In a current thread titled "( OT ) Where have you gone, Rosy Scenario?"

NOYB noted...

"Harry Krause" wrote:
I am no fan of contemporary or recent Arab/Moslem culture or history,
but there have been some significant contributors to the advancement of
our society.

You sure seem to have backed off your position from 2 years ago. Here's
what you had to say in April 2002:

"The reality is that for at least the last 100 years, the so-called Arab
states have contributed absolutely nothing to the furthering of society in
any field of endeavor and the only reason anyone tolerates their anti-social
behavior is because they happen to be sitting on oil. If it weren't for
their oil, no one would pay them the slightest attention.
Their contributions to the fields of medicine, other sciences, the arts,
socialization, you name it and there is nothing there. Oh...I
forgot...they're adept at cowardice, at furthering the methodology of
terrorism and waging war on non-combatants."

So as this shows, Harry changes his stance on issues at least as often as Kerry. It is in the record that he does.

Basically, Harry talks out of his ass, much as one of his Hollywood idols Jim Carrey does.

Harry eliminates any credibility he may have had with his blind, sheep-like allegiance to anything anti-conservative. A poor talent wasted (spewed) on a boating news-group. Too funny, but sad.

Jack

"Jack Goff" wrote in message .. .
In a current thread titled "( OT ) Where have you gone, Rosy Scenario?"

NOYB noted...

"Harry Krause" wrote:
I am no fan of contemporary or recent Arab/Moslem culture or history,
but there have been some significant contributors to the advancement
of
our society.

You sure seem to have backed off your position from 2 years ago.
Here's
what you had to say in April 2002:

"The reality is that for at least the last 100 years, the so-called Arab
states have contributed absolutely nothing to the furthering of society
in
any field of endeavor and the only reason anyone tolerates their
anti-social
behavior is because they happen to be sitting on oil. If it weren't for
their oil, no one would pay them the slightest attention.
Their contributions to the fields of medicine, other sciences, the arts,
socialization, you name it and there is nothing there. Oh...I
forgot...they're adept at cowardice, at furthering the methodology of
terrorism and waging war on non-combatants."

So as this shows, Harry changes his stance on issues at least as often
as Kerry.

But not as much as Bush, thankfully.

Basically, Harry talks out of his ass, much as one of his Hollywood
idols Jim Carrey does.

But not as much as Bush, thankfully

Harry eliminates any credibility he may have had with his blind,
sheep-like allegiance to anything anti-conservative. A poor talent
wasted (spewed) on a boating news-group. Too funny, but sad.

Jack

Here are some of Bush's flip-flops. You tell me, is THIS man
"credible":

President Bush: Flip-Flopper-In-Chief

March 31, 2004
Download: DOC, RTF, PDF

From the beginning, George W. Bush has made his own credibility a
central issue. On 10/11/00, then Governor Bush said: "I think
credibility is important. It is going to be important for the
president to be credible with Congress, important for the president to
be credible with foreign nations." But President Bush's serial
flip-flopping raises serious questions about whether Congress and
foreign leaders can rely on what he says.

1. Department of Homeland Security

BUSH OPPOSES THE DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY..."So, creating a
Cabinet office doesn't solve the problem. You still will have agencies
within the federal government that have to be coordinated. So the
answer is that creating a Cabinet post doesn't solve anything." [White
House spokesman Ari Fleischer, 3/19/02]

....BUSH SUPPORTS THE DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY "So tonight, I
ask the Congress to join me in creating a single, permanent department
with an overriding and urgent mission: securing the homeland of
America and protecting the American people." [President Bush, Address
to the Nation, 6/6/02]

2. Weapons of Mass Destruction

BUSH SAYS WE FOUND THE WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION..."We found the
weapons of mass destruction. We found biological laboratories…for
those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or
banned weapons, they're wrong, we found them." [President Bush,
Interview in Poland, 5/29/03]

....BUSH SAYS WE HAVEN'T FOUND WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION "David Kay
has found the capacity to produce weapons. And when David Kay goes in
and says we haven't found stockpiles yet, and there's theories as to
where the weapons went. They could have been destroyed during the war.
Saddam and his henchmen could have destroyed them as we entered into
Iraq. They could be hidden. They could have been transported to
another country, and we'll find out." [President Bush, Meet the Press,
2/7/04]

