Light weight, but talk about an engine that burns oil!

This system introduces a mixture of gasoline, air and lubricating oil
into the combustion chamber, compresses it, and then ignites the
resulting mixture with a sparkplug. The two-cycle engine has been the
mainstay for outboard engines. In recent years, however, two-cycle
outboard motors are beginning to be replaced by four-cycle systems.
The biggest advantage of the two-cycle engine is that it is very
lightweight. The horsepower to weight ratio is the highest in marine
reciprocating engines. One big disadvantage is you have to burn a fuel
mixture of gasoline & lubricating oil.

Another disadvantage is, because the lubricating oil does not burn as
cleanly as gasoline, two-cycle engines tend to smoke, and foul their
ignition systems. They also can leave an oily residue on the water from
their exhaust. However, great improvement has been made in cleaning up
their exhaust emissions through the use of more efficient fuel
injection systems.

Best regards
http://www.geocities.com/winder21/ windersports portal
Your guide to winder's interest on sports : provides tips and
techniques to improve your game.

Thanks, Winder. Nice to see "on Topic" postings.


"winder" wrote in message
oups.com...
Light weight, but talk about an engine that burns oil!

This system introduces a mixture of gasoline, air and lubricating oil
into the combustion chamber, compresses it, and then ignites the
resulting mixture with a sparkplug. The two-cycle engine has been the
mainstay for outboard engines. In recent years, however, two-cycle
outboard motors are beginning to be replaced by four-cycle systems.
The biggest advantage of the two-cycle engine is that it is very
lightweight. The horsepower to weight ratio is the highest in marine
reciprocating engines. One big disadvantage is you have to burn a fuel
mixture of gasoline & lubricating oil.

Another disadvantage is, because the lubricating oil does not burn as
cleanly as gasoline, two-cycle engines tend to smoke, and foul their
ignition systems. They also can leave an oily residue on the water from
their exhaust. However, great improvement has been made in cleaning up
their exhaust emissions through the use of more efficient fuel
injection systems.

Best regards
http://www.geocities.com/winder21/ windersports portal
Your guide to winder's interest on sports : provides tips and
techniques to improve your game.

Winder,

Whatever you cut and pasted that from is years out of date.

Today, the much improved and direct injected 2-stroke engine emits
fewer total emissions than a high-tech EFI 4-stroke outboard. They have
no smoke, are super quiet and smooth, and have all the advantages of a
4 stroke, with the lower weight and higher performance of a 2 stroke.
Bill Grannis
service manager

wrote:
Winder,

Whatever you cut and pasted that from is years out of date.

Today, the much improved and direct injected 2-stroke engine emits
fewer total emissions than a high-tech EFI 4-stroke outboard. They have
no smoke, are super quiet and smooth, and have all the advantages of a
4 stroke, with the lower weight and higher performance of a 2 stroke.
Bill Grannis
service manager

The suzuki 4stroke 140 is 410lb, the Evinrude 135/150 is 419lb
The suzuke 200/225 is 580lb while the Evinrude is 524lb

del cecchi

"Del Cecchi" wrote in message
...
wrote:


The suzuki 4stroke 140 is 410lb, the Evinrude 135/150 is 419lb

(4 cyl. motor vs. a V6)


The suzuke 200/225 is 580lb while the Evinrude is 524lb




....and how much does the Yamaha F225, Honda 225, and the Merc Verado 225
weigh compared to the Evinrude V6?

Bill Grannis
service manager

"Billgran" wrote in message
. ..

"Del Cecchi" wrote in message
...
wrote:


The suzuki 4stroke 140 is 410lb, the Evinrude 135/150 is 419lb

(4 cyl. motor vs. a V6)


The suzuke 200/225 is 580lb while the Evinrude is 524lb




...and how much does the Yamaha F225, Honda 225, and the Merc Verado
225
weigh compared to the Evinrude V6?

Bill Grannis
service manager

Now Bill, I was just refuting your generalization that the Bombardier
motors were lighter than 4 strokes. And I don't have the motor guide
out of bass and walleye boats handy.

The Yamaha 115 and merc version also aren't much heavier than my 115
carb'd two stroke as I recall.

And why should I want a V6 Evinrude instead of a 4cyl Suzuki? What's
the big deal with the V6? Cars used them (4 stroke of course) because
they reused much of the tooling and parts for the V8s that already
existed. And apparently 2 stroke inline 4s have issues leading to
bizarre solutions like the 2+2 on my Merc. But the 4 in my accord is
just peachy, as is the one in my CB750.

