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#1
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Hello,
I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick |
#2
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I wanted to say bad gas but now I'm thinking bad coil.
"Patrick Johnson" wrote in message ... Hello, I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick |
#3
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It sounds like a fuel pump or related problem. Unlike an automotive pump,
the marine varient will only pump gas when there is oil pressure, or the engine is cranking. So I'm guessing it's either a bad pump, low oil pressure, or a bad oil pressure sending unit (check for loose connections there too). --Mike "Patrick Johnson" wrote in message ... Hello, I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick |
#4
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posted to rec.boats
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It's a carburated engine so it probably has a mechanical fuel pump.
"MGG" wrote in message et... It sounds like a fuel pump or related problem. Unlike an automotive pump, the marine varient will only pump gas when there is oil pressure, or the engine is cranking. So I'm guessing it's either a bad pump, low oil pressure, or a bad oil pressure sending unit (check for loose connections there too). --Mike "Patrick Johnson" wrote in message ... Hello, I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick |
#5
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posted to rec.boats
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It's a carburated engine so it probably has a mechanical fuel pump.
Nope, I had the same engine on my previous boat. --Mike "James" wrote in message ink.net... It's a carburated engine so it probably has a mechanical fuel pump. "MGG" wrote in message et... It sounds like a fuel pump or related problem. Unlike an automotive pump, the marine varient will only pump gas when there is oil pressure, or the engine is cranking. So I'm guessing it's either a bad pump, low oil pressure, or a bad oil pressure sending unit (check for loose connections there too). --Mike "Patrick Johnson" wrote in message ... Hello, I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick |
#6
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posted to rec.boats
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After re-building the engine a couple of years ago, my eyes are always on
the oil pressure gauge (paranoid?) I have yet to see it show anything abnormal. There isn't much to the electrical system. All connections are tight. I do see relay next to the fuel pump but that's it. So oil pressure and a crank signal from the switch are what activates the fuel pump? I wonder if this relay could be bad. A new fuel pump is expensive so I am hoping to look at simpler, cheaper things to fix first. "MGG" wrote in message et... It sounds like a fuel pump or related problem. Unlike an automotive pump, the marine varient will only pump gas when there is oil pressure, or the engine is cranking. So I'm guessing it's either a bad pump, low oil pressure, or a bad oil pressure sending unit (check for loose connections there too). --Mike "Patrick Johnson" wrote in message ... Hello, I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick |
#7
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posted to rec.boats
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So oil pressure
and a crank signal from the switch are what activates the fuel pump? I wonder if this relay could be bad. A new fuel pump is expensive so I am hoping to look at simpler, cheaper things to fix first. It could be the relay. For sure, check the cheaper items first. I did have to replace my fuel pump after about 120 hours, and you're right, the marine pump aint cheap. ![]() --Mike "Patrick Johnson" wrote in message news ![]() After re-building the engine a couple of years ago, my eyes are always on the oil pressure gauge (paranoid?) I have yet to see it show anything abnormal. There isn't much to the electrical system. All connections are tight. I do see relay next to the fuel pump but that's it. So oil pressure and a crank signal from the switch are what activates the fuel pump? I wonder if this relay could be bad. A new fuel pump is expensive so I am hoping to look at simpler, cheaper things to fix first. "MGG" wrote in message et... It sounds like a fuel pump or related problem. Unlike an automotive pump, the marine varient will only pump gas when there is oil pressure, or the engine is cranking. So I'm guessing it's either a bad pump, low oil pressure, or a bad oil pressure sending unit (check for loose connections there too). --Mike "Patrick Johnson" wrote in message ... Hello, I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick |
#8
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posted to rec.boats
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"Patrick Johnson" wrote in