3. Free Trade

BUSH SUPPORTS FREE TRADE... "I believe strongly that if we promote
trade, and when we promote trade, it will help workers on both sides
of this issue." [President Bush in Peru, 3/23/02]

....BUSH SUPPORTS RESTRICTIONS ON TRADE "In a decision largely driven
by his political advisers, President Bush set aside his free-trade
principles last year and imposed heavy tariffs on imported steel to
help out struggling mills in Pennsylvania and West Virginia, two
states crucial for his reelection." [Washington Post, 9/19/03]

4. Osama Bin Laden

BUSH WANTS OSAMA DEAD OR ALIVE... "I want justice. And there's an old
poster out West, I recall, that says, 'Wanted: Dead or Alive.'"
[President Bush, on Osama Bin Laden, 09/17/01]

....BUSH DOESN'T CARE ABOUT OSAMA "I don't know where he is. I have no
idea and I really don't care. It's not that important." [President
Bush, Press Conference, 3/13/02]

5. The Environment

BUSH SUPPORTS MANDATORY CAPS ON CARBON DIOXIDE... "[If elected],
Governor Bush will work to…establish mandatory reduction targets for
emissions of four main pollutants: sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxide,
mercury and carbon dioxide." [Bush Environmental Plan, 9/29/00]

....BUSH OPPOSES MANDATORY CAPS ON CARBON DIOXIDE "I do not believe,
however, that the government should impose on power plants mandatory
emissions reductions for carbon dioxide, which is not a 'pollutant'
under the Clean Air Act." [President Bush, Letter to Sen. Chuck Hagel
(R-NE), 3/13/03]

6. WMD Commission

BUSH RESISTS AN OUTSIDE INVESTIGATION ON WMD INTELLIGENCE FAILURE...
"The White House immediately turned aside the calls from Kay and many
Democrats for an immediate outside investigation, seeking to head off
any new wide-ranging election-year inquiry that might go beyond
reports already being assembled by congressional committees and the
Central Intelligence Agency." [NY Times, 1/29/04]

....BUSH SUPPORTS AN OUTSIDE INVESTIGATION ON WMD INTELLIGENCE FAILURE
"Today, by executive order, I am creating an independent commission,
chaired by Governor and former Senator Chuck Robb, Judge Laurence
Silberman, to look at American intelligence capabilities, especially
our intelligence about weapons of mass destruction." [President Bush,
2/6/04]

7. Creation of the 9/11 Commission

BUSH OPPOSES CREATION OF INDEPENDENT 9/11 COMMISSION... "President
Bush took a few minutes during his trip to Europe Thursday to voice
his opposition to establishing a special commission to probe how the
government dealt with terror warnings before Sept. 11." [CBS News,
5/23/02]

....BUSH SUPPORTS CREATION OF INDEPENDENT 9/11 COMMISSION "President
Bush said today he now supports establishing an independent commission
to investigate the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks." [ABC News, 09/20/02]

8. Time Extension for 9/11 Commission

BUSH OPPOSES TIME EXTENSION FOR 9/11 COMMISSION... "President Bush and
House Speaker J. Dennis Hastert (R-Ill.) have decided to oppose
granting more time to an independent commission investigating the
Sept. 11, 2001, attacks." [Washington Post, 1/19/04]

....BUSH SUPPORTS TIME EXTENSION FOR 9/11 COMMISSION "The White House
announced Wednesday its support for a request from the commission
investigating the September 11, 2001 attacks for more time to complete
its work." [CNN, 2/4/04]

9. One Hour Limit for 9/11 Commission Testimony

BUSH LIMITS TESTIMONY IN FRONT OF 9/11 COMMISSION TO ONE HOUR...
"President Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney have placed strict
limits on the private interviews they will grant to the federal
commission investigating the Sept. 11 attacks, saying that they will
meet only with the panel's top two officials and that Mr. Bush will
submit to only a single hour of questioning, commission members said
Wednesday." [NY Times, 2/26/04]

