http://store.amagicmirror.com/usmajimawarv.html

The guy has his head on straight. The right wing will naysay him, but
he's a patriot, is pro-soldier, pro-army, anti-Iraq for all the right
reasons.

wrote in message

.....he's a patriot, is pro-soldier, pro-army, anti-Iraq for all the right
reasons.


....that may be debatable, but he's clearly a savvy entrepreneur.

Harry Krause wrote:
wrote:
http://store.amagicmirror.com/usmajimawarv.html

The guy has his head on straight. The right wing will naysay him, but
he's a patriot, is pro-soldier, pro-army, anti-Iraq for all the right
reasons.



I'm still enjoying the Eagles DVD from their Aussie appearance. It's
really first-rate and pretty much non-political. :}

I'm telling you, you would like the Peter Frampton DVD also!

John Gaquin wrote:
wrote in message

.....he's a patriot, is pro-soldier, pro-army, anti-Iraq for all the right
reasons.


...that may be debatable, but he's clearly a savvy entrepreneur.

Of course the right wingers would be against him. He doesn't goose step
to the furor Bush like the lemmings do.

John Gaquin wrote:
wrote in message

.....he's a patriot, is pro-soldier, pro-army, anti-Iraq for all the right
reasons.


...that may be debatable, but he's clearly a savvy entrepreneur.

Debate away then. Why would you say that he is not a patriot? On the
contrary:

Jimmy is a stalwart defender of the United States as defined by its
Constitution. The people of the United States have a right to
responsible government by elected officials who conduct the business of
the nation out in the open and not in closed hearings and back rooms.
He believes the people of the United States have a right to know what
is going on in Iraq and the price soldiers are paying to fight this
war.

Why would you say he is not pro soldier? On the contrary:

He believes soldiers have a right to serve in a military where the
Geneva Convention and Rules of Engagement are strictly interpreted and
enforced. He believes soldiers should be free from repeated "stop loss"
deployments to war zones. He supports the rights of vets to prompt,
state-of-the-art healthcare for injuries received during their time in
service. He believes, strongly, that current administration policy
regarding human rights abuse and torture, is putting soldiers and
American's abroad at greater risk.

Why would you say he is not pro army? On the contrary:

Jimmy Massey served in the US Marines for twelve years. Trained as
infantry, he was stationed in Parris Island as an infantry instructor
for three years, then moved on to recruiting duty, then was deployed to
serve as Staff Sergeant in Iraq in command of more than 35 men.
During his tour of duty in Iraq he and his troop killed approximately
30 unarmed civilians, including children.

Staff Sergeant Massey was unable to reconcile his training, US rhetoric
regarding the "liberation of Iraq", and traditional American values
with the orders he was given in Iraq. He refused to continue killing
and asked to be seen by a psychologist who sent him back stateside
immediately for treatment. Jimmy was ultimately granted an honorable
discharge and a diagnosis of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder

wrote in message

... Why would you say that he is not a patriot? On the
contrary:

Jimmy is a stalwart defender ... blah, blah, blah.....

yes, yes, yes... I read the article, too. I didn't say he *wasn't* any of
those things, I merely said they may be debatable, in contrast to the
obvious point that he is also entrepreneurial (or at least in bed with
someone who's entrepreneurial). I have no doubt he will sell thousands of
those CDs, even at the huge markup, because koolaid drinkers of the left are
every bit as dumb as those on the right when it comes to shelling out the
sheckels for anything that insults the opposition.

Talk is cheap.

His DVD's aint.

wrote in message
oups.com...
http://store.amagicmirror.com/usmajimawarv.html

The guy has his head on straight. The right wing will naysay him, but
he's a patriot, is pro-soldier, pro-army, anti-Iraq for all the right
reasons.


Is Jimmy Massey telling the truth about Iraq?
By Ron Harris
POST-DISPATCH WASHINGTON BUREAU
Saturday, Nov. 05 2005

WASHINGTON

For more than a year, former Marine Staff Sgt. Jimmy Massey has been telling
anybody who will listen about the atrocities that he and other Marines
committed in Iraq.

In scores of newspaper, magazine and broadcast stories, at a Canadian
immigration hearing and in numerous speeches across the country, Massey has
told how he and other Marines recklessly, sometimes intentionally, killed
dozens of innocent Iraqi civilians.

Among his claims:

Marines fired on and killed peaceful Iraqi protesters.

Americans shot a 4-year-old Iraqi girl in the head.

A tractor-trailer was filled with the bodies of civilian men, women and
children killed by American artillery.