news ![]() After re-building the engine a couple of years ago, my eyes are always on the oil pressure gauge (paranoid?) I have yet to see it show anything abnormal. There isn't much to the electrical system. All connections are tight. I do see relay next to the fuel pump but that's it. So oil pressure and a crank signal from the switch are what activates the fuel pump? I wonder if this relay could be bad. A new fuel pump is expensive so I am hoping to look at simpler, cheaper things to fix first. "MGG" wrote in message et... It sounds like a fuel pump or related problem. Unlike an automotive pump, the marine varient will only pump gas when there is oil pressure, or the engine is cranking. So I'm guessing it's either a bad pump, low oil pressure, or a bad oil pressure sending unit (check for loose connections there too). --Mike "Patrick Johnson" wrote in message ... Hello, I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick THIS IS LONG, BUT THESE ARE YOUR CORRECT ANSWERS, BASED ON ACTUAL KNOWLEDGE AND EXPERIENCE: I have that same engine and the same problem. You have an electric fuel pump. It does NOT operate off the oil presure. Instead there is green wire running off the alternator that allows the relay to close when running. By the way, if you lose the alternator belt, you lose the fuel pump because of this, but more on that later. There is another wire from a 6amp circuit breaker that is hot only when cranking. CHECK THE RELAY AND ITS CONNECTIONS. It is very likely your problem. The relay plugs in a socket. That socket can get dirty/coroded. I was having the same problem. Everytime it occured, I would pull the relay and tap on it (to dislodge anY internal carbon build up) and it would work for a few days, and then problem returned again. I assumed the problem was the relay and that tapping on it fixed it. Today, I replaced the relay ($20) and the problem continued intermitently). I then cleaned the connections and put some dielectric grease in there and the problem seems solved, for now anyway. Also check the plastic push-on connector near the fuel pump itself for the same issues. It has a wire lock, that if you push in, allows you to release the connector. Also, there is a connector on top of the fuel pump. It's hard to notice because its the same color as the fuel pump and looks like it's part of the fuel pump. It's a horseshoe shaped piece of metal with wires going into it that pushes into the top of the fuel pump. You can pull that off gently by rocking it and you will see that on each end of the horseshoe, at right angles to the to the horseshoe is a metal push on connector that goes into two holes on top of the fuel pump. I've had this come lose before, so check and make sure it's tight. Lastly, there is an wiring addition that you can make that will help you immensly. Its saved me the other day from having to be towed in. Wire a momentary switch (so it can't be inadvertantly left on) on the dash to any hot wire under the dash. Run a wire off the other side of the switch to the fuel pump relay and splice it into the green wire with one of those plastic splices. Make everything nice and neat with wire ties, electrical tape, etc. Having this switch will allow you to do three very important things. First, if the boat has been sitting a long time and there is no fuel in the carburator, you can use the switch to prime the carburator (basically fill the float bowl). That's the reason I put the switch in originally. I burnt out a started try to get fuel into the engine after it had been sitting. It seems that even though the fuel pump is supposed to be activated on craking, it took too long (while cranking) to actually get the fuel in there. Now I just push the button for a few seconds and the engine starts first time everytime, even if it's been months in the driveway. Second, you can use the switch to test the fuel pump and the relay before you go out. When you press the switch you can hear the relay click. But, if everything's OK, you can also hear the whine of the fuel pump itself. If you don't hear the fuel pump, you have a problem. You don't have to wait unit the boat is floating away from the ramp. The way I knew there was something wrong in my circuit somewhere is that I could hear the relay click, but no fuel pump. In my case, pulling the relay and reinserting seemed to help, but only for a few days. Third, a relay override switch can get you home if the alternator belt goes. I was running at high speed and my alternator belt shred and I didn't have a spare (I do now). I thought no problem. I don't need an alternator to get back to the dock, my battery is strong and should be enough to power the ignition and fuel pump to get me home (just a couple of miles). Well it was, but the problem was that without the alternator, the fuel pump relay was not hot, and thus no fuel, and the engine died. No problem, I remembered my fuel pump relay override switch. I just put my finger on the button the whole way back to the dock and everything ran great. Replaced the belt the next day (and bought a spare) and I was right out on the lake again. Hope this helps. |
#9
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Great post. Apparently I was mistaken about the oil pressure. The important
thing to know, is that the fuel pump will not operate unless the engine is running (turning the altenator). --Mike "akheel" wrote in message ... "Patrick Johnson" wrote in news ![]() After re-building the engine a couple of years ago, my eyes are always on the oil pressure gauge (paranoid?) I have yet to see it show anything abnormal. There isn't much to the electrical system. All connections are tight. I do see relay next to the fuel pump but that's it. So oil pressure and a crank signal from the switch are what activates the fuel pump? I wonder if this relay could be bad. A new fuel pump is expensive so I am hoping to look at simpler, cheaper things to fix first. "MGG" wrote in message et... It sounds like a fuel pump or related problem. Unlike an automotive pump, the marine varient will only pump gas when there is oil pressure, or the engine is cranking. So I'm guessing it's either a bad pump, low oil pressure, or a bad oil pressure sending unit (check for loose connections there too). --Mike "Patrick Johnson" wrote in message ... Hello, I have a 4.3L Volvo (Chevy) motor in a 1998 Larson ski boat. This motor has the 'upgraded' 4bbl carb. from the factory. Last year the engine ran great. I have had it out 4 or 5 times this year and have noticed a problem that gets worse