....BUSH SETS NO TIMELIMIT FOR TESTIMONY "The president's going to
answer all of the questions they want to raise. Nobody's watching the
clock." [White House spokesman Scott McClellan, 3/10/04]

10. Gay Marriage

BUSH SAYS GAY MARRIAGE IS A STATE ISSUE... "The state can do what they
want to do. Don't try to trap me in this state's issue like you're
trying to get me into." [Gov. George W. Bush on Gay Marriage, Larry
King Live, 2/15/00]

....BUSH SUPPORTS CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT BANNING GAY MARRIAGE "Today
I call upon the Congress to promptly pass, and to send to the states
for ratification, an amendment to our Constitution defining and
protecting marriage as a union of man and woman as husband and wife."
[President Bush, 2/24/04]

11. Nation Building

BUSH OPPOSES NATION BUILDING... "If we don't stop extending our troops
all around the world in nation-building missions, then we're going to
have a serious problem coming down the road." [Gov. George W. Bush,
10/3/00]

....BUSH SUPPORTS NATION BUILDING "We will be changing the regime of
Iraq, for the good of the Iraqi people." [President Bush, 3/6/03]

12. Saddam/al Qaeda Link

BUSH SAYS IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEEN AL QAEDA AND
SADDAM... "You can't distinguish between al Qaeda and Saddam when you
talk about the war on terror." [President Bush, 9/25/02]

....BUSH SAYS SADDAM HAD NO ROLE IN AL QAEDA PLOT "We've had no
evidence that Saddam Hussein was involved in Sept. 11." [President
Bush, 9/17/03]

13. U.N. Resolution

BUSH VOWS TO HAVE A UN VOTE NO MATTER WHAT... "No matter what the whip
count is, we're calling for the vote. We want to see people stand up
and say what their opinion is about Saddam Hussein and the utility of
the United Nations Security Council. And so, you bet. It's time for
people to show their cards, to let the world know where they stand
when it comes to Saddam." [President Bush 3/6/03]

....BUSH WITHDRAWS REQUEST FOR VOTE "At a National Security Council
meeting convened at the White House at 8:55 a.m., Bush finalized the
decision to withdraw the resolution from consideration and prepared to
deliver an address to the nation that had already been written."
[Washington Post, 3/18/03]

14. Involvement in the Palestinian Conflict

BUSH OPPOSES SUMMITS... "Well, we've tried summits in the past, as you
may remember. It wasn't all that long ago where a summit was called
and nothing happened, and as a result we had significant intifada in
the area." [President Bush, 04/05/02]

....BUSH SUPPORTS SUMMITS "If a meeting advances progress toward two
states living side by side in peace, I will strongly consider such a
meeting. I'm committed to working toward peace in the Middle East."
[President Bush, 5/23/03]

15. Campaign Finance

BUSH OPPOSES MCCAIN-FEINGOLD... "George W. Bush opposes
McCain-Feingold...as an infringement on free expression." [Washington
Post, 3/28/2000]

....BUSH SIGNS MCCAIN-FEINGOLD INTO LAW "[T]his bill improves the
current system of financing for Federal campaigns, and therefore I
have signed it into law." [President Bush, at the McCain-Feingold
singing ceremony, 03/27/02]

On Wed, 26 May 2004 05:14:44 GMT, "Jack Goff" wrote:

In a current thread titled "( OT ) Where have you gone, Rosy Scenario?"

NOYB noted...

"Harry Krause" wrote:
I am no fan of contemporary or recent Arab/Moslem culture or history,
but there have been some significant contributors to the advancement of
our society.

You sure seem to have backed off your position from 2 years ago. Here's
what you had to say in April 2002:

"The reality is that for at least the last 100 years, the so-called Arab
states have contributed absolutely nothing to the furthering of society in
any field of endeavor and the only reason anyone tolerates their anti-social
behavior is because they happen to be sitting on oil. If it weren't for
their oil, no one would pay them the slightest attention.
Their contributions to the fields of medicine, other sciences, the arts,
socialization, you name it and there is nothing there. Oh...I
forgot...they're adept at cowardice, at furthering the methodology of
terrorism and waging war on non-combatants."

So as this shows, Harry changes his stance on issues at least as often as Kerry. It is in the record that he does.