So, what is superior about the Evinrude 135/150 as compared to the
Suzuki ?

Ok looked up the yamaha. The 200/225/250 are 580-590 lb. The 150 is
466 lb.

So looks like maybe 50 lb over the Evinrude. Is 50 lb a big deal?

What is the relative selling price?

If I was shopping I would buy a 4 stroke at this point in time.

del cecchi

"del cecchi" wrote in message
...

"Billgran" wrote in message
. ..

"Del Cecchi" wrote in message
...
wrote:


The suzuki 4stroke 140 is 410lb, the Evinrude 135/150 is 419lb

(4 cyl. motor vs. a V6)


The suzuke 200/225 is 580lb while the Evinrude is 524lb




...and how much does the Yamaha F225, Honda 225, and the Merc Verado
225
weigh compared to the Evinrude V6?

Bill Grannis
service manager

Now Bill, I was just refuting your generalization that the Bombardier
motors were lighter than 4 strokes. And I don't have the motor guide
out of bass and walleye boats handy.

The Yamaha 115 and merc version also aren't much heavier than my 115
carb'd two stroke as I recall.

And why should I want a V6 Evinrude instead of a 4cyl Suzuki? What's
the big deal with the V6? Cars used them (4 stroke of course) because
they reused much of the tooling and parts for the V8s that already
existed. And apparently 2 stroke inline 4s have issues leading to
bizarre solutions like the 2+2 on my Merc. But the 4 in my accord is
just peachy, as is the one in my CB750.

So, what is superior about the Evinrude 135/150 as compared to the
Suzuki ?

Ok looked up the yamaha. The 200/225/250 are 580-590 lb. The 150 is
466 lb.

So looks like maybe 50 lb over the Evinrude. Is 50 lb a big deal?

What is the relative selling price?

If I was shopping I would buy a 4 stroke at this point in time.

del cecchi


Del,

My "gerneralization" on wieght was meant for engines with the same number
of cylinders, mostly the popular 200hp range and higher. The midrange motors
70-175 are a mix of 3,4, and 6 cylinders and can't be compared that way.

What year CB750? I had a CB750 K2 that I rode for 27 years, even when I had
Harleys, too. Sold all kinds of parts, hop-up stuff, repair kits, etc. on
Ebay last summer. I couldn't believe the prices the people paid and the
interest in those old bikes.

Your other post mentioned information dribbling out about DFI motors, all
that is open knowledge in boating magazines, Internet forums, Industtry
publications, Industry news sources, etc. Ask away if you have any specific
questions, you know my credentials and credibilty after all these years.

Bill Grannis
service manager

Billgran wrote:
"del cecchi" wrote in message
...

"Billgran" wrote in message
m...

"Del Cecchi" wrote in message
...

wrote:


The suzuki 4stroke 140 is 410lb, the Evinrude 135/150 is 419lb

(4 cyl. motor vs. a V6)



The suzuke 200/225 is 580lb while the Evinrude is 524lb




...and how much does the Yamaha F225, Honda 225, and the Merc Verado

225

weigh compared to the Evinrude V6?

Bill Grannis
service manager


Now Bill, I was just refuting your generalization that the Bombardier
motors were lighter than 4 strokes. And I don't have the motor guide
out of bass and walleye boats handy.

The Yamaha 115 and merc version also aren't much heavier than my 115
carb'd two stroke as I recall.

And why should I want a V6 Evinrude instead of a 4cyl Suzuki? What's
the big deal with the V6? Cars used them (4 stroke of course) because
they reused much of the tooling and parts for the V8s that already
existed. And apparently 2 stroke inline 4s have issues leading to
bizarre solutions like the 2+2 on my Merc. But the 4 in my accord is
just peachy, as is the one in my CB750.

So, what is superior about the Evinrude 135/150 as compared to the
Suzuki ?

Ok looked up the yamaha. The 200/225/250 are 580-590 lb. The 150 is
466 lb.

So looks like maybe 50 lb over the Evinrude. Is 50 lb a big deal?

What is the relative selling price?

If I was shopping I would buy a 4 stroke at this point in time.

del cecchi



Del,

My "gerneralization" on wieght was meant for engines with the same number
of cylinders, mostly the popular 200hp range and higher. The midrange motors
70-175 are a mix of 3,4, and 6 cylinders and can't be compared that way.

