In another thread people were talking about the benefits of oil additives.
I have always been leery of these "Miracle Additives" ever since Slick 50
was shown to actually damage engines. This was especially bad news for me,
since I used Slick 50 in my new boat, thinking it would reduce wear when the
engine was started after sitting for a few weeks, or over the winter.

Here is what "Landline" (a magazine for professional truckers) says:

"I researched professional journals on lubrication and spoke with my
contacts at The Technology and Maintenance Council (TMC) from the oil
companies, engine manufacturers and wholesale oil additive chemical
suppliers, companies like Lubrizol and Exxon-Mobil. They sell the component
chemicals that oil refiners put into their oils.
They were unanimous in their opinions: Truck operators should not put
anything in their oil. Oil is a delicate balance of about 30 percent to 35
percent additives blended under controlled conditions and proprietary
processes with selected base stocks of mineral or synthetic oil. Having too
much of any particular additive could reduce the benefits of other
additives, and if an aftermarket additive is not compatible with a component
or refiner's oil, the additive could damage the engine."

What do the additive suppliers say?


Typical comments a "The oil companies don't want our products used
because it would cut their sales volume by at least 10 to 20 percent (mix
ratios) and probably more because we make oil last longer," and "We have a
breakthrough product, and the establishment testing hasn't caught up with
our performance."

Many rely on anecdotal evidence, not controlled tests. Some refer to "a
prestigious university" or "a well-known testing laboratory," but rarely
identify which ones. Many that are identified are outside the United States.
I still haven't seen evidence from any manufacturer with properly documented
tests.

Normally, when test results are published, verifiable reports give the
location and dates of testing, names of personnel conducting the tests, a
description of test procedures if new, or a list of established test
protocols developed through the scientific process (reaching consensus and
addressing all objections) by ASTM, SAE, API and other recognized technical
organizations"

and finally a conclusion:

"Can we reach a conclusion?
This is one of those questions drivers argue about now and will argue about
for decades to come. I've heard owner-operators swear by the oil they use,
most often Rotella-T, Delo 400, Delvac 1300 or Delvac 1. I then hear those
same drivers rave about the good that Lucas or some other additive does.

Well, which is it? Is the oil good, but only with the additive? And what
does "good" mean? How is oil performance really determined? Engines and oils
have improved in the past decade, and we have 10-year-old engines that have
gone a million miles or more with extended oil-drain intervals.

My own personal opinion is that if it were my truck, I'd pick one oil based
on its reputation and use it for the life of the engine without any oil
additives. One of the oils I'd consider would be Lucas. LL Paul Abelson can
be reached at ."

So it would appear that if any of the additives are any good, Lucas just
might be a good one.

What sold me on NOT using Lucas is their web site. They did not show any
test results, they based all of their success on Testimonials. I am leery
of Testimonials.

from: http://www.landlinemag.com/Archives/...t/maint_qa.htm

What sold me on NOT using Lucas is their web site. They did not show
any
test results, they based all of their success on Testimonials. I am
leery
of Testimonials.


I've used Lucas, and I imagine it's as good as anything els.

I've run straight oils and think they're about as good as anything else
too.

I really haven't seen any evidence that shows oil additives have really
helped performance, engine longivity, , or economy, on anything.

If additives "might" help, but didn't hurt, I would think about them as a
lost cost insurance. The problem is, the more I look into it, the more I
see where it could hurt, and one additive might help with one oil blend and
actually hurt with another oil blend.

It seems that is a can of worms, I prefer to stay away from.


wrote in message
oups.com...
What sold me on NOT using Lucas is their web site. They did not show
any
test results, they based all of their success on Testimonials. I am
leery
of Testimonials.


I've used Lucas, and I imagine it's as good as anything els.

I've run straight oils and think they're about as good as anything else
too.

I really haven't seen any evidence that shows oil additives have really
helped performance, engine longivity, , or economy, on anything.

Tom,
Normally in the 3,000 - 4,000 range.


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 13:57:27 -0500, "Wm Shakespeare Smithers" The
WordSmith wrote:

If additives "might" help, but didn't hurt, I would think about them as a
lost cost insurance. The problem is, the more I look into it, the more I
see where it could hurt, and one additive might help with one oil blend
and
actually hurt with another oil blend.

It seems that is a can of worms, I prefer to stay away from.

How often do you change your oil?

Tom,

As I said, if I thought the additives were harmless, I might use some of the
additives and as inexpensive insurance. But, I don't change my oil every
3,000 miles because
of the recommendations of the oil companies or mechanics who profit from me
changing my oil every 3000 miles. I change my oil every 3000 miles because
of the recommendations of the auto manufacturers, and ALL auto experts I can
find recommend changing the oil every 3000 miles, and these experts do not
profit from me changing my oil every 3000 miles. I have had some friends
who are mechanical engineers who told me they always change their oil every
3000 miles. I had one who used Mobil 1, and he said he always changed the
filter every 3000 miles, even though he would go 12-15,000 between oil
changes. I understand they now make filters that are supposed to last the
full 15 m miles, but this was 10 yrs ago.

I typed in "how often should I change my oil" in Google, universally, unless
you drive in ideal conditions, which I do not, all of the experts (who do
not
profit from my oil change in any manner) agree that it is best to change
your
oil every 3000 miles ". As Yahoo Auto stated: " if frequent short trips
(less than 10 miles, especially during cold weather), stop-and-go city
traffic driving, driving in dusty conditions (gravel roads, etc.), and
driving at sustained highway speeds during hot weather. For this type of
driving, which is actually "severe service: driving, the recommendation is
to change the oil every 3,000 miles or six months."

