparently it is far more contagious than flu. I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over the years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived. There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19. But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.It seems that what is driving the concern is the percentages of deaths(flu versus covid-19). Percentages producea different perspective than raw numbers. Flu looks like about a0.15 percent death rate where covid-19 looks like 1.5%. Yet the rawnumbers (about 35,000 versus 700) produces a totally differentperspective.I am starting to believe we are in for a very long, long ride.There are some reports of China's infection rate is beginningto climb again in the area of the initial "ground zero"which may suggest a second wave of the virus has begun.Is anyone surprised about China. You can only hide so long fromsomething like this. It started with one guy and one guy can start itup again until a significant number of the population is immune. If atotalitarian culture like China is having this problem, imagine whathappens in a free society. We are seeing here right now. People who are infected are fleeing NewYork and spraying the infection across the country at 600 MPH.

Destination Florida and points beyond. Our governer is doing a
****ty job at containment. Do you think New Yorkers care about
self imposed isolation? They wouldn't be here if they
did.
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On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 13:44:57 -0400 (EDT), Justan Ohlphart wrote:

Wrote in message:
On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 03:18:46 -0400, "Mr. wrote:On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings, little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu. I looked up some info: The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have caught it and is beginning to decline. But the stats are surprising. According to CDC estimates (USA): From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been: 38,000,000 – 54,000,000 flu illnesses 17,000,000 – 25,000,000 flu medical visits 390,000 – 710,000 flu hospitalizations 23,000 – 59,000 flu deaths Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still within the ranges shown above. Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus (which is an entirely
different virus). Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with confirmed cases of 53,276. At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ... there's more to this than we are being told. I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season" for it come close to peaking. Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19. Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number between 38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary number. A 1% death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths. The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in this country is higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death rate is estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu
deaths. Also, apparently it is far more contagious than flu. I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over the years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived. There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19. But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.It seems that what is driving the concern is the percentages of deaths(flu versus covid-19). Percentages producea different perspective than raw numbers. Flu looks like about a0.15 percent death rate where covid-19 looks like 1.5%. Yet the rawnumbers (about 35,000 versus 700) produces a totally differentperspective.I am starting to believe we are in for a very long, long ride.There are some reports of China's infection rate is beginningto climb again in the area of the initial "ground zero"which may suggest a second wave of the virus has begun.Is anyone surprised about China. You can only hide so long fromsomething like this. It
started with one guy and one guy can start itup again until a significant number of the population is immune. If atotalitarian culture like China is having this problem, imagine whathappens in a free society. We are seeing here right now. People who are infected are fleeing NewYork and spraying the infection across the country at 600 MPH.

Destination Florida and points beyond. Our governer is doing a
****ty job at containment. Do you think New Yorkers care about
self imposed isolation? They wouldn't be here if they
did.

A whole lot of New Yorkers don't give a ****, and their mayor does nothing about
it, except bitch about Trump, of course.
--

Freedom Isn't Free!

On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 08:42:33 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 24 Mar 2020 21:30:41 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings,
little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu.

I looked up some info:

The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have
caught it and is beginning to decline.

But the stats are surprising.

According to CDC estimates (USA):

Â*From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been:

38,000,000 – 54,000,000 flu illnesses

17,000,000 – 25,000,000 flu medical visits

390,000 – 710,000 flu hospitalizations

23,000 – 59,000 flu deaths

Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced
data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still
within the ranges shown above.

Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus
(which is an entirely different virus).

Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with
confirmed cases of 53,276.

At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being
way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ...
there's more to this than we are being told.





I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of
COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season"
for it come close to peaking.

Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus
the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19.

Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number between
38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary number. A 1%
death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths.

The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in this
country isÂ* higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death rate is
estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths. Also,
apparently it is far more contagious than flu.

I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over the
years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived.

There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19.

But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.


I am tired, so maybe I am screwed up but the flu numbers mean that those
who got the flu (as of March 14th) is roughly 1,000 times the number of
people who have confirmed corvid-19 (latest number). Deaths due to flu
are roughly 30-40 times those of corvid-19 so far.

I don't know who to believe anymore. Saw Mayor Bill De Blasio earlier
delivering a very dire message of what he sees in our future. Then,
as you say, Trump thinks everything will be hunky-dory in about 3-4
weeks.

I think the bottom line is nobody knows.