What year CB750? I had a CB750 K2 that I rode for 27 years, even when I had
Harleys, too. Sold all kinds of parts, hop-up stuff, repair kits, etc. on
Ebay last summer. I couldn't believe the prices the people paid and the
interest in those old bikes.

Your other post mentioned information dribbling out about DFI motors, all
that is open knowledge in boating magazines, Internet forums, Industtry
publications, Industry news sources, etc. Ask away if you have any specific
questions, you know my credentials and credibilty after all these years.

Bill Grannis
service manager



It is a 1976, been sitting for a few years now. My retirement project :-)

I heard a lot of rumors that the early 150's didn't do so well, on this
group and on the Bass Fishing board at wmi.org or whatever it is. But
the magazines I read, like Bass and Walleye Boats (which I really like),
just pretended it wasn't happening. And the folks I talked to at the
boat show..... they just gave me blank looks.

Maybe Industry Publications or other specialized areas had some
information, but I didn't see it. And I've been reading rec.boats
starting in 96 or 97 when I was shopping for my Lund.

So here is a blunt question: If one bought an early Ficht 150, what was
the likelyhood that one would have had major problems with the
powerhead? I have heard the big blocks were better, what is the
comparable number for them? And what had the rate dropped to by the
time of the OMC bankruptcy?

I am, just to satisfy my curiousity, trying to understand whether indeed
2 strokes are barely feasable and direct injected two strokes have
fundamental problems that doom any attempt to make them work reliably,
or whether quality problems, whether isolated or pervasive, caused the
appearance of a flaw.

I heard stories of sooting. I heard stories of poor quality assurance
when switching supplies for parts. But I certainly wasn't in the story
flow. So what is your opinion as to the root cause of the problems?

del

On Tue, 01 Feb 2005 08:17:23 -0600, Del Cecchi
wrote:

~~ mucho snippage ~~

So here is a blunt question: If one bought an early Ficht 150, what was
the likelyhood that one would have had major problems with the
powerhead? I have heard the big blocks were better, what is the
comparable number for them? And what had the rate dropped to by the
time of the OMC bankruptcy?

I am, just to satisfy my curiousity, trying to understand whether indeed
2 strokes are barely feasable and direct injected two strokes have
fundamental problems that doom any attempt to make them work reliably,
or whether quality problems, whether isolated or pervasive, caused the
appearance of a flaw.

I heard stories of sooting. I heard stories of poor quality assurance
when switching supplies for parts. But I certainly wasn't in the story
flow. So what is your opinion as to the root cause of the problems?

I can answer a couple of these questions for you.

It was the early 150 FICHTs that had the major problems. And those
were corrected eventually. And if you have an early 150 FICHT that
is running, the likely circumstance is that it's been upgraded and is
ok.

With respect to DI engines - anything you hear about them being
fundamentally flawed by a certain individual on this newsgroup or by
competitive dealers is strictly personal opinion and unfounded in the
real world. DI is the way to go with two strokes. I am also
impressed by the E-TEC engines - my new boat will have E-TECS.

I currently own three FICHTs and with one exception, have never had
any major problems and those problems that I did have weren't much
different that any new engine would have - easily and quickly
correctable. That one exception was related to the electronics
(something that almost never happens even on other type engines - a
stator failure which cascaded into the computer) and not the power
head.

As to soot - use a good grade gas, make sure you use stabilizer and
use the FICHT oil instead of a industry standard brand. Haven't had
any soot problems yet. I did have on one, but I was using el cheapo
gas on the way to the launch. Switched over and no more problem.

I know several shell fish types (clammers) who have FICHTS with
incredible amounts of hours on them and they are running just fine
thank you very much. :)

I am a barely technically literate very satisfied FICHT owner - Bill
can give you the heavy duty technical stuff.

Trying to keep the barbarians from giving you a false impression. :)

Later,

Tom

Billgran wrote:
"del cecchi" wrote in message
...

"Billgran" wrote in message
m...

"Del Cecchi" wrote in message
...

wrote:


The suzuki 4stroke 140 is 410lb, the Evinrude 135/150 is 419lb

(4 cyl. motor vs. a V6)



The suzuke 200/225 is 580lb while the Evinrude is 524lb




...and how much does the Yamaha F225, Honda 225, and the Merc Verado

225

weigh compared to the Evinrude V6?

Bill Grannis
service manager


Now Bill, I was just refuting your generalization that the Bombardier
motors were lighter than 4 strokes. And I don't have the motor guide
out of bass and walleye boats handy.

