On Wed, 03 May 2006 14:11:52 -0400, thunder wrote:

On Wed, 03 May 2006 13:49:00 +0000, Don White wrote:


There has to be a way for developed countries to prosper without
constantly growing the population. Otherwise...where will it all end? What
happens when there are 20 billion people on the planet?

Prospering is one thing, having a "growing" economy is another. People
can grow quite fat in a stable economy, but our leaders are judged on job
creation and other growth factors. More importantly, this country has
been living beyond it's means. Deficits have to be "grown" out of.
Social Security needs young blood to cover old farts like myself. We
either begin to breed like rabbits, or . . . It's immigration.

Again, you seem to see no difference in the illegal vs legal immigration.
That's why your argument is inane.
--
'Til next time,

John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 03 May 2006 18:03:52 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:


"JohnH" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 03 May 2006 17:22:14 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
m...

I think John cannot imagine a situation where people might have kids
when
they were doing OK financially, but ended up in a lousy position
afterward
for any of a number of embarrassingly obvious reasons.


If you'll check, you'll see that the focus of my posts has been on
illegal
immigration, and it's affect on the low end of the pay scale.

I've made no mention of the dot com guy that lost his $100,000 a
year
job.
Totally different circumstances

John H

How about a less extreme example?


Maybe you should clarify your example. I referred to a person with no
education. How much did your uneducated person B make in his first
job,
the
one he held while making the babies?

There is some income level below which YOU (and NOYB) will say they had
no
business having kids. I don't know the specific number. You choose.


Well, your $5.50/hour example is a good starting point!


No it's not. You have a higher number in your head. I won't continue until
you pin down the real number, and 5.50 isn't it.


I have no number in my head. If a man and a woman can't provide for the
family at better than the level you call 'poverty', then they shouldn't be
making babies.

There's something wrong when the rationale goes, "Hey, let's make another
baby, and then we can get money from the government."
--
'Til next time,

John H

I wasn't aware of the "make money with babies" syndrome. You're a great
teacher.

On Wed, 03 May 2006 08:42:14 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

Doug Kanter wrote:
"JohnH" wrote in message
...

I forgot to include an important piece of this puzzle. Person B's spouse
works almost as many hours, so the kids are in day care a lot. Unless you
want your kids in a **** hole of a day care center, do you have any idea
what it costs?

You mean to tell me that person B, (legal or illegal), has no education,
is
working 90 hours/week, making $5.55 hr, is producing babies on top of it?

Am I supposed to feel sorry for stupidity?

Did person B work Monday, or was he out marching to get more illegals into
the country?
John H


Ah....the recorded response.




There are many people in this country who just have no understanding of
or compassion for the plight of the working poor, and don't want any.
It's always been that way and it always will be. I used to have
compassion for the stupidity of these arrogant, unfeeling nincompoops,
but no more.

You know any people like that, Doug? I've known a few, but none are
among my friends or people with whom I would socialize, even informally.



It would appear that anyone in favor of illegal immigration or amnesty has
no compassion for the plight of the working poor.

Speaking of compassion....a donation to the Koman Breast Cancer Foundation
would probably be of great benefit to the working poor who get diagnosed
with breast cancer.

As I'm sure you're reading this thread, and as you've said nothing one way
or the other, I'll mention again...I'll triple the donation you make
through:

http://www.active.com/donate/varace4cure/RacingforRenee

--
'Til next time,

John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

On Wed, 03 May 2006 18:30:42 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 03 May 2006 18:03:52 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:


"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 03 May 2006 17:22:14 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
om...

I think John cannot imagine a situation where people might have kids
when
they were doing OK financially, but ended up in a lousy position
afterward
for any of a number of embarrassingly obvious reasons.


If you'll check, you'll see that the focus of my posts has been on
illegal
immigration, and it's affect on the low end of the pay scale.

I've made no mention of the dot com guy that lost his $100,000 a
year
job.
Totally different circumstances

John H

How about a less extreme example?


Maybe you should clarify your example. I referred to a person with no
education. How much did your uneducated person B make in his first
job,
the
one he held while making the babies?

There is some income level below which YOU (and NOYB) will say they had
no
business having kids. I don't know the specific number. You choose.