every time I take it out. During the first trip I noticed on two occasions, the engine cut-out for a fraction of a second when I accelerated from a stop. It did this a little more often on the second and third trip. On the 4th trip out, it started cutting-out completely for a second or two while cruising. During the 5th and latest trip, it would cut-out and quit completely. It would take a couple of tries to get it restarted. At first it would only cut-out during acceleration, but now it will cut-out either at idle or during cruising. It will run great until this happens, and it gives no warning. It will run fine for 10 - 30 minutes after I launch it before it starts this problem. Once it cuts out for the first time, it usually keeps happening fairly constantly thereafter, but runs great until then. I thought it may have been a problem in the ignition system, so I replaced the module, distributor cap, and rotor since there was signs of corrosion on them. The ignition coil looked fine so I left it alone. This didn't fix the problem though. Someone suggested the fuel filter/water separator may be clogged so I replaced it with no change. I checked all of the wiring to make sure nothing was loose. I know that it can go over rough water just find without cutting off...and will cut-off when idling in calm water. Therefore, a loose wire doesn't seem like the problem. The problem is definitely intermittent as I have not felt any decrease in performance. Any ideas/suggestions will be greatly appreciated!!! Patrick THIS IS LONG, BUT THESE ARE YOUR CORRECT ANSWERS, BASED ON ACTUAL KNOWLEDGE AND EXPERIENCE: I have that same engine and the same problem. You have an electric fuel pump. It does NOT operate off the oil presure. Instead there is green wire running off the alternator that allows the relay to close when running. By the way, if you lose the alternator belt, you lose the fuel pump because of this, but more on that later. There is another wire from a 6amp circuit breaker that is hot only when cranking. CHECK THE RELAY AND ITS CONNECTIONS. It is very likely your problem. The relay plugs in a socket. That socket can get dirty/coroded. I was having the same problem. Everytime it occured, I would pull the relay and tap on it (to dislodge anY internal carbon build up) and it would work for a few days, and then problem returned again. I assumed the problem was the relay and that tapping on it fixed it. Today, I replaced the relay ($20) and the problem continued intermitently). I then cleaned the connections and put some dielectric grease in there and the problem seems solved, for now anyway. Also check the plastic push-on connector near the fuel pump itself for the same issues. It has a wire lock, that if you push in, allows you to release the connector. Also, there is a connector on top of the fuel pump. It's hard to notice because its the same color as the fuel pump and looks like it's part of the fuel pump. It's a horseshoe shaped piece of metal with wires going into it that pushes into the top of the fuel pump. You can pull that off gently by rocking it and you will see that on each end of the horseshoe, at right angles to the to the horseshoe is a metal push on connector that goes into two holes on top of the fuel pump. I've had this come lose before, so check and make sure it's tight. Lastly, there is an wiring addition that you can make that will help you immensly. Its saved me the other day from having to be towed in. Wire a momentary switch (so it can't be inadvertantly left on) on the dash to any hot wire under the dash. Run a wire off the other side of the switch to the fuel pump relay and splice it into the green wire with one of those plastic splices. Make everything nice and neat with wire ties, electrical tape, etc. Having this switch will allow you to do three very important things. First, if the boat has been sitting a long time and there is no fuel in the carburator, you can use the switch to prime the carburator (basically fill the float bowl). That's the reason I put the switch in originally. I burnt out a started try to get fuel into the engine after it had been sitting. It seems that even though the fuel pump is supposed to be activated on craking, it took too long (while cranking) to actually get the fuel in there. Now I just push the button for a few seconds and the engine starts first time everytime, even if it's been months in the driveway. Second, you can use the switch to test the fuel pump and the relay before you go out. When you press the switch you can hear the relay click. But, if everything's OK, you can also hear the whine of the fuel pump itself. If you don't hear the fuel pump, you have a problem. You don't have to wait unit the boat is floating away from the ramp. The way I knew there was something wrong in my circuit somewhere is that I could hear the relay click, but no fuel pump. In my case, pulling the relay and reinserting seemed to help, but only for a few days. Third, a relay override switch can get you home if the alternator belt goes. I was running at high speed and my alternator belt shred and I didn't have a spare (I do now). I thought no problem. I don't need an alternator to get back to the dock, my battery is strong and should be enough to power the ignition and fuel pump to get me home (just a couple of miles). Well it was, but the problem was that without the alternator, the fuel pump relay was not hot, and thus no fuel, and the engine died. No problem, I remembered my fuel pump relay override switch. I just put my finger on the button the whole way back to the dock and everything ran great. Replaced the belt the next day (and bought a spare) and I was right out on the lake again. Hope this helps. |
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