Massey's claims have gained him celebrity. Last month, Massey's
book, "Kill, Kill, Kill," was released in France. His allegations have been
reported in nationwide publications such as USA Today, as well as numerous
broadcast reports. Earlier this year, he joined the anti-war bus tour of
Cindy
Sheehan, and he's spoken at Cornell and Syracuse universities, among others.

News organizations worldwide published or broadcast Massey's claims without
any
corroboration and in most cases without investigation. Outside of the
Marines,
almost no one has seriously questioned whether Massey, a 12-year veteran who
was honorably discharged, was telling the truth.

He wasn't.

Each of his claims is either demonstrably false or exaggerated - according
to
his fellow Marines, Massey's own admissions, and the five journalists who
were
embedded with Massey's unit, including a reporter and photographer from the
Post-Dispatch and reporters from The Associated Press and The Wall Street
Journal.

"Psychopathic killers"

Massey, 34, of Waynesville, N.C., was with the 3rd Battalion, 7th Marines
based
out of Twentynine Palms, Calif. The unit went to the Middle East in January
2003 and participated in the U.S. invasion of Iraq in March of that year.

Massey was discharged in December 2003, shortly after returning from Iraq
due
to depression and post-traumatic stress syndrome.

He began turning up in the press and on broadcasts last spring with stories
about military atrocities. Massey's primary thrust has been that Marines
from
his battalion - some of whom, he told a Minneapolis audience, were
"psychopathic killers" - recklessly shot and killed Iraqi civilians,
sometimes,
he said, upon orders from their commanders. During a hearing in Canada,
Massey
said, "We deliberately gunned down people who were civilians."

The Marine Corps investigated Massey's claims and said they were
"unsubstantiated."

From the beginning, Massey misled reporters.

In early interviews, he told how he had lost his job at a furniture store
because of his anti-war activities. But when asked about the incident in an
interview Oct. 19 with the Post-Dispatch, Massey said he had quit his job
but
never had felt pressure to leave.

"I left on good terms," he said.

He also backtracked from allegations he made in a May 2004 radio interview
and
elsewhere that he had seen a tractor-trailer filled with the bodies of Iraqi
civilians when Marines entered an Iraqi military prison outside Baghdad. He
said the Iraqis had been killed by American artillery.

He told listeners that the scene was so bad "that the plasma from the body
and
skin was decomposing and literally oozing out of the crevices of the
tractor-trailer bed."

He repeated the story in the Post-Dispatch interview. But when told that the
newspaper's photographs and eyewitness reports had identified the trailer
contents as all men, mostly in uniform, Massey admitted that he had never
seen
the bodies.

Instead, he said, he received his information from "intelligence reports."
When
asked if those reports were official documents, he answered, "No, that's
what
the other Marines told me."

Changing stories

The details of Massey's stories changed repeatedly.

For example, he almost always told his audiences and interviewers of an
event
he said he'd never forget: Marines in his unit shooting four civilian Iraqis
in
red Kia automobile.

In some accounts, Massey said Marines fired at the vehicle after it failed
to
stop at a checkpoint. In another version, he said the Marines stormed the
car.

Sometimes he said three of the men were killed immediately while the fourth
was
wounded and covered in blood; sometimes he said the fourth man was
"miraculously unscathed."

Sometimes he said the Marines left the three men on the side of the road to
die
without medical treatment while the fourth man exclaimed: "Why did you shoot
my
brother?" In other versions, he said the man made the statement as medical
personnel were attempting to treat the three other men, or as the survivor
sat
near the car, or to Massey personally.

There is no evidence that any of the versions occurred.

In another story that Massey often tells, he and other Marines in his
platoon
fired upon a group of innocent demonstrators shortly after they arrived in
Baghdad. Massey said that the demonstrators were protesting the Marines'
presence, holding signs in English and Arabic.

The Marines heard a shot, Massey said, and in panic began firing into the
demonstrators.

In some versions, the demonstrators were near a checkpoint. In other
versions,
they were outside a prison on a road about 200 meters away, or anywhere from
5
to 15 miles from Baghdad International Airport.

Massey told a version of the story before an immigration hearing in December
in
support of an American soldier trying to flee to Canada. Then, Massey said
he
and the Marines killed four of the demonstrators. In other interviews, he
said
the Marines shot at 10 demonstrators and killed all of them but one, whom he
let crawl away.

In interviews with more than a dozen Marines and journalists who were in the
military complex that morning, none can recall such an incident.

They say that during the first week to two weeks inside Baghdad, they never
saw
any protesters.

Ron Haviv, an independent photographer embedded with the unit, said he never
saw any protesters or demonstrators, with or without signs.