Basically, Harry talks out of his ass, much as one of his Hollywood idols Jim Carrey does.

Harry eliminates any credibility he may have had with his blind, sheep-like allegiance to anything anti-conservative. A poor talent wasted (spewed) on a boating news-group. Too funny, but sad.

Jack



So why waste your time on him?

John H

On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!

See ya later, bye Jack Goof...

*ploink*

--
-Netsock

"It's just about going fast...that's all..."
http://home.insight.rr.com/cgreen/
"Jack Goff" wrote in message
...
In a current thread titled "( OT ) Where have you gone, Rosy Scenario?"

NOYB noted...

"Harry Krause" wrote:
I am no fan of contemporary or recent Arab/Moslem culture or history,
but there have been some significant contributors to the advancement of
our society.

You sure seem to have backed off your position from 2 years ago. Here's
what you had to say in April 2002:

"The reality is that for at least the last 100 years, the so-called Arab
states have contributed absolutely nothing to the furthering of society in
any field of endeavor and the only reason anyone tolerates their anti-social
behavior is because they happen to be sitting on oil. If it weren't for
their oil, no one would pay them the slightest attention.
Their contributions to the fields of medicine, other sciences, the arts,
socialization, you name it and there is nothing there. Oh...I
forgot...they're adept at cowardice, at furthering the methodology of
terrorism and waging war on non-combatants."

So as this shows, Harry changes his stance on issues at least as often as
Kerry. It is in the record that he does.

Basically, Harry talks out of his ass, much as one of his Hollywood idols
Jim Carrey does.

Harry eliminates any credibility he may have had with his blind, sheep-like
allegiance to anything anti-conservative. A poor talent wasted (spewed) on
a boating news-group. Too funny, but sad.

Jack

`
"Harry Krause" wrote in message
news:c3dhc2g=.0a933b45618db33526050a45bb48faab@108 5573887.nulluser.com...
John H wrote:

On Wed, 26 May 2004 05:14:44 GMT, "Jack Goff" wrote:

In a current thread titled "( OT ) Where have you gone, Rosy Scenario?"

NOYB noted...

"Harry Krause" wrote:
I am no fan of contemporary or recent Arab/Moslem culture or history,
but there have been some significant contributors to the advancement
of
our society.

You sure seem to have backed off your position from 2 years ago.
Here's
what you had to say in April 2002:

"The reality is that for at least the last 100 years, the so-called
Arab
states have contributed absolutely nothing to the furthering of
society in
any field of endeavor and the only reason anyone tolerates their
anti-social
behavior is because they happen to be sitting on oil. If it weren't for
their oil, no one would pay them the slightest attention.
Their contributions to the fields of medicine, other sciences, the
arts,
socialization, you name it and there is nothing there. Oh...I
forgot...they're adept at cowardice, at furthering the methodology of
terrorism and waging war on non-combatants."

So as this shows, Harry changes his stance on issues at least as
often as Kerry. It is in the record that he does.

Basically, Harry talks out of his ass, much as one of his Hollywood
idols Jim Carrey does.

Harry eliminates any credibility he may have had with his blind,
sheep-like allegiance to anything anti-conservative. A poor talent
wasted (spewed) on a boating news-group. Too funny, but sad.

Jack



So why waste your time on him?


John H



Jackoff, like most of the right-wing assholes who post here (and that
includes you) is obsessed with me. Jackoff and you and most of the rest
of the right-wing pond scum that pollute this newsgroup will try to deny
that fact, but the number and tone of the right-wing "response" to my
posts over the years make that face inescapable.

It is hard to dispute the facts, they are your own, so you lash out at the
person repeating them.

If people are obsessed with you by responding to your posts, it seems
obvious that you are obsessed by many many people. Karen of Oz, is
concerned about your stalker behavior and your obsession with her.


"Harry Krause" wrote in message
news:c3dhc2g=.0a933b45618db33526050a45bb48faab@108 5573887.nulluser.com...
Jackoff, like most of the right-wing assholes who post here (and that
includes you) is obsessed with me. Jackoff and you and most of the rest
of the right-wing pond scum that pollute this newsgroup will try to deny
that fact, but the number and tone of the right-wing "response" to my
posts over the years make that face inescapable.