I don't think Trump has said everything will be hunky-dory at all. He would like
to get some folks back into the workplace by Easter. Not all the folks, and
maybe not a large percent of the folks, but the folks who live and work in areas
where the virus is not inflicting great damage.

It only works if they screen everyone coming and going.

On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 09:53:40 -0400,
wrote:

On Wed, 25 Mar 2020 08:23:10 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 3/25/2020 8:08 AM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/25/20 3:18 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/24/2020 9:20 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 3/24/20 8:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


With all the focus on convid-19 and some of the dire warnings,
little is said much about the regular, seasonal Flu.

I looked up some info:

The regular, seasonal Flu has peaked in terms of how many have
caught it and is beginning to decline.

But the stats are surprising.

According to CDC estimates (USA):

Â*From October 1, 2019, through March 14, 2020, there have been:

38,000,000 – 54,000,000 flu illnesses

17,000,000 – 25,000,000 flu medical visits

390,000 – 710,000 flu hospitalizations

23,000 – 59,000 flu deaths

Another website with Flu statistics that also referenced
data from the CDC had slightly lower numbers but still
within the ranges shown above.

Makes me wonder what the deal is with the corvid-19 virus
(which is an entirely different virus).

Total deaths in the USA as of this post totals 696 with
confirmed cases of 53,276.

At first blush, it would seem like corvid-19 is being
way overblown in terms of it's threat ... OR ...
there's more to this than we are being told.





I don't believe we have even begun to get a handle on the number of
COVOID-19 cases that are extant in this country, nor has the "season"
for it come close to peaking.

Another factor: the percentage of deaths attributed to the flu versus
the percentage theoretically attributable to COVID-19.

Let's say there are 45 million flu cases a year here, a number
between 38 and 54 million, and 35,000 deaths, again an arbitrary
number. A 1% death rate would add up to 450,000 deaths.

The estimates for the total number of possible COVOID-19 cases in
this country isÂ* higher than the numbers of flu cases, and the death
rate is estimated to be much higher than the 1% rate for flu deaths.
Also, apparently it is far more contagious than flu.

I've had the various sorts of flu at least a half dozen times over
the years. A couple of times it knocked me on my ass, but I survived.

There are an awful lot of unknowns about COVOID-19.

But, hell, we'll be through it by Easter, your Trump sort of says.


It seems that what is driving the concern is the percentages of deaths
(flu versus covid-19).Â* PercentagesÂ* produce
a different perspective than raw numbers.Â* Flu looks like about a
0.15 percent death rate where covid-19 looks like 1.5%.Â*Â* Yet the raw
numbers (about 35,000 versus 700) produces a totally different
perspective.

I am starting to believe we are in for a very long, long ride.
There are some reports of China's infection rate is beginning
to climb again in the area of the initial "ground zero"
which may suggest a second wave of the virus has begun.



I agree and our almost complete unpreparedness for something like this,
plus a POTUS who pooh-poohed it for many weeks, plus all the back and
forth bull**** he is spewing now ain't helping. His daily briefings are
a horror show. He needs to get off that podium, let the experts update
us when they have hard information, and not every day.


If possible (but I know it's asking the impossible) I'd like to focus
this thread on the issues of seasonal flu versus C-19 and not politics.
Nobody was prepared for this.

One possibility is that as a society we have "accepted" the casualties
of the yearly seasonal flu, much like we have pretty much accepted
the casualties as a result of car accidents, suicides and other
deaths. It's just factored into our lives.

Why c-19 is different and the attention it is getting with shutdowns
of businesses, etc. is the question. Probably the level of
contagiousness and the rapid spread throughout the world are factors.

Sources are saying that the rate of infection in places like Italy
are beginning to level off and may even be declining. The graph
on John's link (below) seems to be showing a slowing of world
infections.

If that happens in other countries, the death numbers may still be
lower world-wide than the flu deaths in the USA in one season.

Link:

http://ncov.bii.virginia.edu/dashboard/?fbclid=IwAR0p3SzdCXvoeCqWLpW9e3NJsSPahWEThqxOlw99 hX8cshDW6GbdBdCH-jk

===

I look at those graphs several times a day. There seems to be a daily
anomaly between the morning and evening data, possibly caused by a
reporting lag. In the morning you can convince yourself that there
has been an inflection point and things are starting to level off.
Late in the day that effect seems to disappear.

This is the ragged edge of a wave that is going over us. I doubt the
numbers mean that much day by day. You just need to watch the curve.