"Basically, the only people who were on the streets in the first week were
there to loot," said Haviv, who has covered conflicts across the globe,
including the first Gulf War, Haiti, Yugoslavia and Russia.

Lt. Kevin Shea, the commander of Massey's platoon, recalls that on the
morning
after they arrived, about 20 Iraqis from a nearby community did approach the
Marines to ask what was happening. Shea said that he had explained what the
Marines were doing and that the Iraqis had gone back to their homes.

Civilians shot

The Marine Corps readily admits that some of its men shot civilians, but not
intentionally, they said. The Post-Dispatch reported on the second day of
the
war that Marines in one battalion had mistakenly shot and killed members of
a
British-based television network while shooting at Iraqi attackers.

When Marines moved into Baghdad a month later, the Post-Dispatch reported
two
separate automobile-related incidents in which Marines from Massey's
battalion
inadvertently shot and wounded 12 civilians. All of the passengers survived
after treatment by medical personnel.

In a fourth incident, Maj. Dan Schmitt said, Marines shot "what we believe
to
be a non-combatant" because when the Marines raised their arms in a signal
to
stop, the vehicle continued moving quickly at them.

An Iraqi doctor who helped treat the wounded passengers told them that they
needed to use another hand signal because they one they were using indicated
solidarity, not stop.

But none of the five journalists who covered the battalion said they saw
reckless or indiscriminate shooting of civilians by Marines, as Massey has
claimed. Nor did any of the Marines or Navy corpsmen who served with Massey
and
were interviewed for this story.

One of the checkpoint shootings is apparently the basis for one of most
poignant recollections claimed by Massey in numerous speeches and
interviews:
The shooting of a 4-year-old girl in the head.

While touring with Sheehan in Montgomery, Ala., he told of seeing the girl's
body. "You can't take it back," he said, according to the local newspaper.

But in the interview with the Post-Dispatch, Massey admitted that he never
had
seen the girl.

"Lima Company was involved in a shooting at a checkpoint," he said. "My
platoon
was ordered to another area before the victims were removed from the car.
The
other Marines told me that a 4-year-old girl had killed."

Girls unharmed

No 4-year-old died in the incident or was even wounded, according to
witnesses
including a Post-Dispatch photographer at the scene who filed photos of the
incident that were published in the newspaper.

Two women and two girls were in the car that the Marines shot when it failed
to
stop at a checkpoint and continued to approach the Marines at high speed,
said
Maj. George Schreffler, then the commanding officer of Lima Company.
Schreffler
was there at the time.

Petty Officer Justin Purviance, who treated them, said the two women were
wounded but survived. The girls were unharmed, he said.

In other speeches, Massey has said he personally shot a 6-year-old child. In
some versions, the child was a boy; at other times, a girl.

"How is a 6-year-old child with a bullet in his head a terrorist, because
that
is the youngest I killed," Massey told a Cornell University audience in
March.
In a speech in April in Springfield, Vt., he said: "That's war: a 6-year-old
girl with a bullet hole in her head at an American checkpoint."

In a speech in Syracuse in March, the Post Standard newspaper quoted him as
saying, "The reason the Marines teach you discipline . . . is so that you
can
confront the enemy and kill him. . . . Or so you can put a bullet into a
6-year-old, which is what I did. "

In the interview with the Post-Dispatch, Massey said he never personally had
shot a child.

"I meant that's what my unit did," he said.

He could not provide details.

Nor could he name any Marine who could corroborate any of his stories.

"Admitting guilt is a hard thing to do," he said.

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/ema...2570B00067A5B7

John Gaquin wrote:
wrote in message

... Why would you say that he is not a patriot? On the
contrary:

Jimmy is a stalwart defender ... blah, blah, blah.....

yes, yes, yes... I read the article, too. I didn't say he *wasn't* any of
those things, I merely said they may be debatable, in contrast to the
obvious point that he is also entrepreneurial (or at least in bed with
someone who's entrepreneurial). I have no doubt he will sell thousands of
those CDs, even at the huge markup, because koolaid drinkers of the left are
every bit as dumb as those on the right when it comes to shelling out the
sheckels for anything that insults the opposition.

You sound just like Hannity!!!! If you have no facts to base your
opinions on, if you have nothing, but still want to make someone look
bad, you simply do just exactly what you are dissing the other person
for!!!

wrote in message

You sound just like Hannity!!!! If you have no facts to base your
opinions on, if you have nothing, but still want to make someone look
bad, you simply do just exactly what you are dissing the other person
for!!!

Neither you nor I have any idea what you're talking about.