Well, your $5.50/hour example is a good starting point!


No it's not. You have a higher number in your head. I won't continue until
you pin down the real number, and 5.50 isn't it.


I have no number in my head. If a man and a woman can't provide for the
family at better than the level you call 'poverty', then they shouldn't be
making babies.

There's something wrong when the rationale goes, "Hey, let's make another
baby, and then we can get money from the government."
--
'Til next time,

John H

I wasn't aware of the "make money with babies" syndrome. You're a great
teacher.


Try this: http://www.lawhelp.org/documents/124...ateabbrev=/HI/


Around here it seems to be the big thing. About 70% of the babies born
downtown are born out of wedlock.


--
'Til next time,

John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 03 May 2006 18:30:42 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 03 May 2006 18:03:52 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:


"JohnH" wrote in message
m...
On Wed, 03 May 2006 17:22:14 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
news:i1ph52tfk6di0245vf6t29rovthd3tvsn7@4ax. com...

I think John cannot imagine a situation where people might have
kids
when
they were doing OK financially, but ended up in a lousy position
afterward
for any of a number of embarrassingly obvious reasons.


If you'll check, you'll see that the focus of my posts has been on
illegal
immigration, and it's affect on the low end of the pay scale.

I've made no mention of the dot com guy that lost his $100,000 a
year
job.
Totally different circumstances

John H

How about a less extreme example?


Maybe you should clarify your example. I referred to a person with
no
education. How much did your uneducated person B make in his first
job,
the
one he held while making the babies?

There is some income level below which YOU (and NOYB) will say they
had
no
business having kids. I don't know the specific number. You choose.


Well, your $5.50/hour example is a good starting point!


No it's not. You have a higher number in your head. I won't continue
until
you pin down the real number, and 5.50 isn't it.


I have no number in my head. If a man and a woman can't provide for the
family at better than the level you call 'poverty', then they shouldn't
be
making babies.

There's something wrong when the rationale goes, "Hey, let's make
another
baby, and then we can get money from the government."
--
'Til next time,

John H

I wasn't aware of the "make money with babies" syndrome. You're a great
teacher.


Try this: http://www.lawhelp.org/documents/124...ateabbrev=/HI/


Around here it seems to be the big thing. About 70% of the babies born
downtown are born out of wedlock.
John H

So many extremes in our society! Unbelievable.

On Wed, 03 May 2006 14:27:21 -0400, JohnH wrote:


There's something wrong when the rationale goes, "Hey, let's make another
baby, and then we can get money from the government." --
'Til next time,

Geez John, you are a little out of date. AFDC was ended nearly ten years
ago.

On Wed, 03 May 2006 14:28:52 -0400, JohnH wrote:


Again, you seem to see no difference in the illegal vs legal immigration.
That's why your argument is inane.

You seem to be the one hung up on a paper difference. Let me make it
simple for you. We need workers. If the illegals stopped coming, we
would simply increase the legal quotas. Cry all you want about illegal
immigration, Washington isn't listening. They know, we need the workers.

On Wed, 03 May 2006 14:43:33 -0400, JohnH wrote:



Try this: http://www.lawhelp.org/documents/124...ateabbrev=/HI/


Try this: http://www.cbpp.org/1-22-02tanf2.htm

"thunder" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 03 May 2006 14:28:52 -0400, JohnH wrote:


Again, you seem to see no difference in the illegal vs legal immigration.
That's why your argument is inane.

You seem to be the one hung up on a paper difference. Let me make it
simple for you. We need workers. If the illegals stopped coming, we
would simply increase the legal quotas. Cry all you want about illegal
immigration, Washington isn't listening. They know, we need the workers.


We just don't want them living too close by where we can see them.

On Wed, 03 May 2006 14:53:30 -0400, thunder wrote:

On Wed, 03 May 2006 14:27:21 -0400, JohnH wrote:


There's something wrong when the rationale goes, "Hey, let's make another
baby, and then we can get money from the government." --
'Til next time,

Geez John, you are a little out of date. AFDC was ended nearly ten years
ago.

Yeah, the 2005 caseload seems to so indicate!

http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/ofa/...eloadindex.htm


--
'Til next time,

John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************