The Yamaha 115 and merc version also aren't much heavier than my 115
carb'd two stroke as I recall.

And why should I want a V6 Evinrude instead of a 4cyl Suzuki? What's
the big deal with the V6? Cars used them (4 stroke of course) because
they reused much of the tooling and parts for the V8s that already
existed. And apparently 2 stroke inline 4s have issues leading to
bizarre solutions like the 2+2 on my Merc. But the 4 in my accord is
just peachy, as is the one in my CB750.

So, what is superior about the Evinrude 135/150 as compared to the
Suzuki ?

Ok looked up the yamaha. The 200/225/250 are 580-590 lb. The 150 is
466 lb.

So looks like maybe 50 lb over the Evinrude. Is 50 lb a big deal?

What is the relative selling price?

If I was shopping I would buy a 4 stroke at this point in time.

del cecchi



Del,

My "gerneralization" on wieght was meant for engines with the same number
of cylinders, mostly the popular 200hp range and higher. The midrange motors
70-175 are a mix of 3,4, and 6 cylinders and can't be compared that way.

What year CB750? I had a CB750 K2 that I rode for 27 years, even when I had
Harleys, too. Sold all kinds of parts, hop-up stuff, repair kits, etc. on
Ebay last summer. I couldn't believe the prices the people paid and the
interest in those old bikes.

Your other post mentioned information dribbling out about DFI motors, all
that is open knowledge in boating magazines, Internet forums, Industtry
publications, Industry news sources, etc. Ask away if you have any specific
questions, you know my credentials and credibilty after all these years.

Bill Grannis
service manager



So what you really mean Bill is it's just more deceptive spruiking from
the very same dealer (& most other OMC dealers) who told & continue to
tell all sorts of BS about Ficht???

The E-Tec is nothing more than the latest in a long line of set
marketing BS that "Ficht is all fixed now", which you've deceptively
spammed this NG with for years. It's totally unproven & will go the same
way it did when you actually called it Ficht; under.

K

Krause's lie of the day is a bit of a double header sorry, but so many
lies so little time:-)

Whenever his total lack of any real boating knowledge looks like
uncovering him as the sad little liar he is, he posts some crazy list of
boats he claims are his base, here are just a few of his claims, he has
tried to sustain these lies & as each one is shown to be a fabrication
he just invents a new one, the latest is the "Parker".

Don't feel conned nor stupid if you've been taken in by him, he make
exactly the same lies up in the jet ski NGs when he used to pollute them
with his crap, can you believe it he claimed to be a jet skier!!!!!
(responsible & caring in the socialist way of course:-))

This idiot has never owned a boat & never will he is totally devoid of
any boating experience nor knowledge, other than what he picks up in
this NG & the occasional paid charter fishing trip.



Here are some:

Hatteras 43' sportfish
Swan 41' racing/cruising sloop
Morgan 33
O'Day 30
Cruisers, Inc., Mackinac 22
Century Coronado
Bill Luders 16, as sweet a sailboat as ever caught a breeze.
Century 19' wood lapstrake with side wheel steering
Cruisers, Inc. 18' and 16' wood lapstrakes
Wolverines. Molded plywood. Gorgeous. Several. 14,15,17 footers
with various
Evinrudes
Lighting class sailboat
Botved Coronet with twin 50 hp Evinrudes. Interesting boat.
Aristocraft (a piece of junk...13', fast, held together with spit)
Alcort Sunfish
Ancarrow Marine Aquiflyer. 22' footer with two Caddy Crusaders.
Guaranteed 60 mph. In the late 1950's.
Skimmar brand skiff
Arkansas Traveler fiberglass bowrider (I think it was a bowrider)
Dyer Dhow
Su-Mark round bilge runabout, fiberglass
Penn Yan runabouts. Wood.
Old Town wood and canvas canoe
Old Town sailing canoe...different than above canoe


I own the following boats:

a 36' "lobster" style boat
a 19' center console fishing boat
an 11' inflatable dinghy
1/2 of a canoe

Those are the types of boats I currently own. I'm also in the market for
some interesting kind of lightweight flatbottomed skiff, similar to the
old Skimmar, for the "new" 51-year-old 10 hp outboard I recently bought.

One of the boats is kept on dry land within a half mile of Chesapeake
Bay. One is kept at a private covered boat dock in a little creek off
Chesapeake Bay. One is kept in the backyard of a friend who lives much
closer to the Shenandoah River than I do. And one is kept next to the
36-footer."