So I might be getting fooled and suckered, because heck what do I know, but
I look at it as inexpensive insurance.

How often do you change your oil?



"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 15:42:41 -0500, "Wm Shakespeare Smithers" The
WordSmith wrote:

Tom,
Normally in the 3,000 - 4,000 range.

So you are suspicious of claims of oil additives, but buy into the oil
company hype about 3,000 mile oil changes.

Interesting.

Later,

Tom

Wow, I had to check how often I replace my fuel filter. I think it is every
30,000 miles.

After you mentioned that I checked on it, and it looks like the experts
recommend changing it 12,000 miles or once a year.

From memory you have some very old cars, so you must be doing something
right.

I have two cars w/ 50,000 miles and the dealer and Firestone recommended
changing brake fluids and steering fluids. I don't remember doing this in
the past, but when I checked it seems that this is considered very prudent.

As I said, I want to drive these cars as long as possible, so I can trying
to keep up with the maintenance.


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 16:52:14 -0500, "Wm Shakespeare Smithers" The
WordSmith wrote:

How often do you change your oil?

About 10K or so, oil, filter, fuel filter.

"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 16:52:14 -0500, "Wm Shakespeare Smithers" The
WordSmith wrote:

How often do you change your oil?

About 10K or so, oil, filter, fuel filter.

I keep it at 6k miles or so on all our cars.

I also change the oil and filter on the boat engine every fall. I would
change it more often if I put on more than the 50-80 hours/season I put on
the boat. We only used our larger boats for general cruising, mainly to
beaches for swimming.

This year may be different as the boat we now own is smaller and will be
conducive to fishing once I replace the helm seat. It is also small enough
that I can comfortably take it out by myself.

I will change the oil on the boat at 100 hours (and again at haul out)
when/if I reach that number this year.

PS - I change the oil and fuel filter on my boat engine which is a 5.7 liter
every 50 hrs or once a year, when I winterize the engine. I normally will
change the impeller and every other year. I check the outdrive fluid to
make sure it is not milky and then top it off. Every other year I change
the fluid in the outdrive.

Do you see any drastic mistakes I am doing with the boat?


"Smithers" Yes, Smithers is not my real name. wrote in message
...
Wow, I had to check how often I replace my fuel filter. I think it is
every 30,000 miles.

After you mentioned that I checked on it, and it looks like the experts
recommend changing it 12,000 miles or once a year.

From memory you have some very old cars, so you must be doing something
right.

I have two cars w/ 50,000 miles and the dealer and Firestone recommended
changing brake fluids and steering fluids. I don't remember doing this in
the past, but when I checked it seems that this is considered very
prudent.

As I said, I want to drive these cars as long as possible, so I can trying
to keep up with the maintenance.


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 16:52:14 -0500, "Wm Shakespeare Smithers" The
WordSmith wrote:

How often do you change your oil?

About 10K or so, oil, filter, fuel filter.

"Smithers" Yes, Smithers is not my real name. wrote in message
. ..
PS - I change the oil and fuel filter on my boat engine which is a 5.7
liter every 50 hrs or once a year, when I winterize the engine. I
normally will change the impeller and every other year. I check the
outdrive fluid to make sure it is not milky and then top it off. Every
other year I change the fluid in the outdrive.

Do you see any drastic mistakes I am doing with the boat?


Yes. You should be changing the outdrive oil at the end of every season and
checking the condition of the oil you removed. If not, and water got past a
defective seal and into the oil you could face a big problem come spring.

It is easy to do and cheap insurance.

Wm Shakespeare Smithers wrote:
Tom,

As I said, if I thought the additives were harmless, I might use some of the
additives and as inexpensive insurance. But, I don't change my oil every
3,000 miles because
of the recommendations of the oil companies or mechanics who profit from me
changing my oil every 3000 miles. I change my oil every 3000 miles because
of the recommendations of the auto manufacturers, and ALL auto experts I can
find recommend changing the oil every 3000 miles, and these experts do not
profit from me changing my oil every 3000 miles. I have had some friends
who are mechanical engineers who told me they always change their oil every
3000 miles. I had one who used Mobil 1, and he said he always changed the
filter every 3000 miles, even though he would go 12-15,000 between oil
changes. I understand they now make filters that are supposed to last the
full 15 m miles, but this was 10 yrs ago.

I typed in "how often should I change my oil" in Google, universally, unless
you drive in ideal conditions, which I do not, all of the experts (who do
not
profit from my oil change in any manner) agree that it is best to change
your
oil every 3000 miles ". As Yahoo Auto stated: " if frequent short trips
(less than 10 miles, especially during cold weather), stop-and-go city
traffic driving, driving in dusty conditions (gravel roads, etc.), and
driving at sustained highway speeds during hot weather. For this type of
driving, which is actually "severe service: driving, the recommendation is
to change the oil every 3,000 miles or six months."

So I might be getting fooled and suckered, because heck what do I know, but
I look at it as inexpensive insurance.

How often do you change your oil?


When the indicator light, or the mileage indicator in the other car,
show it's time to take it in. Usually 12K-14K miles.

Dan