"John Smith" wrote in message
news:yN0tc.26623$hi6.2769801@attbi_s53...
If people are obsessed with you by responding to your posts, it seems
obvious that you are obsessed by many many people. Karen of Oz, is
concerned about your stalker behavior and your obsession with her.


Yeah! Harry 's going to travel to the Land of OZ to stalk Karen. I'd
suggest most sane people would run the other way.

Only stupid people rigidly refuse to change as they learn.


"Jack Goff" wrote in message
...
In a current thread titled "( OT ) Where have you gone, Rosy Scenario?"

NOYB noted...

"Harry Krause" wrote:
I am no fan of contemporary or recent Arab/Moslem culture or history,
but there have been some significant contributors to the advancement of
our society.

You sure seem to have backed off your position from 2 years ago. Here's
what you had to say in April 2002:

"The reality is that for at least the last 100 years, the so-called Arab
states have contributed absolutely nothing to the furthering of society in
any field of endeavor and the only reason anyone tolerates their anti-social
behavior is because they happen to be sitting on oil. If it weren't for
their oil, no one would pay them the slightest attention.
Their contributions to the fields of medicine, other sciences, the arts,
socialization, you name it and there is nothing there. Oh...I
forgot...they're adept at cowardice, at furthering the methodology of
terrorism and waging war on non-combatants."

So as this shows, Harry changes his stance on issues at least as often as
Kerry. It is in the record that he does.

Basically, Harry talks out of his ass, much as one of his Hollywood idols
Jim Carrey does.

Harry eliminates any credibility he may have had with his blind, sheep-like
allegiance to anything anti-conservative. A poor talent wasted (spewed) on
a boating news-group. Too funny, but sad.

Jack

Don,
Grin, but using Harry's logic, he is extremely obsessed with NYOB, Bert;
Calif. Bill, John H., Jim-- etc. and most of all Bush.


"Don White" wrote in message
...

"John Smith" wrote in message
news:yN0tc.26623$hi6.2769801@attbi_s53...
If people are obsessed with you by responding to your posts, it seems
obvious that you are obsessed by many many people. Karen of Oz, is
concerned about your stalker behavior and your obsession with her.


Yeah! Harry 's going to travel to the Land of OZ to stalk Karen. I'd
suggest most sane people would run the other way.

Doug Kanter wrote:

Only stupid people rigidly refuse to change as they learn.

Excellent point. We all seem so quick to
roast this person or that for a shift of opinion on an issue, but I wonder how
many of us could honestly say that we
feel exactly the same way about everything today as we did two or three years
ago?

I'm not trying to defend Harry or any other individual, but speaking in
generalities....

Times change, the environment changes,
the economy and the specific major problems facing our society both change.
There are, I would have to guess, two possible approaches.

Approach A: "I'm either so fricking smart or have been told directly by a
divine Voice that the opinions I held at Point X in my life were holy writ, not
subject to change, and to reexamine my positions from time to time would be
tantamount to admitting that
either the divine I or the divine Voice could have been wrong. Won't happen."

Approach A would be similar to driving a 35 year old VW beetle because it was
once the perfect car for your needs.

Approach B: "The conditions to which I must respond in life are fluid, rather
than static. I must always be evaluating my opinons and beliefs in light of
changing conditions to be certain that they remain
appropriate. I must not be reluctant to abandon an opinion or a belief that
proves to be either untrue or an ineffective approach to solving a particular
problem"

Approach B is more likely to represent an inquisitive mind.

From a practical standpoint, one has to be ready to shift opinions about a
person, place, thing, or idea after one's own efforts result in change. For
example, would it be appropriate to feel exactly the same about
the Chinese today as we did 10-15 years ago? For a more contemporary example,
observe how our official US opinion of Saddam Hussein changed over a couple of
decades.

As I observed, most of us who are quick to
be critical of others for changing an opinion or a belief have a history of
doing so as well. I think that in many cases, and for the right reasons, it is
probably a healthy thing.

Ther *are* certain morals and ethics that will remain fairly constant in a
respectable life, although they won't be exactly identical among all
respectable people.